...Cultural Clash...

Lifestyle Relationships
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This question can be answered by anyone but more suitable audience would be those people who have both cultures in them: Desi culture as well as American (abroad) culture. Example: Someone like me who was born in Pakistan grew up there til mid teens and then moved to US and got higher education here and grew up here as well.

Question would be: Does anyone, who fits in the scenario above, also sometime feel that there is a cultural clash between us and parents? It’s a very tough situation to be in when desi parents have a typical desi mentality (ways of doing things) when it comes to handling certain situations and we as youngsters have a different solution to a problem.

If it doesn’t make any sense, I’ll take an example from many of the threads that I see in life forum. I read someone’s family wanted to go with the couple on their honeymoon. Obviously honeymoon is supposed to be some time alone between the husband and the wife, it’s NOT a family vacation. Desi parents want to do everything as FAMILY and sometimes have a hard time understanding that things like these should not be done as a FAMILY.

I wish I could give any other better examples but I am talking about cultural clash in general when there is one way desi parents would behave in a certain situation where American parents will do it differently, and their way is the better way. Do you find yourself in those situations? If you do, how do you handle those situations? Examples would be good and I’ll try to come up with personal examples.

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Re: …Cultural Clash…

definitely theres a cultural clash. i grew up mostly abroad, my parents gerw up mostly in pakistan and when we came to toronto, we all grew up together in different ways. my parents have finally realised that friends can be family and thats ok- for the longest time, they just wanted me to socialise with family members and were always questioning my choice of friends :rolleyes:
now that i’m married and my parents met all my friends and spent a lot of time getting to know them, my mom asks about them all the time! its great!
i think both parents and kids have to be willing to compromise and understand each other instead of imposing their own pov’s all the time on the other person- its really the only way you’re going to cultivate mutual respect. after a certain point, parents need to see their kids as fellow adults and treat them as such, and kids need to maintain respect for their parents while also trusting their own judgement and realising that making your own decisions isn’t wrong and sometimes, you just have to stand up and speak for yourself.
generally, i find desi mentality promotes too much of the “your parents know better and if you ever make your own decision without their approval, the world will end” perspective.
untrue.
how are you supposed to learn to be an independent individual unless you make mistakes and learn from them? you can’t blindly trust another persons pov, regardless of who it is. sometimes you have to ask questions, and your parents should be ok with you asking questions and trying something new. its not a sin. and learning that, for me and my parents, was a huge eye-opener and big, BIG factor in how good our relationship is now MA. we can actually discuss anything and hold our own in a conversation- and nobody walks away feeling sad or bad or depressed o angry.

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Re: …Cultural Clash…

I agree. I want to comment on a couple of things you said.

I was once watching a hindi drama on TV and the father in the drama said: Bachey chahey jitna marzi barey ho jaaein, hum maan baap unhe hamesha bachey samajhtey hain jab takk woh apna bara honey ka saboot nahi dey detey

What that basically means is that no matter how old our kids grow, we always see them as kids (which is fine) and we always treat them (not acceptable) as kids until one day when they prove (in this case by marrying against their will and moving out) otherwise.

I agree with this statement and what you said. I understand where parents are coming from, but they need to give us a chance to grow up, make mistakes. Otherwise, we will never learn.

One personal example: Every time I go out of town (honeymoon, anniversary trip, in-laws’ place in NY), they expect us (especially me) to call them EVERY DAY. yes, EVERY FREAKING DAY. I did that on my honeymoon and anniversary trip but not 2 weeks ago when I went to NY. I called them and told them I got there fine, I called the next day, then I called the following day (mom AND dad) but only spoke to mom but left a message on dad’s phone. He called me back but there were no signals in the basement so left a message (didn’t ask me to call him back). When I returned, after a week he brought it up and was pretty upset that I didn’t call him back.

He simply did not understand my point of view that everything was fine, I had spoken to mom and she knew everything is fine. Obviously if there’s a problem, I’ll call the family first but why call when everything is good? You go away from home on trips to actually GO AWAY FROM HOME, right? If you still wanna keep calling back home everyday, what’s the point of the trip? If you stop imposing what YOU want and give me a little freedom and give me a chance to miss family, may be I would miss family and call back?

Dad simply refused to understand my point and said I need to think about what I am saying because it’s wrong. I was like okay whatever :confused:

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Re: ...Cultural Clash...

I agree. While it is fine to check up on your kids when they are young, their activities and other things for protection etc, the parents should give the children some space and vice versa. The thing that I have observed among most desi parents and which I really hate is that the parents treat kids like kids (until the kid gets married). It's like you are a 7 yr old even when you are 24, and the moment you marry, you become "older"

Aaj Kiss Baat Par Gussa Aaya ??????
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Re: ...Cultural Clash...

^ Good point and I agree. It's really not the kids fault. In our case, I have always been a serious and organized person. I do my own stuff on time. Nobody needs to tell me what to do and when to do it because I am responsible. On the other hand my brothers, who are 22 and 21, are not as much responsible. Well they are, but mom still runs after them saying uth jaao, khana khaa lo, yeh kar lo, woh kar lo etc. and they like being pampered. When she TRIES to do that to me, it annoys it and I tell that to her that I am not a kid anymore. I guess as a mother she WANTS to pamper her kids (Everybody loves Raymond?) and my brothers don't mind it, that's why they get along with my mom without any problem.

When they get married and parents expect them to mature up overnight, is it really brothers' fault? Not entirely. They didn't wanna stand on their own feet and mom didn't want to let them grow up.

There is just so much that is screwed up in desi system. Dad acts like a typical FATHER, rather than a friend. I hope I am not like that with my kids. My goal is to be more of their friend so that they are not scared of talking to me but of course put my foot down where I must.

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Re: ...Cultural Clash...

you are right.
but also keep in mind that they keep supporting (financially, morally) us till we get married or sometimes even after that. This might be a reason too.

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Re: ...Cultural Clash...

@ Shikra:

I agree. Long time ago when I was taking a course, my professor said very interesting thing. He said that "students will act the way you (teachers) want them to act. If you make them do research papers using a scholarly website rather than googling the information, that is how they will feel and act. They will not feel like high-schoolers who just go to google and enter the topic there"

The same thing can be applied here as well. When you start treating your kids like responsible persons, they will feel that way and when you treat them like kids, well......don't yell at them when they do something stupid.

CB: I agree with you that they do support us (Alhamdulillah). But nevertheless, that does not mean that they should start treating their children like little kids.

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enni lammi thread :-/

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Re: ...Cultural Clash...

In some cases (i.e. my case), children contribute to the family, sometimes in monetary form and other times by non-monetary means such as help parents where their English stops, write bills for them, do favor to their FRIENDS etc. etc. etc. Sure they bring us up and take care of us when we are unable to take care of ourselves, but an argument should NEVER end at "We are your parents, do what we say".

I understand American parents also say this to their kids but they try to reason with them first, try to explain things but when stubborn children don't listen to them, that's when they use that line as a last resort. It seems like that just like our molvis, parents try not to explain things and quickly play their last card "I am your father, I am right, do what I say, you have no choice" etc.

Samad I'll send you the summary :D

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Re: ...Cultural Clash...

teenagers are weird. it's when you grow up that's when you realize hey our folks aren't too bad and it's ok to have them in our lives.

my do chawannian.

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Re: ...Cultural Clash...

^ We are talking about grown-ups here.

Another instance that I recall is this one (last year) time my brothers wanted to go to the park to play football. Now I don't like football and I don't know how to play it. I wanted to stay home but dad said I should come along too. I politely said I don't play football and I don't feel like going out. Instead of respecting what I wanted to do, he got upset and started saying how I am selfish and can't go for their khushi. I should sacrifice my khushi and go with them for their khushi.

Now, I know there are times when once must put behind what he/she feels and should do stuff that will make others happy. It would be one thing if my family member was getting an award and I am saying I'll be bored so I can't go ORRRRRRR the entire family wants to go the Chinese restaurant but I want to go to the Italian restaurant and I am not going with them for their khushi. Yes there are times when you must do stuff with your family but then there are times when you want to do what makes YOU happy. If I don't wanna go, I don't wanna go, don't force me. Respect MY khushi too, you know?

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^ shik jab baap bano gay na tu tan in batooN pe inalize kaRna :) auR apnay ko apnay parents ki jga pe rakhna and batana how you feel NOW
:)

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Shikra bhai,

simple common sense would have one think that as a married and or unmarried person geeting married in the future, bothw would have families which are able to let go of their adult child and enable the young couple to take time alone as the way it should be.

constant calling, spying on the routine or expecting to be strung along every where are not things that educated parents or siblings would do.
sometimes, it may not be their intent to be selfish and mean.
maybe, they just do not realize that a newly married couple, and even all couples in general deserve and have the right to their own independent plans and they should be left alone with their privacy.

it does not mean that the couple is or will ignore or forget the families.
it simply means that they need to be alone and experience life through travel.

it may sound unthought of, but this event called honey moon needs to be redefined.
unmarried women and men do not perhaps have that sense of to be claimed privacy.
but, still, cultural clash or not...travelling alone with one's new partner is not a bad idea and the families need to be mindful of that.

best,

Dushwari

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shikra bhai dil ki baat ki hai

i have been living away from home for 5 yrs now and to be honest there are times when i hate it.. feel really lonely and bored and wish kay i was with family... (they are like 5 hrs away) so i go back ONCE every MONTH but sometimes you have plans with friends and stuff and you might wanna skip that one trip for that MONTH .. man does that upset them.. plus i gotta call them every single day.. it gives me two impressions, either they dont' trust me or they are being over protective. My elder brother has broken out of this by simply stopped calling them every day and after few months of "tension" things kinda cooled down..

anyways... just my two point one cents..

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Re: ...Cultural Clash...

I can't think of any examples, especially such occurances in my family. My parents are quite understanding when it comes to keeping up with "zamana". They know what wasn't okay back then is actually ok now. It's a misconception that parents do not learn from their kids. They are the ones constantly trying to keep up with their kids and the new ways of doing things. They probably battle with these cultutal clashes more than we do.

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Can I give you a slightly different perspective on this?

My parents, myself and my siblings all born in Africa. My parents are pretty much open-mided without being too liberal. But yet I know they still consider us their "children" and always will. They do not make the unreasonable demands like following us on honeymoons etc but I know they are pretty much concerned about how we live our lives as well as bring up our kids...ie they show concern but do not force their beliefs down us.

So what I am tring to say is that if you are the first generation to leave your roots the culture clash will be there. You will see a more seamless relationship with your kids and they in turn with theirs. But in any case the complete letting go of kids and making them independent will still take plenty more generations for South Asians!

Hope I make sense.

5th ODI: Pakistan vs New Zealand at Hamilton - Feb 03, 2011
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Re: ...Cultural Clash...

I am sorry that you are struggling with this situation. My husband has been struggling with it for about 17 years now, and we haven't found a "real" solution to it. He is at an age where he wants to speak to his father as a man and compatriot, if that is the right word for it, but his father still treats him like a child. My younger BILs were pampered and babied, and as a result, neither one has a particularly strong work ethic or is capable of really doing for themselves without guidance.

In our case it is probably even worse because I never called every day and didn't realize for several years that anyone expected me to. There seems a real disconnect in south asian culture when it comes to acknowledging the fact that adult children are adults, and capable of making decisions. It doesn't surprise me anymore, but when we were first married I was shocked at the number of decisions adult children would pass off to their parents. When we bought our first house, my husband spent hours e-mailing photos to his family so that they felt involved in the process, and they were still upset about our final choice. We also sought my parents' advice, but they simply advised us about what to beware of, and told us that we needed to make this decision together as a couple.

My husband and I have discussed this on several occasions, and determined that while I was taught to think independently and make decisions based on the information available, seeking advice when necessary; he was raised to never make a decision on his own without consulting the family, because the decision of an individual should never be trusted.

I have some other thoughts on the reasoning behind this approach, but this is long enough already.... good luck to you! It hasn't been easy for us, and we are well into our thirties :).

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Shikra: I haven't read everything everyone has said...but about the calling thing...if your the only son maybe thats why...they might feel insecure....but if ur not....they might just also feel insecure cuz they could be getting old....and now that they see ur married they might feel that ur moving far away from them. But one thing I wanted to say to you is that when you have kids you might see things from their point of view....

Aaj Kiss Baat Par Gussa Aaya ??????
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Re: ...Cultural Clash...

NikamiJano & Pyari83 I understand your point of view. I am not a father yet, but I still put myself in a father's shoes when thinking about it. Forget a father-child relationship, let's take my and my wife's relationship. If she is running late from wherever, I don't call her to ask where she is. As long as I know where she is going and when she's coming back, that's enough. If she's a few minutes to an hour late, I don't worry. Yeah I would worry if she was supposed to be at home at 5 but it's now 9 and she's not here yet. What I am trying to say is that I understand where parents are coming from, but they should still respect what we want or how we want to do things. Will I change when I actually have my own kids, I don't know.

**Dushi, Ansoon, DHTN, Aly-Sam, & Amana: **Thank you for your inputs. I am not the only child, I have 2 brothers and 1 sisters, all younger than me. So it seems like I am not the only one in this situation, others are facing similar issues. It's not very encouraging to see that there's no way out though. I haven't yet made any BIG decisions yet by myself (buying a house, furniture etc.) but whenever I do talk about this stuff, parents do say that they wouldn't buy leather sofas, they wouldn't do this or that. I am not sure if it's advices or interfering. I am stubborn, I will do whatever pleases me because it will be my place. I realize that we should not fight with parents or make them angry, but if that's the last resort, then bet it. If reasoning fails, they can get mad and then calm down a few days later.

One of you mentioned that their sibling got out of calling everyday, parents were upset for a few days but then later they were fine. That's exactly what I plan on doing. Because I am straightforward, I have told my parents that I will not be calling everyday, that will simply not be happening. They asked me to re-think it instead of understanding it or respecting my wish. That leaves me to an option that I will agree that I will call everyday but once I move away, I will not. Is it wrong and bad? Yes. Do I have another choice? Not really.

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Re: ...Cultural Clash...

Shikra, I agree, its quite hard on your part esp since there's pressure. When we go against their wishes, things set off in the wrong pattern, as in a domino set... Try not to bring it to a point where you have to face them or argue to a point of yes or no. No matter how over protective they are, at the end of the day, they're our paretns...We'll regret it later even if they are wrong... I hope you understand what I'm trying to say here.

About the calling issue...maybe its a guy thing... I mean, I was away from family for five years...and I just had to talk to them every single day! Just couldnt sleep otherwise... My bro, ever since he's moved away, he calls atleast twice a day too.. I think this is because my parents are more like our friends rather than the typical desi ammi abbu k call kyoun nahi ki, kahan bz they....If he doesnt call, my mom calls and leaves a mssg at the end of the day asking if everything is ok...i dont find anything wrong with this...they've spent their lives raising us adn now as we move apart, it isnt so easy on them as they're getting old...for us, its just a phase of life with new adventures, partners, experiences, etc...

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