Is it ethical to directly (telling/asking the rishta) or indirectly (w/o letting the prospective rishta know) that you’d like to find the prior spouse they were married to (their ex), and talk to them and their family?
Isn’t this an important thing to do when you’re entertaining rishta with a divorcee?
Re: Digging Up Graves
In Pakistan majority of the exes will only spew rubbish.
Re: Digging Up Graves
Is it ethical to directly (telling/asking the rishta) or indirectly (w/o letting the prospective rishta know) that you'd like to find the prior spouse they were married to (their ex), and talk to them and their family?
Isn't this an important thing to do when you're entertaining rishta with a divorcee?
Awesome thread.
I am divorced. My ex is still in the same city and I see him around all the time. If someone were to ask to speak to him...I'd be annoyed. I'd be irritated because I've worked very hard to erase that part of my life...to move on. Yet here we are again...:) I'd say no. I have no children with my ex, no rishta with him anymore, he is a stranger to me now. The past is the past and I am going to leave it there whether a new guy likes it or not.
The other thing is PCG...what am I expecting to hear if I spoke to a guy's ex? Things like "yeah he's a real catch...I'd totally marry him again".
Re: Digging Up Graves
Well, it would be more to find out if there was any abuse, any hitting, any marital rape, any abuse of finances, was he giving her enough money or was she having to beg him for 10 bucks to spend on a purse, were his family members just nasty to her and things to watch out for with the family.
I've seen people go on and remarry, and think, GOOD LUCK to that new wife, man she has no idea what she just got herself INTO!
I mean, you're going to need to see a divorce certificate to know that he's actually divorced. You need that before you apply for a marriage license in most states. So you'll see the name of the girl, and you'd be able to find her if you knew what city she lives in.
But Reha, I remember your story somewhat. If your ex goes on to remarry, and that girl seeks you out, wouldn't you be obliged to tell them the truth about the way you got treated, so they know what kind of INSAAN he is?
Re: Digging Up Graves
Well you have not written the whole story like the background.Obviously its ur rite to ask and find about their past.try to find out what the real reason of divorce was.You dont have to go and ask his ex but you can get info from neighbors n relatives.Dont be too quick in taking descisions.Let the elders ask and say that tomorow we have to tell our khandan buzurgs so.it would be great if we know little about your previous life.
Re: Digging Up Graves
And what will you do if she bad mouths the crap out of him to you? Will you believe her and then confront him with all the things she said? Yeah that's gonna go over well.
Or if she doesn't want to talk to you? But then contacts him and tells him you contacted her just to mess with him or you or for whatever reason. Then what? I'm sure that will go over well too when he finds out you went behind his back.
I mean if you are seeing behavior that makes you think he and his family treated her horribly, then you shouldn't be involved in any case. I really can't see much of a chance that her side of the story will be of any benefit to you.
Re: Digging Up Graves
^ Smart guys make sure their red flags do not show. I don't think any guy who is LOOKING for a wife, and has issues up his sleeve, would actually show any hints that daal mein kuch kala hai. I've seen some situations where people played it off really well, including the guy's family, then the real deal gets found out after marriage. It's sad.
That's why I think women SHOULD protect themselves. Maybe not going after the ex themselves. But what about if you were to look up divorce case proceedings? I'm sure you could find records, since most court records will be public, about a divorce, and get a copy of the court proceedings, and what was said.
Re: Digging Up Graves
And this is not a gender biased thread, same goes for women who are divorced.
Re: Digging Up Graves
You cannot control every aspect of your future life. You cannot have everything planned and expect things to go accordingly. That is because its life, things change and happen unexpectedly.
No matter how much you dig up someone's past, there will be things that will pop up and surprise you. Besides, what good are you expecting to hear from the other side?
Yes for sure try to find out the reason for his divorce, but if you can't trust him enough to be telling the truth, why would you marry him in the first place?
Re: Digging Up Graves
Well, it would be more to find out if there was any abuse, any hitting, any marital rape, any abuse of finances, was he giving her enough money or was she having to beg him for 10 bucks to spend on a purse, were his family members just nasty to her and things to watch out for with the family.
I've seen people go on and remarry, and think, GOOD LUCK to that new wife, man she has no idea what she just got herself INTO!
I mean, you're going to need to see a divorce certificate to know that he's actually divorced. You need that before you apply for a marriage license in most states. So you'll see the name of the girl, and you'd be able to find her if you knew what city she lives in.
But Reha, I remember your story somewhat. If your ex goes on to remarry, and that girl seeks you out, wouldn't you be obliged to tell them the truth about the way you got treated, so they know what kind of INSAAN he is?
No, I would not speak to anyone about anything. Two reasons:
Many people (men and women) are muuuuuuuch more careful with their second spouses because their rose colored glasses of "I can do anything I want with this person" are gone. They've realized their errors and know that women (at least women in the US) will not tolerate such BS. This I've seen happening and I have a feeling the ex will be much more careful with his new wife than he was with me...he saw what it cost him. I made mistakes too...I didn't ask the right questions...heck I didn't ask ANY questions.
Second reason, and this may sound very cold, but I don't care. Its not my problem nor my business and I would say that if someone called me. People have to leave this junk behind at some point.
Divorce transcripts are public so you can easily get those if you want to find out more about allegations and what their reasons were on paper. Although at that point, people become so nasty they forget why they're even in court. I am telling you PCG...its useless.
As for the family telling you about how their daughter was kept...let me give you a preview: "humari phool jaisi bachi ke saat un logo ne kya kiya hum batate hein...blah blah blah"
Do istikhara, find out who this man is today and leave the rest to Allah.
Re: Digging Up Graves
Both POVs have compelling points. This is a difficult one. Here is a question that can br posed to parents of future brides
If the prospective son in law was divorced, would you do due diligence to find out what happened?
My guess: answer would be a resounding yes.
Re: Digging Up Graves
Exactly. I'm sure it will get ugly, but if you find out that the guy is actually a bipolar patient, or he used to hit and she can show you pictures of the scars. That's a big deal.
Re: Digging Up Graves
Both POVs have compelling points. This is a difficult one. Here is a question that can br posed to parents of future brides
If the prospective son in law was divorced, would you do due diligence to find out what happened?
My guess: answer would be a resounding yes.
Of course it would be yes and due diligence is a responsibility.
Divorced or not...you have to dig a little.
Exactly. I'm sure it will get ugly, but if you find out that the guy is actually a bipolar patient, or he used to hit and she can show you pictures of the scars. That's a big deal.
That's a chance you take with anyone...divorced or not though. And if she got divorced because of domestic abuse..........those transcripts or even a criminal check will be enough.
Re: Digging Up Graves
Is it ethical to directly (telling/asking the rishta) or indirectly (w/o letting the prospective rishta know) that you'd like to find the prior spouse they were married to (their ex), and talk to them and their family?
Isn't this an important thing to do when you're entertaining rishta with a divorcee?
Absolutely the most useless thing to do.
Re: Digging Up Graves
Are you willing to show him all your posts ?
Re: Digging Up Graves
Yeah sure. He already knows all the qualities you guys know anyway.
Re: Digging Up Graves
^ Before spending so much energy on this......why not find out first how IT guy feels about you talking to his 1st wife? If he says it's a deal-breaker for him.....then that's a whole new problem now isn't it? I think you mentioned somewhere else that the 1st wife ran away to Pakistan.....is she now back in the U.S.?
You can easily ask him to show you a copy of his credit report to find out how responsible he is financially. Ask for a copy of last years tax return to find out if he's lying about his income, investments etc (ie. how responsible he is planning for his financial future). Heck even asking to see a copy of the divorce documents can be done through him. I'm even ok with hiring a PI to do a background check and see what he can dig up. HOWEVER.....I think its outright stupid to actually speak directly with an ex-spouse without telling him first. Him finding out from her or through a 3rd party now (or later) that you spoke to her behind his back can only lead to tension/arguments.
For what its worth....in your specific case....I think its useless for you to speak to her. Why? B/C you're too emotional. Based on what you write here, I don't see you being able to have a calm/mature discussion with his wife WITHOUT leading her on......and then being able to separate information that is true, could be true.......versus stuff that's just plain ridiculous.
P.S. Since we don't really know the details of his previous marriage (how he met his 1st wife, how long after meeting they got married, why the divorce was filed, who filed it etc.)........I do find it strange that the marriage fell apart only after 3 MONTHS.
Bad idea pcg. I can bet anything that nothing good is going to come out of having conversation with the ex. The fact that they are divorced is the proof enough that they had issues with each other.
Not only that, your potential rishta is going to be totally ticked with you if your do that.
Re: Digging Up Graves
Wow so technical. Sometimes I wonder if robots are posting replies.
Re: Digging Up Graves
He's told me some details. Seemed like a legit story to me, but now with certain comments he has made, and the way the women in his family have spoken about my mom, I'm wondering whether that girl faced problems from this family and found that IT guy didn't really support her, and then said screw you, and left.
3 months and a marriage falling apart - either the couple just were not compatible romantically and sexually and they weren't enjoying each other's company and figured it's not worth it; OR there was meddling. And in desi families, it's usually meddling, let's face it.