lets say that one person follows what he thinks is right… he follows sunnah and quran… he thinks he is right, he gets peace of mind and feels good about himself…
is it possible that he could be wrong… cause good feelings and peace of mind are only rewarded by Allah to some… so if this person thinks he is right and he in his own beliefs is doing whatever is right.. is it possible that he could be on a wrong path…?
so should i assume that no one can answer this question...
Ammarr
We have been given a five-point plan to follow. Follow that plan. Now in life you will come across many problems where you will need guidance, here you use the Quran and Hadith for your reference. It’s not too complicated so in my opinion you can’t go wrong.
I am sorry if you were expecting an answer with quotes from the quran and various hadith’s. For me it is quite straightforward. If we do the simple things right we will not be far wrong.
kajoor, thats exactly what i believe... i am one of those people who like to stay out of all the shia-sunni problems and complex discussions of whats right and wrong...
After all islam is the true religion and your heart usually points you in the right direction so if you follow islam and follow your heart when suspicious then it should turn out right...
what is meant by asking the above question was that lets say you follow a simple life, like the one described above, will you be punished or put into hell cause you didn't probe deep enough in search of what islam truly is...?
ammar.. I think you have hit the point..
In the end.. no one will know if they were on the right path until judgement day. We can only hope that we are doing what was expected of us.
But remember.. You can ask for forgiveness from Allah at any point in time.. and if He so wishes will forgive.. but He cannot forgive you for being unkind/ cruel to other people as only those people can forgive you.. and until those people forgive you, you may not enter heaven/ jannat.
Huqooq al Ibad in comparison to Huqooq Allah.
[quote]
Originally posted by blackzero:
**He cannot forgive you for being unkind/ cruel to other people as only those people can forgive you.. and until those people forgive you, you may not enter heaven/ jannat.
Huqooq al Ibad in comparison to Huqooq Allah.**
[/quote]
good point...!
Ammar I see your point.
What I would say is that you should have a clear understanding of what Islam is because only then you can follow and appreciate what Islam is in its true state and what it can offer you.
Most of the time we know what Islam say but we don’t follow.
We should always remember that if our intentions are right then Allah (swt) is always there to guide us and if we have made any mistakes then Allah (swt) is the most gracious and the most merciful.
[quote]
Originally posted by Kajoor:
We should always remember that if our intentions are right then Allah (swt) is always there to guide us and if we have made any mistakes then Allah (swt) is the most gracious and the most merciful.
[/quote]
Not to derail the conversation...but if the above is true, and I believe it is, then doesn't it also go that all those people we write off as non-Muslims (e.g. Ahmadis, shias, wahabis, barelvis, etc.) will benefit from the same mercy and benevolence of Allah (swt)?
Afterall....do they not also base their beliefs on the same principle - that they are Muslim and on the "right path".....
ditto muzna baji,
thats just what i want to know... will they be put in hell if they consider themselves right and follow whatever they think is right very religiously...?
also muzna baji, we can't call those people non-muslims... only Allah can decide..
[quote]
Originally posted by ammarr:
**ditto muzna baji,
thats just what i want to know... will they be put in hell if they consider themselves right and follow whatever they think is right very religiously...?
also muzna baji, we can't call those people non-muslims... only Allah can decide..**
[/quote]
Ammarr if you can understand that its only Allah (swt) who can decide who is a muslim and who is a non-muslim then how do you expect us to answer your question that will a peron go to hell if......
surely that decision is for Allah(swt) to make.
[quote]
Originally posted by Muzna:
** Not to derail the conversation...but if the above is true, and I believe it is, then doesn't it also go that all those people we write off as non-Muslims (e.g. Ahmadis, shias, wahabis, barelvis, etc.) will benefit from the same mercy and benevolence of Allah (swt)?
Afterall....do they not also base their beliefs on the same principle - that they are Muslim and on the "right path".....
**
[/quote]
To answer your question in one word.... YES.
But
To what dagree that is the real question.
I believe that a tribe in a remote part of the world, who have no access to worldly things that we have been granted with and who can only follow their tribal customs will benefit more than us, who have access to unlimited amount of resources and information.
[This message has been edited by Kajoor (edited December 09, 2000).]
Originally posted by ammarr:
...if they consider themselves right and follow whatever they think is right very religiously...?
But then those people have to find a firm basis for their convictions, if they believe in them so strongly...don't they?
Originally posted by Kajoor:
I believe that a tribe in a remote part of the world, who have no access to worldly things that we have been granted with and who can only follow their tribal customs will benefit more than us, who have access to unlimited amount of resources and information.
Why's that? I mean living in an isolated environment, where u're exposed to only one set of beliefs..one set of values...doesn't necessarily strengthen your beliefs..your convictions, it just sets a limit on what you know. Exposure to a multitude of ideas, attitudes, concepts doesn't have to weaken your beliefs...obviously it can lead to that, but at the same time it can also lead to the strengthening of one's beliefs can it not? I mean unless ur exposed to 'everything' you don't even know whether or not what you believe is right or wrong.
There's that line...can't remember where its from but it goes like this, Seek and you shall find.
[quote]
Originally posted by Kajoor:
** Ammarr if you can understand that its only Allah (swt) who can decide who is a muslim and who is a non-muslim then how do you expect us to answer your question that will a peron go to hell if......
surely that decision is for Allah(swt) to make.
**
[/quote]
but you see kajoor, religion is one thing where you cant afford to falter.... the reason for my question being that i hate going into these shia-sunni right/wrong discussions... i am satisfied with whatever islam i have been taught... so what i wanted to know was that i mean do we have to (or should we) debate about such things or should we go on with things that feel right to us...?
**
[quote]
Originally posted by Girl from Quraysh:
Exposure to a multitude of ideas, attitudes, concepts doesn't have to weaken your beliefs...obviously it can lead to that, but at the same time it can also lead to the strengthening of one's beliefs can it not? I mean unless ur exposed to 'everything' you don't even know whether or not what you believe is right or wrong. **
[/quote]
That is what I am trying to say. We are exposed to a wealth of information and therefore, we are in a prime position to question our beliefs if they need questioning or strengthen them if they need strengthening. We will not be able to say to Allah (swt) well I didn’t know, or followed so and so. Hence as I said Allah (swt) is the most merciful but we will benefit less of Allah (swt)mercy if we tried to use this excuse.
**
[quote]
Why's that? I mean living in an isolated environment, where u're exposed to only one set of beliefs..one set of values...doesn't necessarily strengthen your beliefs..your convictions, it just sets a limit on what you know. **
[/quote]
The tribe that I refer to are the one’s that live remote jungles; such a tribe are more concerned with getting the basic necessity of life. I bet in their daily endeavours to find food, cloth, shelter etc they remember Allah (swt) more times then we do. Yes, they should seek the truth but I think it is more difficult for them then it is for us. Moreover I think the onus is on us to spread the word of Islam to them. Isn’t that what we are supposed to do?
Seek and you shall find.... yes i know. oooh I won't be able to go to sleep now
[This message has been edited by Kajoor (edited December 09, 2000).]
Ammarr, question your own beliefs. Are they on firm a foundation?, do you have strong reasoning behind them? If you are happy then that’s good.
Ammar I just don’t want to follow what I have been taught. I was taught by my father (Allah (swt) unay janaat naseeb Kharay) he was very religious and pious person, what they told me was, when you stand before Allah (swt) you will answer for what you did in your life. I will not be there to hold your hand, and no one will be able to help you. You will not recognise who your mother, father, brother, sisters is). So what I do now is I question everything, what I have been taught is it right? What does the Quran say and the hadith say about my beliefs. This is because I have to answer Allah (swt) for my decisions.
We have access to a wealth of information, which we should use to our advantage and try strengthening our beliefs. May Allah (swt) guide us.
Ammarr I don’t like to get into shia/sunni arguments but I try to use them to my advantage. These arguments give us an opportunity to test and question our beliefs and hopefully strengthen them.
[This message has been edited by Kajoor (edited December 10, 2000).]
[quote]
Originally posted by Kajoor:
**Ammarr, question your own beliefs. Are they on firm a foundation?, do you have strong reasoning behind them? If you are happy then that’s good.
Ammar I just don’t want to follow what I have been taught. I was taught by my father (Allah (swt) unay janaat naseeb Kharay) he was very religious and pious person, what they told me was, when you stand before Allah (swt) you will answer for what you did in your life. I will not be there to hold your hand, and no one will be able to help you. You will not recognise who your mother, father, brother, sisters is). So what I do now is I question everything, what I have been taught is it right? What does the Quran say and the hedith say about my beliefs. This because I have to answer Allah (swt) for my decisions.
We have access to a wealth of information, which we should use to our advantage and try strengthening our beliefs. May Allah (swt) guide us.
Ammarr I don’t like to get into shia/sunni arguments but I try to use them to my advantage. These arguments give us an opportunity to test and question our beliefs and hopefully strengthen our them.
(edited December 09, 2000).]**
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i guess you are right... thanks for clearing some of my thinking up...!
listen mate. all i can say as long as u are in peace with your self thats what counts...to be right or wrong is upto Allah and wer'e only gona find out when we die.
Nothing in this world has put so many men on their feet as the alarm clock
[quote]
Originally posted by rizwanfareed:
**listen mate. all i can say as long as u are in peace with your self thats what counts...to be right or wrong is upto Allah and wer'e only gona find out when we die.
**
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Valid point Rizwan.
But one may argue that being at peace within yourself is not enough. Afterall, we do not live in isolation. We have families and individuals that depend on us. That is where our beliefs become crucial. They, our beliefs, determine how we interact. They govern our lifestyles....and most importantly they are what we pass on to our young.
I fear that just being at peace with myself will not be enough when my future son or daughter decides to question me.
[quote]
Originally posted by Girl from Quraysh:
There's that line...can't remember where its from but it goes like this, Seek and you shall find.
**
[/quote]
GFQ
It's from the bible.....if this is what you were referring to.
"Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; and it shall be opened unto you:
For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened"
[This message has been edited by Kajoor (edited December 10, 2000).]
SubhanAllah…thanks kajoor
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif
'Kay i’m going to do a ‘nova’ here wry smile am i a nut or what:)
M-baji, when our beliefs are called into question, when we can no longer adequately justify our state of mind…state of reason, and when we begin to have doubts, then we can longer say we are at peace…right?