Dear friends …present regime in Pakistan claims it has put the country on democratic track and a General president is safeguard against anti-democratic forces.how many of u agree with this contention ?
Re: Democracy in pakistan
That is nonsense. Elections were rigged, Busharraf is 'president' because of another rigged referendum.
Those in the 'cabinet' are the most corrupt and un democratic politcians there are.
Army never gives up power, to the detriment of Pakistan
Re: Democracy in pakistan
Those that are waiting to come to power (BENAZIR/PPP et al) are 1203055 times more corrupt than the present regime can ever think of.
Re: Democracy in pakistan
i agree a good dictator is better than a bad dictator:D…
and a good dictator is also often better than a dumb democratically elected president:halo:
Re: Democracy in pakistan
^^ Pakistanis should learn from Israelis.
While I don't buy the bull about Pakistan or Israel being formed on the basis of religious mumbo jumbo.
However just like Israel, Pakistan has been subjected to constant attacks by some of its neighbors. Just like Israel, we have been attacked by relentless enemies from the East as well as West.
So just like Israel, Pakistan should have leaders like Ehud Barak, Sharon, Menachem Begin, etc. All these leaders are ex-military generals turned politicians. All these general-cum-political leaders are strongly pro-defense, pro-USA.
Unfortunately our retired generals so far haven't figured this out. Once they do, we will have strong arm leaders like Eisenhower.
p.s. some Pakistanis may sympathize with the enemies of Israel. But that doesn’t take away the strong leadership style of Isralis.
Re: Democracy in pakistan
While I don't buy the bull about Pakistan or Israel being formed on the basis of religious mumbo jumbo.
.
you're one smart cookie;)....
[quote]
However just like Israel, Pakistan has been subjected to constant attacks by some of its neighbors. Just like Israel, we have been attacked by relentless enemies from the East as well as West.
So just like Israel, Pakistan should have leaders like Ehud Barak, Sharon, Menachem Begin, etc. All these leaders are ex-military generals turned politicians. All these general-cum-political leaders are strongly pro-defense, pro-USA.
Unfortunately our retired generals so far haven't figured this out. Once they do, we will have strong arm leaders like Eisenhower.
[/quote]
Unlike Israel Pakistan does not have the sympathy of the west from birth:D, unlike Israel Pakistan is not starving its neighbors to death...whiich gives valid reasons to these neighbors to attack...unlike Israel pakistan is not the most developped country among his neighbors...unlike Israel pakistan is not a "western" country...to me it seems that the comparison is a bit too bold...as most of your extrem ideas:D....
BUT we need to get rid of stupid rural traditions such as honor kilings, getting rid of girls at birth....an islamic republic with a strong moral islamic leader implementing islamic laws in a more efficient way..to protect women from abuses and rapes..and promote literacy among people especially girl;) that woulbe be nice...and help getting rid of corruptiun...i don't think army people are fittest for that;)
Re: Democracy in pakistan
Dear friends i'm not surprised to see some of u accepting dictatorship in place of poorly presented democracy.But u must not forget democracy being a evolutionary process.it needs to be nurtured.if politicians r corrupt,regularly held elections provide accountability mechanism .But if a dictator goes corrupt which often happens then how to hold him accountable?According to Aristotle, worst kind of democracy is better than best kind of dictatorship .
Re: Democracy in pakistan
BUT we need to get rid of stupid rural traditions such as honor kilings, getting rid of girls at birth....an islamic republic with a strong moral islamic leader implementing islamic laws in a more efficient way..to protect women from abuses and rapes..and promote literacy among people especially girl;) that woulbe be nice...and help getting rid of corruptiun...i don't think army people are fittest for that;)
And the maulana jees are? Trust me, being a Pakistani, you can ask any other Pakistani, the army is the only entity in Pakistan that can get things done. If it werent for the army, some of our mambo jumbo warriors would have wrecked havoc all over the country. Even our police pisses in their pants when they see a Captain in a unifrom entering the thaaana!
Re: Democracy in pakistan
Who cares what Arist-to-to-le said millions of (maybe thousands 
) years ago? Mushy is ALOT better than both BB and Tinda Bin Abba Jee, and we, the people of Pakistan support him. He should personally step up the operations all over the country and kill all the anti-pakistani Babooz and Wazeeros!
Re: Democracy in pakistan
You are right, but as you can see by the nature and quality of replies to your post, many here are just kids who do not live in Pakistan, and do not know what's really going on, esp when they claim corruption has gone down.
Reality is one they do not know, or do not want to know.
Never mind them, they matter not.
Re: Democracy in pakistan
It's not about who is currently better, it's about the fact that only democracy in the long term can work in a country as diverse as Pakistan. Even if som,eone of you think Mush is great, what about Zia? Was he not also a general? The army generals and there "honest" political allies only represent a certain mindset and political thinking of the elite. This allows minority people like the Balochs for instance to be marginalized and pushed into a bloody insurgency against the state forces. Before we can have democracy, the army needs to be made subservient to civilians in every sense of the word. Otherwise its the same facade over and over again.
Re: Democracy in pakistan
1...Unlike Israel Pakistan does not have the sympathy of the west from birth 2...unlike Israel Pakistan is not starving its neighbors to death...whiich gives valid reasons to these neighbors to attack 3...unlike Israel pakistan is not the most developped country among his neighbors 4...unlike Israel pakistan is not a "western" country...to me it seems that the comparison is a bit too bold...as most of your extrem ideas
You are correct on 2,3 and with a bit of stretch may be on 4. However you are way off on #1. Pakistan has had "sympathy" of the West since birth. In fact the areas under Pakistan namely Frontier and Punjab were in the best (and not just good) books of the West even before 1947.
Nowhere in the British Empire (where sun never set for a while), the West found a force so disciplined and so marshal and in such large numbers. Punjab and Frontier provided Brits a pool of labor that got 100% outsourcing of the Western defense. Gurkhas and few other tribes were good, but they were either in very small numbers (comparatively) or not as disciplined. So my dear Mademoiselle, Pakistan was in fact had a destiny to be a Western ally.
I am ignoring this as you are totally ignorant of the Pakistani Mullahs or other religious shenanigans.
Re: Democracy in pakistan
kuch tu khauf karo baboo kya hogaya hai.The whole subcontinent especially muslims were always against the west and “farangis”.Right from east india company to partition.
Re: Democracy in pakistan
May be! However leaders such as Sir Syed were able to move bunch of those into Western educated baboos and politicians. The ones who remained anti-West were mostly ignoromous lota followers of Mullahs such as Ata-Ullah-Shah Bukhari and the likes.
On the other hand if we look at the history of Punjab and Frontier, most of the people (minus few tribals) were on the side of the West since at least 1830 (or the start of Afghan wars).
Re: Democracy in pakistan
Pakistan and democracy considering army (or its crooks) in control? no way. Neither BB nor NS are any minute closer to democracy. We are very very far from democracy. We need at least judiciary to be out of government's control and a real "justice" available, judiciary which can influence the government and not the other way around.
Re: Democracy in pakistan
The reason I think for Democracy never actually flourashing in Pakistan is due to the fact that all of the civilian democratic rulers have botched the job and lost the support of the people. The Army always gains the peoples support initialy, because it is seen as coming in to clean things up... And so the dance goes on and on... We have the military which screws up, then the civilians come in, they screw up even worse and then everyone look to the Army again to bring back the "good old days." The Army is also a better choice because each time they throw up a new general and everyone thinks he will be better then the last, while all the civilian political parties can offer is either Bhutto, or Sharif... Meanwhile, lack of representation leads to turmoil under the military and while they improve the economy somewhat, they screw things up politically each time, and then, here we go again with democracy... Then ofcourse the civilians have to deal with the poilitical mess left by the Army, which so far they have only made worse.
All Pakistan needs is a civilian democratically elected govt that doesnt botch the job.. One democratically elected govt that produces real results, will gain the support of the people, and the Army wouldnt dare try and take over.
Yes the army does make life for civilian govts difficult... But If the civilian govts could cut back on the stupidity, the corruption, the abuse of power, the pety rivalries and focused exclusively on nation building, the Army will be left powerless... The Civilian govt MUST build strong instituations, the courts must be made independant for example... Other wise we are bound to repeat history until eventually the country runs out of gass completely.
Re: Democracy in pakistan
Good dictator is better than a bad dictato what about US and Musharraf
who is good and who is bad ?
Re: Democracy in pakistan
1- What about govt’s real estate qabza group.
2- What about Saudi Oil Gift that Saudi govt gifted free just to help Pakistani people that musharraf govt sold Rs 60 Per Liter to pakistani people.
3- what about sugar crises that is yielding million of rupees everyday to these so called mushy’s democratic Lotas.
4- etc
5- etc
Re: Democracy in pakistan
100% agree with you.
Re: Democracy in pakistan
Pakistan needs more islam. Currently, our population is being corrupted by the moral decadence of the western inspiredby the western inspired materialists, or otherwise known as the individuals practicing enlightened moderation. They should be called the moderately enlightened as the knaves are squandering everything great leaders like Sir Syed hoped for. I didn't expect this from Syed Musharaff.