To Moderator: Sorry that I am addressing the thread that was done with but there was very important issue that I think I must address. [My post will show the reason why I posted here.]
PA - I just came across this post of yours just by chance. It’s nice to see that you have posted this hadith here and you thought you were trying to prove something?
What if I say that this hadith is authentic? You are a self-confessed Quranist and yet you forgot the following Ayah of the Holy Quran:
‘None of Our revelations do We abrogate or cause it to be forgotten, but We substitute something better or similar: knowest thou that God has power over all things?’ (2: 106).
Do you know in the Study of Quran what Nasikh and Mansukh mean?
The hadith that you have quoted refers to Abrogated (Mansukh) verse. Please refer to the following link and you will find this hadith quoted there as well. * Please read the link in case you want to respond.
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“The revelations from Allah as found in the Qur’an touch on a variety of subjects, among them beliefs, history, tales of the prophets, day of judgement, Paradise and Hell, and many others. Particularly important are the ahkam (legal rulings), because they prescribe the manner of legal relationships between people, as Allah wishes them to be observed.
Most of the Shias (I am including the ‘fringe sects’ within the Shia) believe that the Quran is complete without any addition or subtraction. But they have a historical problem that their books do literally contain hadiths from their Imams to the effect that Quran had been tampered with.
I have typed [verbatim] the following from a very nice and informative book written by an Iranian from Shia perspective.
– An Introduction to Shi’i Islam – Moojan Momen Yale University Press ISBN 0-300-03537-4
“The Quran is considered to be the Word of God revealed through Muhammad acting as God’s mouthpiece. The text of the Quran is in the recension compiled under the direction of the third Caliph, Uthman, is accepted by both Sunnis and Shi’is.
There is, however, considerable evidence that early Shi’a did not accept the standard text of Quran. Even as late as the time fo Shaykh al-Mufid, there was considerable discussion among the Shi’a as to what had been omitted from the Quran by the enemies of ‘Ali, although by that time there was consensus that nothing had been added. In other words, it was felt that although the standard text of the Quran represented God’s word with no human additions, part of the text extolling ‘Ali and pointing to his Imamate had been excised by his enemies.
Although most Shi’i eventually took the view that nothing had been omitted or added to the Quran, traces of the earlier view are enshrined among some of the hadith and are even reproduced in some later books. The following are some of the examples taken from the Bihar al- Anwar, the important collection of hadith made by the seventeenth century scholar, Muhammad Baqir Majlisi:
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In the verse: ‘God has chosen Adam, Noah, the family of Abraham and the family of ‘Imran above all beings’ [Quran 3:33), the phrase ‘and the family of Muhammad is considered to have originally been present after the phrase ‘family of Imran.’ [Ref: al-Qummi, Tafsir, al Ayyashi, Tafsir, and other sources quoted in Majlisi, Bihar al-Anwar, Vol.23 pp. 222-8, No. 25, 26, 48,49.]
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In the commentary upon the verse: ‘O would that I had not chosen such-such as a friend’ [Quran 25:28], the sixth Imam, Ja’far as-Sadiq, said: ‘In ‘Ali’s copy is: “O would that I have not chosen the second as a friend”, and this will appear one day. [Ref: Alam ibn Sayf al-Hilli, Kanz Jami’ al Fawa’id], quoted in Majlisi, Bihar al-Anwar Vol. 24 pp 18-19 No.31] this is clear reference to Abu Bakr who is known as ath-Thani (the second) because he is the second in the cave during Muhammad’s flight from Mecca.
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The phrase: ‘You are the best of people’ (khayr al-umma, Quran: 3:110) should be read: “You are the best of Imams [khayr al-a’immaa). [Ref: al-Ayyashi, Tafsir, quoted in Majlisi, Bihar al-Anwar, Vol. 24,p 153, Nos. 1, 2.]
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The Quran has been altered so that it has dropped the names of the successors (awsiyah i.e. Imams) and the hypocrites (munfiqun, i.e. the enemies of the Imams). [Ref: at-Tabarsi, al-Ihtijaj, quoted in Majlisi, Bihar al-Anwar, Vol. 24,pp 195-6, No.19]
A small minority of Shi’i have attempted to get much larger passages (and even whole suras) accepted as being missing portions of the Quran but without much success. [Ref: W. St. Clair Tisdall, ‘Shi’ah additions to the Koran, and Eliash, ‘The Shi’ite Quran’. For another example of material said to have been omitted from the Quran see the assertion that the names of six pseudo-prophets have been omitted from the Quran, al-Kashshi, Rijal, pp187, 195. ].”
As I have stated earlier that Shias do believe that Quran is complete without any addition or omission. Shias brothers/sisters will correct me if I am wrong that Shias do not agree with the present format of the Quran and have preference for the Quran compiled by hazarat Ali (ra) in Chorological order. This Quran does not exist now but is with Imam Mahdi (ra) and will bring this Quran when he appears.
I don’t want to start a lengthy debate. I just want to clear the false impression given by PA’s post. It even had got Sheraz CT excited.
