Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

Society Religion & Philosophy
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Can some people discuss their knowledge on which date the prophet passed? I think 12th Rabbiawal is generally celebrated as his birthdate across the different schools of thought. According to the Shiite calendar today is his passing but not according to the Sunni calendar. There seems to be some debate from within the same sects even as what is accepted as the date he passed. Would like to know what people know about both the Shia and Sunni schools of thought regarding this and why is that we don’t have a clear indication about which day he died? I would think his passing would be more clear than his birth.

This is generally for my knowledge and curiosity as most of the Shia world is commemorating his loss today but not everyone in the Sunni world is. People seem divided.

Please keep the discussion on topic, this is not about who is right or wrong but for a better understanding from personal views points who may have some background on this.

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

12th of Rabi-ul-Awal is the date of both the birth and passing of RasoolAllah (SAW), although there is less authenticity in the birth date, but it is still generally accepted.

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Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

Oh really? That is the first time I am hearing of this! Is his birthdate and passing significant dates in Islamic countries? Are there celebrations and holidays reserved for the occasion of his birth? I am confused as to why there is so much uncertainty about this.

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

Its Islam, not Christianity. Birthdays and Death anniversaries has no importance near God. Why bother over things that are not even secondary or even tertiary.

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Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

Okay but I am still trying to understand why there is so much confusion regarding his birthdate and death. Maybe the question should be asked to an Islamic historian.

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

There is no confusion ... Some people want to celebrate the birthday and probably changed the date of passing to another so they are not blamed for celebrating on the day of passing. I observe the birthday of RasoolAllah (SAW) in my own way, that I believe is acceptable ... It is not considered a religious occasion ... But I consider it an accuse to remember and do extra Nawafil that I would otherwise not do ... If I get better then perhaps I can do the same thing every month and then perhaps every week, but I'm not there yet so I try to do it at least every year. in general however smooth_guy is not incorrect in what he stated.

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

Brother, if you google Olive, Figs and Honey on google; you will find numerous articles on their benefits and zikr in Quran. I dunno how feel about that, either they r so beneficial because their zikr is found in Quran or Quran chose them because of their benefits.

Either way you take it; conclusion would be Everything you find in Quran has its importance and value.
ALLAH says in Quran

[QUOTE]
يَا يَحْيَىٰ خُذِ الْكِتَابَ بِقُوَّةٍ ۖ وَآتَيْنَاهُ الْحُكْمَ صَبِيًّا
وَحَنَانًا مِنْ لَدُنَّا وَزَكَاةً ۖ وَكَانَ تَقِيًّا
وَبَرًّا بِوَالِدَيْهِ وَلَمْ يَكُنْ جَبَّارًا عَصِيًّا
وَسَلَامٌ عَلَيْهِ يَوْمَ وُلِدَ وَيَوْمَ يَمُوتُ وَيَوْمَ يُبْعَثُ حَيًّا

Pickthal 19:12] (And it was said unto his son): O John! Hold fast the Scripture. And we gave him wisdom when a child
[Pickthal 19:13] And compassion from Our presence, and purity; and he was devout,
[Pickthal 19:14] And dutiful toward his parents. And he was not arrogant, rebellious.
[Pickthal 19:15] Peace on him the day he was born, and the day he dieth and the day he shall be raised alive!

And then later on he says

وَالسَّلَامُ عَلَيَّ يَوْمَ وُلِدْتُ وَيَوْمَ أَمُوتُ وَيَوْمَ أُبْعَثُ حَيًّا
**[Pickthal 19:33] Peace on me the day I was born, and the day I die, and the day I shall be raised alive!

**This time its Hazrat Esa a.s Sending salam on himself on the day he was born, he will die and the day he is raised alive....

[/QUOTE]

I am not here to convince you to Celebrate or mourn these anniversaries; but dont call them unimportant near ALLAH. Certainly they are of great importance thats why ALLAH is Specifically picking these days to send Salam on Prophet a.s, and on the other occasion you see a prophet a.s doing that for himself.

Not only you find zikr of these days in Quran but these are the days ALLAH chooses to send salam on his Prophet a.s
Wasalam.

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

Let me rephrase that. Allah has not asked us to worry about those dates. If they are important for Allah, Allah has sent them on those days.
But every year that day is blessed or not, should be celebrated by Ummah or not. This is not us to decide but Allah. And Allah has not commanded such thing.
Prophet SAW said there are two celebration days for Muslims and those are Eidein. So let it be.

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

i also think his day of birth and passing away was the same...i.e. Monday!

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

Thats exactly where the confusion is, the changes and when they were made if that is the case. Thats why I think a historian might be better for this one. I was just curious as the topic came up one day and I didn't realize his birth and death fell on the same day, nor had I heard much being spoken about it. Even on here, you guys are talking about what you think is important or not in regards to it being celebrated. I am wondering where down the line it became confusing about his birth and passing. Just curiosity, pretty much.

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

^^^ For a pious person and also Prophets (AS), including Prophet (SAW), the day of death (day of Inteqal or Wisal) is more auspicious and holy, deserving celebration, than day a pious person were born. Reason is simple, that is:

The day of birth is the day pious person enters this world of test and his test starts (when he reaches a certain age) … or if the concerned pious persons are Prophet (AS) then they enter a task to guide those who are misguided. But when they leave this world, they get to their creator (Allah) and that is the most blessed day for them (leaving this world of test and turmoil).

That is why followers or students of a pious Saint celebrates the day Saint left this world (they call that day Urus), and not the day Saint was born.

Celebration on the day Saint left this world is called ‘Urus’ because it is this day Saint meet (marries) his Creator. Urs is word derived from world Urussa (bride).

You can understand this by putting yourself in situation where you start an important task, and for that you left your family. Even though day of starting and day of finishing the task is both important, what would be most auspicious day, the day you started the task or day you finished the task. Obviously, the day you finished the task, as it is after you finish the task, you join your family again.

Anyhow, for Jahannumies and people stuck with this worldly life, day they leave this world is a horrendous and dreadful day, as they may end getting punished on the other side of grave … but obviously, that is not the case with pious and Prophets (AS).

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Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

Hmmm good point. ^

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

There is no confusion about his death date, because after Hijrat, pretty much every day of Prophet's life was recorded by Sahaba and being authenticated. When Prophet was born, there was no one recording the events of his life. Kufaar-e-Makkah anyways had the way of moving calendar back and forth per convenience. For example, Muharram was also a respected month in their culture and war was prohibited. If they had to fight during that month, they would shift the calendar back and forth to make it a non-muharram month. If you consider that fact, it becomes almost impossible to back track to the exact date of Prophet's birth.

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

The Seal of the Prophets peace and blessings upon him and his family was not, and wouldn't be from my understanding, be born a normal birth. All the Makkans would have been aware of his birth and Importance. Most did go on to become Muslims, memory and age permitting they would have been able to recall the Birth.

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Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

But he wasn't born a prophet, that came later. ^ So why and how would it not be a normal birth? What does that mean.

TLK I didn't know that but it does make sense a little. So why do people claim he was born and died on the same day?

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

^^^ All prophets (AS) are born Prophets (AS). Prophets (AS) are sent by Allah to this world for purpose, that they (AS) declare at time Allah wants them to declare. Prophet (SAW) declared his prophet-hood at the age of 40, that is all.

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

He peace and blessings upon him and his family was a Prophet when Adam Alaihis Salam was between Body and Spirit. meaning He, Allah bless him and grant him peace, was a Prophet before Prophethood started.

When Prophet Adam Alaihis Salam was in need he used the name of Prophet Sallallahu alaihi wa alehi wa sallam, meaning the Prophethood of Seal of Prophets, Imam of the Prophets, Best of Creation was done and dusted

It wouldn't be a normal birth because Allah Subhanahu wa ta'ala makes his Prophets stand out in Beauty and makes them venerable, meaning a sign that one of his Signs is here.

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Re: Debate over the Prophets Passing (PBUH)

I am sure you will agree with me that the blessed Companions (May Allah Almighty be pleased with them all) understood and practiced Islam better than anybody since – this has been vouched by Allah Almighty in the blessed Quran.

If you read the blessed Seerah of the Prophet (peace be upon him) you will note that none of his Companions celebrated his passing away. In fact all of Madinah was in distraught, shocked and extremely in pain for his parting away from them.

There was no ‘celebrations’ in Madinah for his passing away and him meeting his Creator. If there was need for any 'celebrations' people of Madinah would have done it there and then. The reason for their sadness was that they knew that from then on they cannot enjoy his companionship any more!

Please go and read the blessed Seerah of Rasool Allah (peace be upon him)

This is sheer blasphemy brother: You are insulting Allah almighty in your ignorance and you must turn to Allah Almighty and seek repentance from what you have written! Allah Almighty is above what you have attributed to Him.

Allah Almighty doesn’t need any brides and neither is He a bride to anyone?

Where have got this stuff from? Quran? Ahadith?

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He was a prophet from the day one as someone noted, but he did not know that till he reached the age of forty. In fact even then, khadijah had to take him to her cousin Warqa bin Nofel who figured out that he must be the prophet that old scriptures talked about. That clearly shows that no one in Mecca, including prophet himself knew that he is the messenger of Allah. If they knew then there would be no problem for prophet to spread his message, don’t you think? The main issue of kuffar was this they refused to accept him as rasool ullah. That is why when he signed one of the treaty with kuffar as “Rasool ullah”, they objected and had it change to “ibne Abdullah”.

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Yar please, in the name of respect and love, don’t make claims that are not right. None of the prophets, especially the ones who were not born to a father who was also a prophet, knew that that they are the messengers of Allah, until they were told by Allah or an angel.

May I remind you of the story of Ibrahim who would argue that moon and sun and stars cannot be God(s) when he saw people worshipping them, or statues cannot be God as they can’t even help themselves and kept searching for truth.

**One night, Ibrahim went up to the mountain, leaned against a rock, and looked up to the sky. He saw a shining star, and told his people: “Could this be my Lord?” But when it set he said: “I don’t like those that set.” The star has disappeared, it could not be God. God is always present. Then he saw the moon rising in splendor and told them: “Could this be my Lord?” But it also set. At daybreak, he saw the sun rising and said: t “Could this be my Lord, this is bigger?” But when the sun set he said: “O my people I am free from all that you join as partners with Allah! I have turned my face towards Him Who created the heavens and the earth, and never shall I give partners to Allah.” Our Lord is the Creator of the heavens and the earth and everything. He has the power to make the stars rise and set. Ibrahim then heard Allah calling him: “O Ibrahim!” Ibrahim said trembling: “Here I am O my Lord!” “Submit to Me! Be a Muslim!” Ibrahim fell on the ground, prostrating and crying, he said: “I submit to the Lord of the universe!” Ibrahim kept prostrating until night came again. He got up and went back to his home, in t peace, full of conviction that Allah has guided him to the Truth.
**