I believe Pakistan has a greater talent pool than India.
Its much sadder to see out talented people copying others.
We should know that there is a difference between Inovation and Imitation. If we cant produce orignal things then atleast we should try to innovate.
This goes to >>> Junoon, Faakhir, Jawad Ahmed, Haroon, etc.
Oh my gosh I think Shehzad Roy is the only one i think of who does not copy.
[quote]
Originally posted by Asif_k:
** It's not bad to copy things as long as due credit is given. Imagine What would have happened If all the inventions were used only by those countries.
**
[/quote]
so do they give any credits from where they got the song from, I don't think so.
The last thing I knew that AR Rahman was the composer.
[quote]
Originally posted by UMAIR316:
** so do they give any credits from where they got the song from, I don't think so.
The last thing I knew that AR Rahman was the composer.
**
[/quote]
Are you implying that every time we use our Telephone - We thank Graham Bell ?? Or every time we light the Electric bulb, We should Thank Alva Edison ? Buddy If you had seen the Filmfare award show where Gulzar received the award for that song,While receiving the award, He openly admitted this as a Punjabi folk song by Bulle Shah. Please get over it.
AK
So what have we learnt today from the previous reply Umair? It is ok for a guy to copy someone elses song (if hes an indian) and not give the real song composer any credit...
New inventions are patented... Companies then pay large amounts of money then to buy em off... This is not the case for songs, you can just copy and earn money off it, like you would use a bulb...
Brilliant analogy!!
[quote]
Originally posted by Sheikh Khalid:
**I believe Pakistan has a greater talent pool than India.
We should know that there is a difference between Inovation and Imitation. If we cant produce orignal things then atleast we should try to innovate.
This goes to >>> Junoon, Faakhir, Jawad Ahmed, Haroon, etc.
Oh my gosh I think Shehzad Roy is the only one i think of who does not copy.**
[/quote]
Pakistan has a larger talent pool true, thats pretty evident, but I dont think the guys u mentioned above are copy cats... The only big copy cat I remember was Sajjad Hassan, but then he stopped doing that.
Ohh !! Suddenly I notice fits of Morality just because some composer composed one tune on the lyrics of a Punjabi folk Singer(Punjabi is spoken in India as well). But Same people proudly proclaim and support when numerous Pirated copies of every Indian movie are circulated and watched in Pakistan and happy that in a way it is harming Bollywood.
In India, we have to buy records/Tapes/cds (EMI ones) If we want to listen to any of the Pakistani singers, but in Pakistan just simple get a pirated copy from Al Mansoor and that should do it.
So much for the morality and double standards. Nice lesson learnt.
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/rolleyes.gif
AK
[This message has been edited by Asif_k (edited May 03, 2002).]
ar e you implying that music was invented by Indians?
[quote]
Originally posted by Asif_k:
** Are you implying that every time we use our Telephone - We thank Graham Bell ?? Or every time we light the Electric bulb, We should Thank Alva Edison ? Buddy If you had seen the Filmfare award show where Gulzar received the award for that song,While receiving the award, He openly admitted this as a Punjabi folk song by Bulle Shah. Please get over it.
**
[/quote]
Nice One.
But I think piracy is a whole different Issue than openly copying and openly getting awards and credit for it.
[quote]
Originally posted by AliBeta:
*ar e you implying that music was invented by Indians?
*
[/quote]
I never said so. What is your point ? Music was created when god created Nature.
[quote]
Originally posted by Sheikh Khalid:
But I think piracy is a whole different Issue than openly copying and openly getting awards and credit for it.
[/quote]
Sheikh Saheb, Gulzar Saheb didn't take credit for it, While receiving the filmfare award he himself said that, That he had taken this song from a Punjabi Song and it is a well documented fact. Isn't it good that such a nice composition has reached to millions of other people and has given them an opportunity to enjoy and be happy for a moment. Sometime back In India we had a serial called 'Mirza Ghalib'. Naseeruddin Shah played the role of Ghalib Saheb, and the producer of that serial made lot of money by selling Millions of copies of Mirza ghalib CDs. Should we criticize that Producer for what he did or should we appreciate his effort ? Today in Pakistan also lot of Singers render their voice to Mirza ghalib's Ghazals, I haven't seen any credit given to Ghalib Saheb for that.
I know Piracy is a diff issue, but that was just to open the eyes of some friends who suggest that we Indians have no morals.
AK
All said and done.
We should realise it is easy to critize others.
What each one of us should do is that we should not encourage copying and piracy in our countries.
If cant avoid it then atleast do think in your hearts that it is wrong. Especially we Pakistanis who after cheating take pride in doing it.
[This message has been edited by Sheikh Khalid (edited May 03, 2002).]
Interesting discussion here...
Someone said something about Gulzar openly admitting that he was inspired by Bulleya Shah's work -- okay, do you mean that in reference to chaiyaan chaiyaan, and if so, in terms of music, or lyrics
And if Bulleya shah is the person they're attributing the song to...then that would totally contradict the report given by Dawn Images...I have not read any bulleya shah and whatever I know of him, i know thru junoon. So if you know that chaiyaan chaiyaan was lifted from bulleya shah, please let me know -- it would be a good idea to tell the Dawn to get their facts straight.
Spock, I haven't even heard of the existence of this pakistani sindhi musician...I just know this from Dawn. I wish that outside of Pakistan's sindh, there was some exposure of the musicians of sindh -- i dont even think that if i asked a music shop owner in Pakistan that he would know of who this singer is...
which is partially my point of this thread -- that we as pakistanis sit here and boast of the talent in our country, yet we've never heard of this one singer, and he is of our own country --- yet we know every hoo haa that comes out of india!
Indian stuff -> pirated copies sold in Pakistan, since the government wouldn't allow its legatimized biz anywayz...
Pakistani stuff -> The various recording companies have legetimate biz, pirated albums sometimes pop up, not very famous ones though, but its very risky...
That has nothing to do with the topic... I am not saying its just the Indians who copy Pakistani stuff, it may go the other way too, but this is totally wrong...
Remember the rivalry b/w the producers of the pakistani and indian films which had the song 'amma dekh tera mundi bigra jaye', both of them were claiming they came up with the song first!!
So, theres no piracy in India… Fazool me 2nd largest pirate in Asia ka label laga hua hai… Very few recent (amongst the millions) links…
http://news.com.com/2100-1040-870105.html?legacy=cnet
http://www.indianest.com/cinema/02222.htm
http://www.antipiracy-india.com/news/22jan2001_hindu.html
http://www.iipa.com/rbc/2002/2002SPEC301INDIA.pdf
http://www.screendigest.com/rep_asia-pacific-video.htm
The last link proves that the second largest challenge for the anti-piracy intitiative in Asia happens to be India…
Piracy me Pakistan abhi bacha hai compared to India!
this thread has taken a retarded turn. every tom, dick and harry has jumped in not wanting to miss a chance to bash india up.
not a single person on this thread has heard the allegedly "original" pakistani song (i strongly suspect there is none). yet, that hasnt stopped anyone from passing judgements and generalizing it to the whole of indians.
secondly, when junoon, abida parveen, nfak et.al. sing the works of bhule shah, its alright; when AR Rahman, an indian, composes his own music to a modified version of bhule shah's work, it is labelled "lifting off" and "plagiarism". talk about double standards and hypocrisy.
thirdly, quit hogging bhule shah's work as pakistani. he was long gone even before the ideology of a pakistan was around, and his work is the common heritage of the subcontinent.
i dont know who brought in bulleya shah, but this post is not about bulleya shah - its about chaiyaan chaiyaan as a rip off from a sindhi pakistani song, made well after the partition.
For all of you have hook ups with like every other cd that comes out of Pakistan -- I'd request you guys to look into this.
Queer, you may strongly suspect it and that's fine -- but its only a suspician. How do you know this statement released by dawn is not true? I mean, obviously there is a source from which the writer of this article found this information from.
And obviously the song does exist, it sounds kind of familiar, but I know i haven't heard it -- i might have seen it mentioned elsewhere in reference to something else. But this guy DOES exist and this song does too, and its a downright shame that all conveniently ignore my point here. But what more can i possibly expect, with the music industry monopolized by ethnocentric punjabis, there's not much more that can be said about this sindhi singer, is there?
its about chaiyaan chaiyaan as a rip off from a sindhi pakistani song, made well after the partition.<<
a sindhi pakistani song which no pakistani or sindhi on gupshup has any clue about. how much more sindhi pakistani can it get? the mind boggles.
even assuming that such a song exists, and in fact bears some semblance to the studly masterpiece by AR Rahman, the single line in the article says nothing about this song being from after partition. in fact, it claims to have been sung "many years back".
IMO, it is a clean case of someone trying to hitch a free ride off AR Rahman's music to get sindhi music popular.
How do you know this statement released by dawn is not true?<<
it is not a "statement released by Dawn", its is one line out of a (rather boring) survey article done by a freelancer for Dawn.
And obviously the song does exist, it sounds kind of familiar, but I know i haven't heard it<<
woah! woah! femme logic zaps da brain!
LOL, queer, why do u find it so hard to accept the truth! it was a ripoff!!! As for bashing India, it was an Indian who brought the issue of piracy... Actually Im not implying only Indians copy Pakistani, I can see it happening the other way around too, however, I believe that it is wrong and shouldnt be done... that is all
Sachal Sarmest and Bulleh Shah are not the same people. Sachal Sarmast is a sufi poet of Sindh, like Bulleh Shah is of Punjab. Only difference is that unlike Punjabis, almost all Sindhis know of Sarmast's poetry.
It is shameful that no Pakistani here knows anything about Sachal Sarmast, one of the greatest Sindhi sufi poets.
I know about him yar
[quote]
Originally posted by queer:
**
this thread has taken a retarded turn. every tom, dick and harry has jumped in not wanting to miss a chance to bash india up.
not a single person on this thread has heard the allegedly "original" pakistani song (i strongly suspect there is none). yet, that hasnt stopped anyone from passing judgements and generalizing it to the whole of indians.
secondly, when junoon, abida parveen, nfak et.al. sing the works of bhule shah, its alright; when AR Rahman, an indian, composes his own music to a modified version of bhule shah's work, it is labelled "lifting off" and "plagiarism". talk about double standards and hypocrisy.
thirdly, quit hogging bhule shah's work as pakistani. he was long gone even before the ideology of a pakistan was around, and his work is the common heritage of the subcontinent.**
[/quote]
Brother I didn't know there were many Indians here. When I came to know I backed off. i don't want to have a India/Pakistan battle here. So as i said in my previous post.
As far as AR Rehman, Gulzar, Mani Ratnam etc are concerned for Chaiyan Chaiyan. I would like to add that Bulley Shah was a Sufi Poet. And it would least please him to see Mailka's Vulgar Thumke's in his work. It's the last respect you can give to a sufi's work.