Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
unfortunately that is true 
, but needs to be highlighted on social media
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
but at the same time idiots are fueling this fire, everybody is so focused on wrongs of ISIS, wrongs of Alqaida.... yes they are wrong, they are bl00dy wrong but who is putting fuel in these fires? Why is world not putting criminals behind this situation to trial? As long as there is injustice, unfortunately "terrorism" will not go away.
dear captain, can you please explain who are you referring to as idiots who are fueling this fire? also who are the criminals that the world is not putting to trial? thx
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
dear captain, can you please explain who are you referring to as idiots who are fueling this fire? also who are the criminals that the world is not putting to trial? thx
The ones who created it, the ones who armed it, the ones who are facilitating it.
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
The ones who created it, the ones who armed it, the ones who are facilitating it.
you mean America and west? i am still not clear. honestly i dont know who created daesh/ISIS
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
you mean America and west? i am still not clear. honestly i dont know who created daesh/ISIS
America, Saudi Arabia, UK and everyone involved in Iraq, Syria and Libya.
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
today, an official from the Punjab Govt. said there is NO DAESH presence in Punjab...you have to take that statement with a pinch of salt.
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
America, Saudi Arabia, UK and everyone involved in Iraq, Syria and Libya.
qibla keh to aap sahiee rahay hain, laikan who will punish america, uk, saudi to bring justice? **
and yes WEST has been unjust** but sarkar since when superpowers in human history have followed moral guidelines?
for example what about muslim invaders in last 1000 years conquering country after country....or was that right because we were of course on the mission of spreading islam? i mean all of the subcontinent was conquered by great muslim warriors....
and maybe usa and UK have created daesh/isis (i dont know it for sure), but the key question for muslims is still out there...why do we muslims have a radicalized version among us who keeps on showing up in different forms, taliban, alqaeda, daesh, isis.........
how convenient it is for us muslims to blame everything on the west and not take responsibility for increased radicalization among us. The problem is that all these political narratives that we keep on outlining continue to divert the Muslims from the elephant in the room i.e. deeply contentious jurisprudence that enables the jihadists to justify their existence and agenda plus lack of reformation within islam since 12th century
actually, the main targets of this radicalized and twisted ideology have been Muslims themselves i.e killings of Hazara Shias in Afghanistan and Pakistan to mad killing spree in Syria and Iraq, it is the Muslims that bear the brunt of this violent mindset....yet we will keep on blaming west for everything instead of asking for reformation within islam.
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
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Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
qibla keh to aap sahiee rahay hain, laikan who will punish america, uk, saudi to bring justice? **
and yes WEST has been unjust** but sarkar since when superpowers in human history have followed moral guidelines?
I am not here to fix anything, at least let the culprits be known to the world. Don't start cutting your arm because someone said its rotting, don't throw yourself in acid container just because someone said your body is infected... investigate, understand, root-cause-analysis then take next steps.
for example what about muslim invaders in last 1000 years conquering country after country....or was that right because we were of course on the mission of spreading islam? i mean all of the subcontinent was conquered by great muslim warriors....
Feel free to write columns about it.
and maybe usa and UK have created daesh/isis (i dont know it for sure), but the key question for muslims is still out there...why do we muslims have a radicalized version among us who keeps on showing up in different forms, taliban, alqaeda, daesh, isis.........
You are forgetting few basics of society. When you create power vacuum, angels don't descend to take charge, specially when there is agenda in creating the vacuum. Yes Muslims have faults as well, that needs to be addressed as well, but that is not the only thing that is required to fix what is happening around the world.
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
well, if muslims had their **** together then no one would be able to see easily manipulate them covertly or by invasions.
I don't agree with everything wrt Erdogan, but america had to relent when the turkish parliament said 'no' to hosting forces / allowing facilities for 2003 invasion. Of course, the arabs are lackeys who are dependent upon US arms, but couldn't the rulers see one bit that they removing saddam would only cause chaos and invite their "mortal enemy" iran into iraq? None of them had the guts to even say no to the US forces using their territory to attack Iraq. It seems that you like to blame the west a bit too much for all the ills; why aren't the muslim neighbors, even if we exclude the saudis, doing anything about ISIS?! Can't the turks work out a deal with Kurds and take out ISIS? What is so horrible about Kurds reading and writing in their own language?
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
well, if muslims had their **** together then no one would be able to see easily manipulate them covertly or by invasions.
I don't agree with everything wrt Erdogan, but america had to relent when the turkish parliament said 'no' to hosting forces / allowing facilities for 2003 invasion. Of course, the arabs are lackeys who are dependent upon US arms, but couldn't the rulers see one bit that they removing saddam would only cause chaos and invite their "mortal enemy" iran into iraq? None of them had the guts to even say no to the US forces using their territory to attack Iraq. It seems that you like to blame the west a bit too much for all the ills; why aren't the muslim neighbors, even if we exclude the saudis, doing anything about ISIS?! Can't the turks work out a deal with Kurds and take out ISIS? What is so horrible about Kurds reading and writing in their own language?
Jazakallah....you nailed it. I was about to draft my response to our qibla buzarg captain jee's above post along the same lines.
we Muslims have these monster radicalized animals among us, so of course west will take advantage. We need to put our house in order.
And yes we give west too much credit to hide our bigotry. When we want to take the stand we do take it and west cant do anything. Like you gave turkey example. USA couldn't do anything..or when we wanted to explode nuclear bombs in response to India, we told Uncle Sam and all of the west to go to hell.
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
The Arabs first need to let go of the tribal mentality before we/West can even contemplate democracy in the Middle East
The Arab spring was a total failure. The anti-government protests, uprisings and armed rebellions that spread across the Middle East in early 2011 resulted in:
One dictator (Hosni Mubarak) being replaced by another (Sisi) in Egypt. What a joke?
The creation of ISIS (thanks to the arming of anti-Assad rebels by the West, Saudia & Turkey. Not all of them were genuine pro-democracy protesters. The rebels included many criminal-minded people as well) The removal of Saddam and subsequent power vacuum also contributed to the mess that has now engulfed Syria and Iraq as mentioned by doppleganger. The Western forces tried to cash in on the changing map of the Middle East (or so everyone thought) but all they managed to achieve was make the situation worse than previously.
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
For conspiracy theory lovers
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
It could be true.
They could do this. The top elite must be! But the foolish jihad lovers from all over the world are joining them!
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
well, if muslims had their **** together then no one would be able to see easily manipulate them covertly or by invasions.
We didn't have our own act together back in Bahadur Shah Zafar days (just one last big example from probably tons of others) and had Mir Jafars and Mir Sadiqs.
we Muslims have these monster radicalized animals among us, so of course west will take advantage. We need to put our house in order.
And yes we give west too much credit to hide our bigotry. When we want to take the stand we do take it and west cant do anything. Like you gave turkey example. USA couldn't do anything..or when we wanted to explode nuclear bombs in response to India, we told Uncle Sam and all of the west to go to hell.
We do have bigots there is no doubt about it, labeling of Ahmadis as kafirs, their persecution is one example, Saudis and Iranis playing proxy wars in other countries using oil money is another. But west has always supported the wrong elements our countries/societies so they can't be absolved of wrong-doings. But their game got stronger when US jumped in and helped create training camps, create "heros" aka mujhajid and now called terrorists.
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
qibla keh to aap sahiee rahay hain, laikan who will punish america, uk, saudi to bring justice? **
and yes WEST has been unjust** but sarkar since when superpowers in human history have followed moral guidelines?
for example what about muslim invaders in last 1000 years conquering country after country....or was that right because we were of course on the mission of spreading islam? i mean all of the subcontinent was conquered by great muslim warriors....
and maybe usa and UK have created daesh/isis (i dont know it for sure), but the key question for muslims is still out there...why do we muslims have a radicalized version among us who keeps on showing up in different forms, taliban, alqaeda, daesh, isis.........
how convenient it is for us muslims to blame everything on the west and not take responsibility for increased radicalization among us. The problem is that all these political narratives that we keep on outlining continue to divert the Muslims from the elephant in the room** i.e. deeply contentious jurisprudence that enables the jihadists to justify their existence and agenda plus lack of reformation within islam since 12th century ** actually, the main targets of this radicalized and twisted ideology have been Muslims themselves i.e killings of Hazara Shias in Afghanistan and Pakistan to mad killing spree in Syria and Iraq, it is the Muslims that bear the brunt of this violent mindset....yet we will keep on blaming west for everything instead of asking for reformation within islam.
To address the bolded, how many of these 22 year old Jihadi's running to ISIS have even read any of this jurisprudence? How many masjids have all the works of say, ex. Imam Jafer Sadiq, one of the first guys to write volumes upon volumes of laws? How many of these young kids, furthermore, have even read the Quran, and read the translations that are accepted by scholars as more accurate/authentic? Or are they reading the Quran translations sent to them via USPS by some Twitter recruiter, as what happened to one white girl in Wisconsin (ref: a NYTimes story some months ago, her recruiter was a Bangladeshi loser who had no job feeding off his wife in England and on government handouts).
Most of these guys are sent pamphlets and bits of pieces of the Quran taped together w/o context and without being able to read the verses around said verses, and on top of it, the verses aren't even translated properly. One article I read described a recruiter sending people a translation that read something about Infidels something or other and then in parenthesis the text says (Christians and Jews), next to the word Infidels.
Basic cursory training in translation of the Quran and of Islamic history will tell you that Infidels, i.e. Kuffar, are different from "People of the Book", and are referenced separately in the Quran. Furthermore, verse after verse suggests that if a person chooses to not believe in God (i.e. Infidel), we are to leave them alone. There is no direct order that states keep killing people and torturing them until they accept Islam as their faith. Doesn't even make sense. You can't convert to Islam after you're dead, so no point in killing people. You're not winning any converts this way. Verses relating to death and killing in the Quran are only limited to allowing a muslim state to fight off an enemy who is waging war against the state, aimed at a genocide of the muslims in that state. Recall the first thing Muhammad SAW did when threatened by "kuffar" of Mecca. He left. He packed up and left. We mark our calendar years with this prominent event in history. The calendar is not marked based on battles. It's marked based on a migration AWAY from an enemy to AVOID a war.
So do you really think these 22 year old kids have any knowledge of "jurisprudence"?
99.9% of muslims have not read sharia classical texts. They have not read the books of laws these old scholars wrote. They don't even know basic differences between theories written by Imam Shafi vs. Hanafi, etc etc. They haven't read one sentence written by Imam Jaffer Sadiq. They have not even read all of the hadith.
At 22, they haven't even managed to attend a proper college, most of these kids, which tells me their reading comprehension skills ==> ZERO.
If I have a hard time understanding translations and have to go digging into historical commentaries and footnotes to understand a verse, then don't tell me these little kids on twitter and facebook have any idea what they're talking about.
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
And to summarize my point, I don't think the issue is revising Islamic texts. Yes, some things need adapting to modern times, but people act like we need to re-write the Quran or something. That's not what is needed. What is needed is people understand what the heck they're reading or shut up and not use it justify their negative behavior and ideas.
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
That is where the indirect demand is going, if you hear all the media talk, articles after articles… nobody has “suggested” it yet, that is where it is headed to.
Anyways, a very good interview/analysis of Deepa Kumar about all this $hit… not necessarily “Daesh” but you should be understand bigger picture from here… if not aware of it already.
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
And my above argument is a response to those underlying tones in today's discourse about this topic.
The issue isn't Quranic text. It's about understanding words on a paper which apparently all these 20 yr old kids are nowhere qualified to do, since they're mostly academically stupid. And I mean that. They can't manage community college most of them. And they clearly aren't reading the Quran. I read the Quran and I don't see what they're seeing. They're clearly reading and listening to propaganda that is man written.
The solution. No need to rewrite the Quran. Solution is - teach real Islam.
Re: Daesh/ISIS in Pakistan
The solution. No need to rewrite the Quran. Solution is - teach real Islam.
astaghfsrullah azeem.... why are you labeling some of us as if we suggested to rewrite quran? do you understand this may label us as murtid and eligible for death?
where did i for example suggest that quran should rewritten? all i said was that there exists a d**eeply contentious jurisprudence that enables the jihadists to justify their existence and agenda plus lack of reformation within islam since 12th century
actually, the main targets of this radicalized and twisted ideology have been Muslims themselves i.e killings of Hazara Shias in Afghanistan and Pakistan to mad killing spree in Syria and Iraq, it is the Muslims that bear the brunt of this violent mindset....yet we will keep on blaming west for everything instead of asking for reformation within islam.
**I was talking about reformation in islam and redefining some readiclaized jurisprudence using ijmah and qayas which is allowed in islam