Mixed marriages are becoming more and more common in pakistani families…right? Or wrong?
My question is regarding the relationship the family, including extended family, has with the non desi/muslim partner. Or rather, questions.
For the purposes of this thread lets say Partner A is a pakistani muslim and partner B is a nonpaki non muslim.
In mixed marriage situations;
-generally speaking, how well do the paki parents get along with Partner B?
-do you know anyone that has been “disowned” at some point because of a mixed marriage. And if so, have the parents now become more accepting?
-extended family; whats their relationship with Partner B like? Was there any conflict? Did the marriage have any significant impact on Partner A’s relationship with his/her extended family?
-children; how are they treated? Do u ever feel there is a difference in behaviour with a mixed child?
-current living situation; joint family system or living solo?
I understand that no two pakistani families are the same and different families will have different levels of tolerance. The aim here is to find out possible reactions that pakistanis may or may not have.
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
Interesting question Maula Jatt. I actually don't know many Pakistanis who have had mixed marriages or those who have married non Muslims. I don't know if it is common at all. I'd say not that common. I think it depends what religion the girl is if it is a Muslim-Non Muslim marriage and what race is involved. It would be interesting to know if the family would be more accepting if a Pakistani guy marries a Pakistani/Indian Christian girl compared to a European Christian girl.
I know of a far off example but don't know personally the dynamics involved. Would Pakistani/Indian marriages count as mixed? So this Pakistani guy married an Indian Sikh/Christian girl. The parents had been family friends for many years and knew each other. The parents of the children were both doctors who worked together. In the beginning it was tense and both sides of parents did not accept it. Both of them persevered. His parents did not go to the wedding and they got married in India. Her side of the family were there but mainly the parents. Her parents told her to adjust to fit in with the family.. The girl's father i heard was of the thought process she should convert so that the family would accept her and it would be easier for her. .. but both the boy and girl were not very traditional, not very religious and had similar outlook on life.
He was on the verge of being disowned earlier i think. But the parents have come around to it. They disagreed initially but now they get along with the wife. Both families also get along now
They are living solo overseas. No children. Although I think parents come around with children. Not sure about extended family.
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
Looking at the few couples i know , I think it work better for a pakistani man to marry non pakistani / non muslim than the pakistani woman marrying out of culture/faith.
men never really leave their own culture or faith in such marriage and either let the partner follow her own culture/faith or convince her towerds his.
women leave their parents home and in order to adapt in a different faith/culture, they usually adapt to the partner lifestyle: the clothings, the cooking, the going out areas.
I work in london city. Where i work, you will se every few pakistani or muslim girls that are actually proud and confident about their religion/culture. No fastings, dressing in skirts, eating non halal...all because they say they need to adapt for their profession. Many of these girls are engaged or married to non muslim.
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
One girl whom I'm related to married an east Asian guy. The guy converted, did the nikkah, the family was very supportive. The guy is in every picture with his in Laws with a wide smile. They're not very conservative so it was never going to be an issue.
Another family friend had a daughter who married a European guy who didn't want a nikkah. She completely cut ties with her family and they had no idea why. She stopped coming back to Pakistan and only the brother had an idea she was with someone. Finally they found out about the marriage, pleaded for her to come back and finally they're insisting that they just do a simple Nikkah instead of the court marriage for their peace of mind. The guy is vehemently anti-muslim and the girl says she isn't one either so no muslim rites are necessary. The parents are heartbroken and the brother is trying to mend the relationship.
One of my male relatives married one of his teachers. The real issue was she was old enough to be his mother. Ethnicity became a non-issue after that revelation. The parents meet the guy once every few years like all you would with a kid who lives abroad so I don't think the relationship suffered much.
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
I know quite a few.. I'm a product of a mixed marriage as well as being in one myself.. It's as easy or as hard as you make it imo..
I know of a few people outside my family who were disowned years ago but the parents came round and accepted the marriages in all but one case.. I think most parents don't have the heart to shut their kids out forever, even if they threaten to..
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
^I also agree that it is as easy or hard as you make it. I think, most often, issues arise because people are not on the same page, didn't discuss certain things and simply assumed their spouse agreed with them (when this was not the case).
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
I guess it varies from family to family.
-generally speaking, how well do the paki parents get along with Partner B?
I've seen some cases where they don't make a big deal of it to where they'll avoid interacting with A altogether. I'd say the latter type is more common, at least among those I know.
-do you know anyone that has been "disowned" at some point because of a mixed marriage. And if so, have the parents now become more accepting?
I've known of people who have been disowned for this type of thing, where parents never became more accepting.
-extended family; whats their relationship with Partner B like? Was there any conflict? Did the marriage have any significant impact on Partner A's relationship with his/her extended family?
For the ones who do accept the relationship, there was next to no impact. For those who didn't, extended family avoided interacting with them just like the immediate family.
-children; how are they treated? Do u ever feel there is a difference in behaviour with a mixed child?
Where they accept the relationship, I never felt there was a difference. Where they didn't, they never kept contact with them anyway, so there was no such behaviour to speak of.
-current living situation; joint family system or living solo?
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
initially my parents weren't thrilled by the idea but after meeting him, they were happy. we had a 'nikah' and he did convert for the sake of nikah just so that my parents and family will be able to accept our marriage. Neither of us are religious or care about it, so that never came between us. he is supposedly catholic but doesn't care much about it. I know a few other girls from muslim background who have married hindus, and christians, so far all of them have been quite happy. It all depends on how you feel about the religious differences and how much you actually follow religion. I know a guy whos supposedly religious, sits in eitkaaf during ramadan, did hajj, always posting hadith and religious quotes on facebook, but he's married to a christian girl who drinks, wears 'non-islamically approved' clothes such as short dresses, swimsuits, skirts and all that. they seem to be happily married. so i guess even though he's religious, it doesn't bother him that his wife is completely different. so it's different for everyone.
as far as families, they usually come around even if they initially disapprove. I don't care much for my distant relatives and I m sure they dont approve of my marriage, but i could care less. we didn't invite too many distant people to our wedding even, just some close relatives.
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
And I don't get this idea of why people think women tend to convert when they marry muslim men. They tend to SAY they convert, but I've seen plenty of marriages where a Pakistani guy married a non-desi, and sometimes the wife converts, and sometimes she doesn't. When she doesn't sometimes she tolerates her husband being religious, other times she doesn't. It varies. Then in those situations if your kids do not stay in your culture or marry a muslim, then don't be upset. It's the example you set for them.
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
I know ONE family where a man married a Christian woman, who wasn’t religious to begin with about Christianity. She was interested in Islam prior to marriage, and I think that’s why he married her, because she wanted a different type of spirituality than she was getting in Christianity. She eventually, years and years later, slowly grew into Islam, and her son is religious in a way. Americanized, but he reads the Quran and does what he’s supposed to. He married also a girl that is not Muslim, but she was interested, and she’s slowly learning Islam too.
The other married couples here, their wives do not participate in Islam for the most part. One of them pretends to, but then we will see her drinking and she posts about her drinking on facebook in front of everyone. Her kids when they were small went to masjid , but we don’t see them there anymore unless they’re using some other masjid. From their facebook, you see no mention of Islam.
Whether you guys like to believe it or not, there are lots of women who marry Pakistanis, because they’ll run into successful guys who take good care of their women compared to what these women were exposed to otherwise. And so they stick with the Pakistani man and are ok with cooking a salan once in a while and putting a duppatta on her head in front of other aunties and they act like they’re muslim in front of Muslims, and when they’re in front of non-muslims, they act like non-muslims.
The’re gold-diggers. The married you for the money, buddy, and you had your children with her. And then you want your kids to be muslim?
Thank you for responses everyone. I will respond to others. Just wanted to address this first.
Thats an extremely unfair generalisation pcg. And quite wrong too.
Also, its interesting to see you normally brand paki men as being uncivilised, raised with unfair privileges, servants of their mother, etc, but when it comes to discussing relationship with non paki girls, they become successful men that treat their wives well.
Pick one pcg. Whats the generalisation you wanna go with?
Or are you suggesting a pakistani husband will trear a gori wife better than a desi wife?
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
I don't know them personally but have heard of them. Guy belonged to a Mirpuri family and girl was white British. She converted to Islam, wore desi clothes, cooked saalan not sure about roti, but there was no way to please guys mum, she spoke in Mirpuri in front of the white girl, so she didn't understand it but all languages sound same when u're dissing the person, they made her life hell. They tried to push their son to divorce her but he had a spine and refused to leave her and moved out with his wife and daughters.
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
^It's not that strange or that rare. Not everyone who is extremely religious is preachy or expects others to be as religious as themselves. Some people, although quite religious themselves, aren't bothered by the fact that others around them aren't as religious.
It's also possible that the gentleman isn't as religious as he appears:
I know a guy who's supposedly religious, sits in eitkaaf during ramadan, did hajj, always posting hadith and religious quotes on facebook, but he's married to a christian girl who drinks, wears 'non-islamically approved' clothes such as short dresses, swimsuits, skirts and all that. they seem to be happily married.
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
I really don't buy that Muslim guys are more successful at keeping everyone in their family on the religious straight and narrow. I do believe mothers have more influence on younger children and who do you think the children are going follow. I mean one of my first words were the bismillah because that's what my mother said when she handed me the milk bottle. Are desi guys willing to micromanage their kids? And a lot of muslim guys are super relaxed in the beginning (after all how can their loins produce anything but muslim children) but as their kids toy with their boundaries they grow harsher and ultimately push them even further away.
And just because muslim men have eschewed muslim garb longer than muslim women doesn't mean they're not bypassing the dress code or muslim behaviour. If we're going judge women than we can't forget men doing the drinking and dating, can we? After all how are thats how they're getting their non-muslim wives.
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
I don't know them personally but have heard of them. Guy belonged to a Mirpuri family and girl was white British. She converted to Islam, wore desi clothes, cooked saalan not sure about roti, but there was no way to please guys mum, she spoke in Mirpuri in front of the white girl, so she didn't understand it but all languages sound same when u're dissing the person, they made her life hell. They tried to push their son to divorce her but he had a spine and refused to leave her and moved out with his wife and daughters.
:( Are things better for them now? I know that also happens in indian families when someone likes a white person.
For rotis there is the new roti maker. I'm glad the guy had a spine.
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
initially my parents weren't thrilled by the idea but after meeting him, they were happy. we had a 'nikah' and he did convert for the sake of nikah just so that my parents and family will be able to accept our marriage. Neither of us are religious or care about it, so that never came between us. he is supposedly catholic but doesn't care much about it. I know a few other girls from muslim background who have married hindus, and christians, so far all of them have been quite happy. It all depends on how you feel about the religious differences and how much you actually follow religion. I know a guy whos supposedly religious, sits in eitkaaf during ramadan, did hajj, always posting hadith and religious quotes on facebook, but he's married to a christian girl who drinks, wears 'non-islamically approved' clothes such as short dresses, swimsuits, skirts and all that. they seem to be happily married. so i guess even though he's religious, it doesn't bother him that his wife is completely different. so it's different for everyone.
as far as families, they usually come around even if they initially disapprove. I don't care much for my distant relatives and I m sure they dont approve of my marriage, but i could care less. we didn't invite too many distant people to our wedding even, just some close relatives.
Did the parents come around when they married with the examples you mention? did the Indians/pakistani non muslims convert like they should have ? Did parents come around?
Re: Consequences of a mixed faith/cultural marriage
^It's not that strange or that rare. Not everyone who is extremely religious is preachy or expects others to be as religious as themselves. Some people, although quite religious themselves, aren't bothered by the fact that others around them aren't as religious.
It's also possible that the gentleman isn't as religious as he appears:
There is a difference between others and your spouse. Apparently he isn't religious at all.
?