Does God needs people to defend HIM?

[Shamraz_Khan]

In light of recent massacres by Islamist radicals Reza Aslan twitted this:

How weak must your faith in God be if you think God needs you to defend Him, you irrelevant little man?

If God is so powerful and controls everything why must you kill others in his name? Is God not capable of taking care of those who are disbelievers or making fun of him and his prophets?

What/who gives you the right to kill anyone? Is God not powerful enough to deal with his own creation?

Here is another example…

Blasphemy accused killed after release - Pakistan - DAWN.COM

TAXILA: A blasphemy accused freed a few days ago was shot dead here on Wednesday.

Police said it appeared to be a case of target killing.

The man, identified as 52-year-old Aabid Mehmood alias Aabid Kazzab, owned a hotel and lived in Kamra village. He reportedly had claimed ‘prophethood’ in October 2011 and a case was registered against him under Section 295-C of CrPC on a complaint lodged by his son-in-law Sadaqat Ali.

Also read: Policeman wounds British man jailed for blasphemy in Rawalpindi

Aabid was sent to jail after his mental condition had been examined by a board of doctors at the Rawalpindi District Headquarters Hospital. He was released from Adiyala jail after about two years because of his mental and physical condition.

On Tuesday, some masked men took him from his house in Ahatta area and his bullet-riddled body was found on Wednesday in deserted area near Usman Khattar Railway Station. He had been shot in the chest and head from a close range.

Police shifted the body to the Tehsil Headquarters Hospital in Taxila for autopsy.

Investigation officer Ayub told journalists that since Aabid had been jailed in a blasphemy case, police were investigating the murder from different angles, including target killing and personal dispute. He said that on a complaint of Ghulam Ibrar, a brother of the deceased, the scope of investigation had been widened.

When Aabid’s body was brought to the village, a group of enraged people gathered there and did not allow members of his family and other relatives to bury it in the local graveyard. He was later buried in the courtyard of his house.

Published in Dawn January 8th , 2014

[ajazali]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

To defend God is our need instead. And killing for blasphemy is not all about defending God. You can do it on intellectual grounds. Title of thread is not appropriate for the content of article.

[muqawwee123]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

Khuda ko ehle-jaha’n jab bana chuke to ‘Firaq’
Pukar Utthe khuda ne hame’n banaya hai.

[kakaballi]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@ajazali

To defend God is our need instead. And killing for blasphemy is not no all about defending God. You can do it on intellectual grounds. Title of thread is not appropriate for the content of article.

Can you propose a title for the thread?

How about: “Allah avenged”?

[ajazali]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@kakaballi

Are you saying that one can kill someone on intellectual grounds? :S

no.
I mean defending Religion is actually done through intellectual debates. The title is misleading imo.

[kakaballi]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@ajazali

no.
I mean defending Religion is actually done through intellectual debates. The title is misleading imo.

Sorry, I misunderstood your post.

[ajazali]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@kakaballi

Can you propose a title for the thread?

How about: “Allah avenged”?

We defend God in many ways. Murdering in the name of blasphemy could be one way for a few ignorant. But this is not how Muslims defend God in general.
For example, I would not suggest Ahmadis be killed but for me, declaring them non-Muslims is fine. Because, after all there are some limits. its not like anyone can claim to be a prophet and start a new sect in Islam. If we do not even retaliate in intellectual way, this would become non-stop thing.

[kakaballi]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@ajazali

We defend God in many ways. Murdering in the name of blasphemy could be one way for a few ignorant. But this is not how Muslims defend God in general.

For example, I would not suggest Ahmadis be killed but for me, declaring them non-Muslims is fine. Because, after all there are some limits. its not like anyone can claim to be a prophet and start a new sect in Islam. If we do not even retaliate in intellectual way, this would become non-stop thing.

Of course, retaliate with intellect all you can. Killing or inciting to kill just because someone is a non-Muslim is terrible terrible terrible.

[ajazali]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

Agreed

[chintu_bhopali]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@ajazali

We defend God in many ways. Murdering in the name of blasphemy could be one way for a few ignorant. But this is not how Muslims defend God in general.
For example, I would not suggest Ahmadis be killed but for me, declaring them non-Muslims is fine. Because, after all there are some limits. its not like anyone can claim to be a prophet and start a new sect in Islam. If we do not even retaliate in intellectual way, this would become non-stop thing.

What if ahmadis declare you guys non-muslim? Why you need to bother who and how other people practice their faith and what are their beliefs ..

[Med911]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@kakaballi

Of course, retaliate with intellect all you can. Killing or inciting to kill just because someone is a non-Muslim is terrible terrible terrible.

Im glad for your suggestion. Im sure Ahmadis would be pleased to know that Ajazali doesn’t suggest murdering them.

Intellectual debate is difficult when the only ones allowed to debate or have an oppionion are Sunni ulema. Intellectual debate, i think you would be agree, is difficult between two people when only one side is allowed to speak. If you for example were told you couldnt debate or respond on this forum to people who address you, that wouldnt make for much of a debate now would it…

[Med911]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@chintu_bhopali

What if ahmadis declare you guys non-muslim? Why you need to bother who and how other people practice their faith and what are their beliefs ..

He wont get your point…

[Med911]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@ajazali

To defend God is our need instead. And killing for blasphemy is not all about defending God. You can do it on intellectual grounds. Title of thread is not appropriate for the content of article.

So what is it about then? Is killing someone for suposed Blasphemy a persons way of pleasing god or demonstrating your devotion to god?

[Med911]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@ajazali

We defend God in many ways. Murdering in the name of blasphemy could be one way for a few ignorant. But this is not how Muslims defend God in general.
For example, I would not suggest Ahmadis be killed but for me, declaring them non-Muslims is fine. Because, after all there are some limits. its not like anyone can claim to be a prophet and start a new sect in Islam. If we do not even retaliate in intellectual way, this would become non-stop thing.

It is a non stop thing. Its the nature of religion and humanity. Its been happening since the founding of Islam. There have been multiple off shoots from Islam. Killing the leaders of these groups hasn’t stopped others.

[kakaballi]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@Med911

Im glad for your suggestion. Im sure Ahmadis would be pleased to know that Ajazali doesn’t suggest murdering them.

Intellectual debate is difficult when the only ones allowed to debate or have an oppionion are Sunni ulema. Intellectual debate, i think you would be agree, is difficult between two people when only one side is allowed to speak. If you for example were told you couldnt debate or respond on this forum to people who address you, that wouldnt make for much of a debate now would it…

Yes, I agree.

I also think that something or someone gains more strength if the opposition to that thing or that person is stronger.

I really don’t understand why do we consider suppression as the only means of defeating competition. Why not compete in education, health and economics instead of trying to destroy each other.

[PyariCgudia]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

I don’t know if we have accurately pinned down all the factors but there is a segment of muslim men that are sheer hot-heads. They see their community get put down (Abu Gharaib prison atrocities, etc), and they react. They are impulsive, and they immediately retaliate in violence. A terrorist group comes by and sees that they are angry, and I imagine they find recruitment easy. Notice how these groups are not being filled up with women.

We need to address why muslim guys are such hot heads, and why the anger and macho-ism. We’ve all been to masjids, and we’ve all seen the young hot headed muslim man crowd. Mostly teens and young guys in their 20’s, usually zero / garbage education, can’t keep a proper job, and they listen to a lot of angry rap, and seclude themselves in violent video games.

Maybe it’s the violent video games. Girls don’t do these things. The world of the little boy is very different these days than half a century ago when they just ran around playing tag.

[PyariCgudia]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

And I think muslim society needs to crack down on recruiting clerics. The minute hatred is preached in a masjid, even in secrecy with male halaqas (sometimes I suppose a cleric may not want to disclose his ideas at jummah namaz), then there needs to be action. They need to fire that cleric from attending the masjid. There needs to be zero tolerance.

When did you ever hear of a cleric being fired from a masjid? Only happened once here, this guy from the West Indies who was found eating dinner in a restaurant where they happen to have a bar/alcohol (which is like most restaurants. ex cheesecake factory). So they said he was sitting in a place where there was alcohol being served, so he can’t lead the prayers.

I think there was something wrong with the guys who decided to follow him after namaz on Friday and stalk him to see where he goes for fun. It was ridiculous that’s why they fired a guy who was so calm and cool and knowledgeable. Meanwhile the guy who goes on and on angrily about politics at jummah namaz, that dude they won’t fire.

[ajazali]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@chintu_bhopali

What if ahmadis declare you guys non-muslim? Why you need to bother who and how other people practice their faith and what are their beliefs ..

@Med911

He wont get your point…

They already do it. Look at the post #8](http://www.paklinks.com/gs/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=8) , the first response by an ahmadi in the thread below. then Ahmdis in that thread, keep arguing in circle to avoid telling what exactly they call mainstream muslims.
http://www.paklinks.com/gs/religion-and-philosophy/637369-what-do-ahmedis-call-mainstream-muslims.html

[ajazali]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@Med911

It is a non stop thing. Its the nature of religion and humanity. Its been happening since the founding of Islam. There have been multiple off shoots from Islam. Killing the leaders of these groups hasn’t stopped others.

please note, killing to stop them is not my argument.
And you think religion can stay around if left unorganized?

[Jack_Sparrow]

Re: Does God needs people to defend HIM?

@ajazali

And you think religion can stay around if left unorganized?

Yes, no one has the right to tell someone else how, when and why he can communicate with the creator. Leave it to the individual, and if someone wants to be an athiest its his choice. All the priests, mullahs and pandits have made a business out of religion.