Chechnya at a Glance

Society Pakistan & World Affairs
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It always surprised me why Russia doesn’t let Chechnya exist as independently as it let many other states to exist that once used to be part and parcel of USSR federation. Whether it is because of Chechnya’s Muslim ethnic background or is it due to the fact that Chechnya exists in Caucasus, a major Oil-producing region, remains to be decided. Pakistan has always maintained an ethical stand on Chechnya issue supporting Chechnya’s struggle for independence and urging rest of the world to understand the difference between terrorism and fight for independence. We Pakistanis are extremely sympathetic towards all those nations who are fighting for their independence because we completely understand how valuable independence is. After all we also won it 55 years ago…. More than 30,000 Chechnians are dead by now and I name this thread to Chechnya’s complete independence and for that matter I pray for a complete independence of all those who are currently suppressed by brutal state terrorism.

Chechnya at a Glance

By The Associated Press

August 28, 2004, 1:08 PM EDT

A glance at Chechnya and its conflict:

GEOGRAPHY: Oil-producing region in Caucasus Mountains in southern Russia; 5,000 square miles.

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POPULATION: Preliminary figures from official 2002 census put population at more than 1 million, about same as estimated 1994 prewar population. Tens of thousands of refugees live in neighboring Ingushetia region. Population mostly Muslim.

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HISTORY WITH RUSSIA: Conquered by czarist armies in 1859 after decades of war, but Chechens never accepted Russian rule. During World War II, dictator Josef Stalin ordered Chechens deported en masse to Kazakhstan. Many died. The rest returned in 1950s after Stalin’s death.

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CURRENT CONFLICT: Chechen President Dzhokhar Dudayev declared area’s independence in 1991. Russian troops invaded to oust Dudayev in December 1994, setting off 20-month war that killed up to 30,000, including Dudayev. Afterward, Chechnya was de facto independent and plunged into lawlessness. Fighting resumed in 1999, when Russian troops invaded again following raids by Chechen rebels into neighboring region and bombings that killed some 300 at apartment buildings in Russian cities. Russian leaders blamed bombings on Chechens. Akhmad Kadyrov, a former separatist, was elected president in an October election that was widely criticized. He was killed May 9 at age 52 in a bomb blast at a Victory Day parade in Grozny.

Copyright © 2004, The Associated Press

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Re: Chechnya at a Glance

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by phoenixdesi: *
It always surprised me why Russia doesn’t let Chechnya exist as independently as it let many other states to exist that once used to be part and parcel of USSR federation. Whether it is because of Chechnya's Muslim ethnic background or is it due to the fact that Chechnya exists in Caucasus, a major Oil-producing region, remains to be decided.
[/QUOTE]

It's because those other states were never part of Russia. They were instead part of the USSR.

Remember that the USSR consisted of many states, such as Russia, Ukraine, Lithuania, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan, etc.

Chechnya was never one of those states. It had been annexed by Russia in the 1800s and at the time of the break up of the USSR was still considered to be an integral part of Russia, rather than a constituent state of the USSR.

Russia's main fear, apparently, is that if Chechnya becomes independent, particularly following armed struggle, it could trigger similar freedom struggles in other areas of Russia where the population is not predominantly ethnically Russian.

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Chechnya at a glance,… Russian triangle Western interest or conspiracy and narco-mafia struggle?
What was Chechnya till 1870? Where it was? Chechens, habitants of Caucasus Mountains at the southern side of river Cherek, main profession…anything but labour, yes anything from horse hijacking to looting of passengers, mutual conflicts, nothing else.
Permanent conflict with Russian police and army. At last both the parties came to conclusion. Russian handed over the city Grozny on the western side the river in 1870 to Chechens, so that they could start a civilized life.
But, permanent, century old habits never die. Chechens continued making money by all means. But now, they had an area in plains, Groznyy, later capital of Chechnya.
Chechens did not give up old habits, conflict with Russians increased. As usual, Religion is involved.
Chechen was a part of Russia, always and not integrated into USSR by Communist regime.
Why Russia should give up and to whom?
Chechen, hundreds of fighting groups on the name of freedom fighting, hijacking, kidnapping, making ransom money not only from Russian, but from any one in surrounding regions, as well as from each other, and any one can become the target, starting from children to members of red cross.
Muslims must help Chechen Muslim brothers, but there is some reason that Muslims of Russia or from earlier USSR regions do not like Chechens.
Muslims from Pakistan, from some arab countries and some Africans have joined Chechen brothers in struggle, but no one has returned from Chechnya. Off course it is not in Chechen’ interests that outer Muslim world know of their life. Amin.

There are many interests, West needs that Russia remains a loose country.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by anjjan: *
Chechnya at a glance,… Russian triangle Western interest or conspiracy and narco-mafia struggle?
What was Chechnya till 1870? Where it was? Chechens, habitants of Caucasus Mountains at the southern side of river Cherek, main profession…anything but labour, yes anything from horse hijacking to looting of passengers, mutual conflicts, nothing else.
Permanent conflict with Russian police and army. At last both the parties came to conclusion. Russian handed over the city Grozny on the western side the river in 1870 to Chechens, so that they could start a civilized life.
But, permanent, century old habits never die. Chechens continued making money by all means. But now, they had an area in plains, Groznyy, later capital of Chechnya.
Chechens did not give up old habits, conflict with Russians increased. As usual, Religion is involved.
Chechen was a part of Russia, always and not integrated into USSR by Communist regime.
Why Russia should give up and to whom?
Chechen, hundreds of fighting groups on the name of freedom fighting, hijacking, kidnapping, making ransom money not only from Russian, but from any one in surrounding regions, as well as from each other, and any one can become the target, starting from children to members of red cross.
Muslims must help Chechen Muslim brothers, but there is some reason that Muslims of Russia or from earlier USSR regions do not like Chechens.
Muslims from Pakistan, from some arab countries and some Africans have joined Chechen brothers in struggle, but no one has returned from Chechnya. Off course it is not in Chechen’ interests that outer Muslim world know of their life. Amin.

There are many interests, West needs that Russia remains a loose country.
[/QUOTE]

Interesting comments and honestly I am not aware of exact Chechnya situation so I am not in position to comment....all of my knowledge of Chechnya’s situation is media-based and I do understand that most of the times media presents news based on its own agenda. I Would urge some other guppy to address anjan’s comments but only if he/she is well aware of Chechnya’s situation. Please do not get into another religious bashing debate and lets keep it as informative as possible. Thanks

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anjaan comments are biased as usual.

To blame chechenya for Russias problem is very simplistic and racist it is similar to when white amerikka blames its black population for all criminal activities.

Chechnya does have criminals but so does any other country on planet earth. The russians have got the most sadistic mafia on planet earth at the moment for the Russian government to say all problems is the fault of the chechens is really baseless.

Criminals cannot fight an army the size of Russia only people like the freedom fighters who have sincere beleif in what they are fighting for can. And the chechens have been giving the Russians a bloody nose time and time again despite there very small size.

Russians for there intrest do not want any state to seperate from them because it will become like domino affect. similar to India they do not want to let Kashmir go because that will trigger the other states into similar indepence action.

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Chechnya’s president-elect pledged to bring peace and stability to his war-torn southern Russian region today after the Kremlin-backed candidate was elected in a vote tainted by allegations of fraud and overshadowed by fears of terrorism.

Alu Alkhanov, whom election officials said received 74% of Sunday’s vote, also vowed to crack down on corruption that has undermined Moscow’s efforts to restore civil society to a dysfunctional republic ravaged by a decade of fighting and chaos.

Fraud allegations marred the balloting. A representative of candidate Movsur Khamidov said he found ballot boxes at one polling place stuffed shortly after it opened. Abdullah Bugayev, another candidate, said he witnessed an Alkhanov campaign worker ordering people to vote for him at a polling station.

Chechen election commission chairman Abdul-Kerim Arsakhanov said there were no violations and that turnout was about 85%, even though voters appeared sparse at many polling stations.

Several voters in the capital Grozny – where blocks of apartment buildings stand gutted from earlier fighting and where few pedestrians were seen on Sunday – were openly sceptical of the results.

The International Helsinki Federation for Human Rights and its Russian affiliate said that “minimum international standards for holding free and fair elections do not exist in Chechnya” and that Russian electoral authorities kept competitors out to ensure Alkhanov’s victory.

The group’s director, Aaron Rhodes, said that ”manipulating democracy to produce a predetermined outcome is neither fair nor a solution” to Chechnya’s problems, according to a statement. Officials in the Moscow-backed Chechen government barred Alkhanov’s only serious challenger from running in the election.

Russian forces have been unable to wipe out Chechen rebels in two wars over the past decade and the Kremlin, refusing to negotiate, has focused on trying to restore trappings of civil society, such as elections.

Chechnya’s more than one million residents live in a deeply troubled region. Nearly three-quarters of the population is jobless, electricity and telephone service are largely non-existent, and tens of thousands of people have fled while hundreds have disappeared in kidnappings blamed on rebels, Russian forces and allied paramilitaries.

Alkhanov was the unquestioned favourite among the seven candidates and the Kremlin made clear its support. He appeared alongside Russian President Vladimir Putin repeatedly on state-run television, including during Putin’s surprise visit to Kadyrov’s grave this month.
Fraud Claims as Putin’s Favourite Wins Chechen Election

Criminal Russian government at it again with there deception and fraud. Then they have the nerve to call chechens crooks!

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Don't worry - the Chechyans will give the Rusiians their due reward for rigging this election, inshallah :)

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What is "their due"? Blowing up civilian planes, killing theater-goers or detroying apartment buildings?

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^^

What would you suggest a suitable punishment on a country's government and military would be for rigging elections?

I'm personally hoping for an attack on a political target, say, the Kremlin, or against the Russian Interior Ministry that is directing much of the repression in Chechnya.

Political targets have always been legitimate wartime goals, so can't possibly be considered terrorism.

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Well the Kremlin or Interior Ministry would be a step forward from theaters and civilian aircraft for sure. But I don't put too much credence into someone's interpretation of a "suitable punishment" when that person thinks execution is the suitable punishment for a sexual orientation that is different from their own.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: *
^^
Political targets have always been legitimate wartime goals, so can't possibly be considered terrorism.
[/QUOTE]

But since the namards cannot attack these targets they can always choose to blow up a train or bus and kill many innocent civilians.

Of course their fellow "moral supporters" can blame it on a Jewish conspiracy with a wink and a nod.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Seminole: *
... when that person thinks execution is the suitable punishment for a sexual orientation that is different from their own.
[/QUOTE]

*Disclaimer: Cheering the execution of faggots is entirely dependent on evidence being produced that they have committed anal sex.

Disclaimer 2: We're now off-topic*

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Talwar: *

But since the namards cannot attack these targets they can always choose to blow up a train or bus and kill many innocent civilians.

Of course their fellow "moral supporters" can blame it on a Jewish conspiracy with a wink and a nod.
[/QUOTE]

you dont even know what the hell is going on in chechnya. majority of the operations by chechens have been against high level govt. sites and heavily protected military bases/convoys. there might be few well publicized incidents of "civillians" being targetted, but almost all of the actions are conducted against armed men of russian army, KGB agents or collaborators in the chechen govt.

so stop repeating the lies of your masters.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by ThandyMazaq: *
you dont even know what the hell is going on in chechnya. ....
[/QUOTE]

tsk! tsk! tsk! Losing your cool Tandy? Attack ideas man, not the poster. Haven't you seen the rules? Oh well! That is too much to ask from the MATs.

Chechnya was relatively free before they invaded Dagestan. Unfortunately Araab terrorists forced them to quit peaceful rehab of Chechnya and embark on newer and bigger targets.

MAT terrorists have gone totally out of control. Killing unarmed civilians is just their favorite past time. It is time to take revenge of the two unarmed Pakistanis beheaded by MAT terrorists. It is time to send in 10,000 Pak-army troops and beat the crap out of those fiddie fidayeens.

Khuda Hafiz

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:k: It is a red-letter day for tolerance when Moratoriums and Zero Tolerance policies prevent people from discussing possible actors to play historic figures and then allow this kind of hate. Is this the 95% that GS is primarily catering to? To think that in this country (where probably most of guppies abroad live) the big fight is whether or not homosexuals should have the legal right to marry and here people call for their execution.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by antiobl: *

tsk! tsk! tsk! Losing your cool Tandy? Attack ideas man, not the poster. Haven't you seen the rules? Oh well! That is too much to ask from the MATs.

Chechnya was relatively free before they invaded Dagestan. Unfortunately Araab terrorists forced them to quit peaceful rehab of Chechnya and embark on newer and bigger targets.

MAT terrorists have gone totally out of control. Killing unarmed civilians is just their favorite past time. It is time to take revenge of the two unarmed Pakistanis beheaded by MAT terrorists. It is time to send in 10,000 Pak-army troops and beat the crap out of those fiddie fidayeens.

Khuda Hafiz
[/QUOTE]

yes i did get a little angry because keep hearing the mantra from the secular mouthpieces is annoying.
but dont worry, i havent lost it ...
dagestan invasion was due to the fact that russian butchers were conducting raids in dagestan like they used to do in chechnya. rounding up people suspected of "wahabite sympathies" and the dagestani mujahids along with the chechen mujahids attacked and destroyed one of the parties that had been conducting roundups in villages. you can believe all you want the crap the russian media spews out, but you still cant change the fact that every day russians are being sent to hell by the chechen mujahids. its only the massive attacks you hear about on fox, but regular skirmishes go on every day, resulting in the population increase of hell.

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Yet another “glorious” strtike by the “brave” Chechens.

Moscow suicide bombing kills 8

What a bunch of bravehearts!

It takes guts to blow up women and children.

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This is a war between the law and the outlaw.
This not 10 or 15 year old struggle, but has been continuing for four centuries. Every time the Russian militia crusshes the rebles, after a time gap, a new generation grows up.
Only this time the Chechens have good approach to arm factories.
An independent Chechnya will be very very dangrous than a rebeliuos Chechnya.
An independent Chechnya will be more dangrous than the Taliban state of afghanistan.
talibans were honest to the teachings of Deobandi, whereas Chechens will use Islam for meeting dirty ends.
Just imagine an independent narco-trafic door to and fro to Europe under the disguise of Islam!

By the way, if Chechens were not Muslims, could Muslims so blindly support them, hence Muslims have never supported the Tibatans.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by anjjan: *
.....By the way, if Chechens were not Muslims, could Muslims so blindly support them.....
[/QUOTE]

By the way, if Ruskies were not commies, could Bharatis so blindly support them during Afghan invasion?

Bharat's actions were so shameful during the years of commie termite eating the soul of Afghanistan. Sad indeed!

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by anjjan: *
This is a war between the law and the outlaw.
This not 10 or 15 year old struggle, but has been continuing for four centuries. Every time the Russian militia crusshes the rebles, after a time gap, a new generation grows up.
Only this time the Chechens have good approach to arm factories.
An independent Chechnya will be very very dangrous than a rebeliuos Chechnya.
An independent Chechnya will be more dangrous than the Taliban state of afghanistan.
talibans were honest to the teachings of Deobandi, whereas Chechens will use Islam for meeting dirty ends.
Just imagine an independent narco-trafic door to and fro to Europe under the disguise of Islam!

By the way, if Chechens were not Muslims, could Muslims so blindly support them, hence Muslims have never supported the Tibatans.
[/QUOTE]

why dont you come out openly and say that you believe that all muslims should be eliminated from this earth? this fake attitude that you somehow care for muslims is pathetic.

chechens have been butchered by the russians for so long and yet we have a person defending the russians. do you even know that stalin the dog of ussr sent the entire chechen nation to central asia for supposedely helping the nazis? russian soldiers came and put the million or so chechens in box cars meant for livestock and shipped them to their "rehabilitation" camps in central asia. males and females were put in same containers without regard for the fact that shame and modesty is prevalant in chechen culture due to islam. there were reports that some women had their kidneys burst due to holding their urine because they could not go in the bucket provided as a toilet. only barbaric human eating monsters can support the russians against the justified struggle of chechens. all those muslims who cheer for russian man eaters, have some shame and fear allah.