Okay fellas, I am and I think what Crescent is trying to say is that you believe in the hadith, than you cannot go about picking and choosing which ones are right and which ones are wrong unless they are against what the Quran says, that job should be left to scholars of Islam, that is the point. Now that doesn't mean I think the hadith are infallible, some may be made up, but if you start picking and choosing you might end up accepting false hadith and rejecting true hadith, that is the risk you take when you start picking and choosing, that is the point. Can I get some sort of response for that.
^^ yes. And also, we know Sahih Bukhari and Muslim have 'sahih' hadiths. The Quran is explained using Hadiths.
See what people today don't understand is that, back in the day the Tabayeen and the tabatabayeen were not like us. They had eimaan on a level we can never reach!!
Even a sheppard in those days was probably higher in eimaan than the biggest of the biggest mufti we have today. These people were friends of allah, swords of allah, warriors of allah swt.
And most of them sat, ate, slept beside, talked to, hugged, met, the prophet pbuh in some way or another, and they all have the same stories and the same sunnah as other people have.
Its a simple concept to understand.
Its just wrong to say, if some hadith doesn't seem right, its wrong, and its infallible and some "mullah" came along and made it up.
no? Yes it was preserved becuase Allah SWT wanted it to be preserved. That is why Allah SWT keeps saying in the Quran to follow Allah and His messenger...How can that be done unless Allah SWT preserves the Hadeeth/Sunnah of His Beloved Prophet SAW? NO No body is saying Bukhari and other books are devine revelations...However the phenomenon of hadeeth compilation is - becuase Allah willed it to be. This is the aqeedah of Ahl Sunnah wal Jammah. All of them.
........................
BTW, you didn't answer my question regarding "FAKE" ahadith.
/quote]
I will answer that when one of the Hadeeth doubters/questioners or the blatant rejectors attempts the challange questions.
Remember I asked the questions first!!!
There is difference between Allah swt's will and His promise, I am very hopeful you understand the difference.
[quote]
I will answer that when one of the Hadeeth doubters/questioners or the blatant rejectors attempts the challange questions.
Remember I asked the questions first!!!
[/quote]
stop playing childish games, if you have something to say then say it.
I think people like Captain 1, poic, and I and some others have answered this so-called "challenge". I'm sorry, but I'm not a participant in a reality game show, so what knowledge and logic I could have put forth, I have. Its in front of you. To be quite honest, many of the arguments being used to support radical and illogical theories like the hadeeth are infallible and Al-Bukhari and such scholars were given divine knowledge, etc etc are just bogus. I've never heard any present-day scholar put forth such theories in their talks, and I'm amazed there are muslims out there that believe as such.
Again, look at it realistically. How many hadith's do YOU follow? I can guarantee almost every guppy in this thread has not read all of the hadith in the collection, even, and yet they're so keen to accept them all as true and infallible and unaltered from what the Prophet actually did or said.
Again, look at it realistically. How many hadith's do YOU follow? I can guarantee almost every guppy in this thread has not read all of the hadith in the collection, even, and yet they're so keen to accept them all as true and infallible and unaltered from what the Prophet actually did or said.
no one in the thread has said this. Kudos for another deviated response.
Again, look at it realistically. How many hadith's do YOU follow? I can guarantee almost every guppy in this thread has not read all of the hadith in the collection, even, and yet they're so keen to accept them all as true and infallible and unaltered from what the Prophet actually did or said.
I challenge you and ask you how much of Quran do you follow, open you eyes little girl for heaven sake. This is not about following the thread is completely for you and your sake its a challenge prove us wrong.
1) You havent provided with any reference
2) You should mention the ayah from the Quran, which states only follow Quran and not the ahadith.
3) You should have challenged Antumul Alona common you seem to be intelligent. Instead you are going round in circles.Well Antumul Alona has to be proven wrong but none of you challenged his specific questions common Pull up your socks prove him wrong.
following hadith is not an "all-or-nothing" principle.... so I dont see how can we classify people as such
some hadith that scholars you favor might find weak but might be considered authentic by other scholars .....who will decide between the two? none of them is infalliable
this has led some skeptics to reject ALL hadith , obviously they are misguided
Please state the post # that has answered or attempted to answer the challenge.
So-called hadeeth rejection theorists can try a so-called challenge for them to prove themselves as well.
[quote=]
To be quite honest, .....................and Al-Bukhari and such scholars were given divine knowledge, etc etc are just bogus. I've never heard any present-day scholar put forth such theories in their talks, and I'm amazed there are muslims out there that believe as such.
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MashAllah. you are keen on making 2+2 =5. lolz! at your responses. Who said Bukhari was given divine knowledge? tell me a name of a reputed scholar that you follow? (please don't say Aamina Wadood) - **
**Prophet SAW's hadeeth compilation is a divine decree because Allah SWT wanted his messengers sunnah to be followed. The collectors were collected divine knowledge of Hadeeth (saying / sunnah or Prophet SAW) - They were not being sent revelation on them
Lol!
*I guess people like you are not even Rejectors of Hadeeth you are Quran selectors as well. You blatantly ignore the verses of the Quran that talk about obeying the prophet. *
ANSWER THIS PCG: **
**CHALLENGE no. 3 for you only:
*1. CAN YOU FOLLOW THE PROPHET from Quran only----? ANSWER this question? *
I am sure your next post will not be an answer of this but your conitnued rhetoric...
Both Das REich and Ravage…
discuss the challenge please…::::
Stick to the topic of the thread…::::: it is a challenge for hadeeth rejectors..for that open a new thread please…
We are not talking about which hadeeth which scholar accepts or not…
I agree with your challange and hadith rejectors cannot answer it however there is one subtle thing I wanted to state. Did you think through the consequences of the way you are handling this thread? Many might disagree with me however your challenge is contesting the hadith rejectors in a way that would now evern deter them from believing in the Quran possibly, did you think through this before you started pointing fingers here. I think it would have been better to let them believe in Quran only and use another more alluring way to get them follow hadith rather than pull out a pistol and shoot them and also cast doubts in their mind about the authenticity of the Quran now. They doubt the authenticity of the hadith for the same reasons you are questioning them to prove the revelation and compilation of the Quran. At the end of the day you are all about winning this argument not bringing them back to the straight path. This is the difference when you argue with newly found knowledge without pondering on how to use it.
Think about the way you are handling this and question yourself whether you are doing them a service or actually creating more confusion in their minds now. Preach and when you preach, preach with fairness and wisdom.
When you want to convince someone of something you do not do it by proving them wrong but by providing a more viable alternative to get them away from what they are following.
^ USR
Jazak Allah Khair for the concern and I am sure no one here wants any one to leave islam. but we also don’t want Islam being adulterated.
There are many innocent visitors here on GS that will be infected by the beliefs of a few hadeeth rejectors. We want to save them as well!! Allah is the only one Who can really Save anyone. We want to try our worth.
Faith is simple - Kalima Tawheed - No God but Allah and Muhammad SAW is His messenger - The last part though is jsut as critical and it holds a faithful to follow the sunnah of Allahs prophet SAW.
Like my friend Lahore ka Cheetah said it very succinctly dear:
"those who reject hadeeth are not muslim "
This is the aqeedah of Ahl Sunnah WAl Jammah. PEople who are not clear rejectors but have a cursive view on it should be careful. Those who are clear rejectors are in deep trouble as regards their faith and they don’t even know it. Allah SWT alone knows.
WE want to urge who are using blasphemous comments about the prophet sA, his wives (mother of belivers) and the companions that they are standing on the edge of their own faith.
Surely, they realize that and you pointing it out does not make it any better. However is your intention to win them back or just belittle them. If it is to win them back then I do not see that happening here or even remotely getting close to it. There is a fine line between hadith rejector and one who rejects Muhammad SAW. Please mark this difference. Hadith rejectors do not deny Prophet Muhammad SAW but rather are skeptic about the hadith, which are attributed to the Prophet Muhammad SAW. Rejecting hadith is not blasphemous because the person is not denying Prophet Muhammad SAW but the person is denying those who are reporting about Prophet Muhammad SAW. So don’t be trigger happy and cast them out of the lot of muslims, the hadith scholars threw out so many hadith, does that mean they should be thrown out of the lot of muslims, clearly No. These people may not be knowledgible but they are under the same category of people who reject hadith because they cannot verify it. Just that hadith rejectors of today do not do their homework and yet make claims, this is the only difference between a scholar rejecting a hadith and a common person rejecting it. The reason why we are not able to convince hadith rejectors is because we convict them for the wrong issue. Instead of labeling them as kafirs and non-muslims explain in detail the compilation of hadith and about its authenticity. Did you bother to inquire why they reject hadith? Solutions to problems are given when a description of the problem is known and its reasons for happening.
There are also many innocent visitors here who will not come again or want to be part of muslim brotherhood because we cannot even tolerate each other and solve things peacefully.
