Faceup, to be even more precise the incorrect interpretation of religious scripture along with OTHER factors, the main one in my opinion being culture (it is moreso the stigma attached with divorce than anything else) that forces women to avoid divorce.
The post is a good one, its a good topic, but to blame religion solely would be incorrect. If Islam was interpreted correctly, women would still face that stigma of "being divorced", law enforcement would still look a blind eye to victims of rape and women would still be killed for "honor".
I found the manner in which you presented the problem a bit offensive (but than again I'm offended easily)...I think its better to look at these problems with a bit of a broader scope. Moreso, I think if your going to solve problems for a specific group of people its in your advantage to use that groups language, for Muslims that language is Islam, its teachings, etc. And not to use that groups teachings in an insulting manner.
bringing up a topic is like living with sharks.everyone is just bickering over who is right and who is wrong and my idea is better then yours,it has come down to being the righteous eventhough we dont admit that but its all about "me,me,me,me and some more of me".
all this me,me where is this going i have read all the arguements and counter attacks but no one has come up with something which can have impact on how we think.
all i know is that the real change comes from within,and if we all first human beings really try to change ourselves there might be some hope for betterment in general and in every aspect of our lives.
please feel free to render your opnions.
and its someones qoute"opnions are like as_hol_s everyone's got one"so opnions dont change anything.
cios
[quote]
Originally posted by Shirin:
** Horrific crimes are commited against women all over the world. Even in Pakistan. I don't give a damn about theory, I'm talikng about what happens in real life. The islamic "culture" is no superior to any other as far as its treatment of women is concerned. If you have money and influence then life is nice and if you don't you are subjected to all sorts of humiliation and injustice - yes, in the name of religion! - without any real rights. So the answer is women from well to do and influential families can get diovorces easily. Most of the others, no.**
[/quote]
I dont know what era of our time logical is living in…How can you say that men are SUPERIOR to women??? You’ve got some serious researching to do. Islam treats both men and women as EQUALS. They are, however, DIFFERENT, physically etc.
I dont know if im wasting my time and wether any of you would care to look at these links but im posting them here anyway. http://www.themodernreligion.com/w_main.htm#right http://www.themodernreligion.com/women/w_rights_summary.htm
Please refrain from making such claims and call them ISLAMIC. What your interpretation is, might not necessarily be ISLAMIC.
And about men abusing women, well common sense will tell you that this has nothing to do with religion. Men all over the world use tradition and religion as an excuse to dominate females.
LOGICAL, THE FACT THAT WOMEN WOULD DARE NOT ASK FOR DIVORCE HAS TO DO WITH CULTURE NOT ISLAM!! MEN, IN MOST CULTURES ARE DOMINANT BECAUSE THAT’S HOW THEIR PREDECESSORS BEHAVED. ITS NOT ISLAM’S FAULT THAT MEN CAN BRIBE POLICEMEN AND ABUSE/KILL THEIR WIVES.
I also think that you totally mis-interpreted the verses you posted.
They DO NOT say men are superior to women.
“And (wives) shall have rights similar to those (the husbands have) over them, in accordance with justice, (except that) husbands’ rights are a degree greater.” (2:228)
“Husbands are guardians (qawwamun) of wives because God has favoured some more than others and because they (i.e. husbands generally) spend out of their wealth.” (4:34)
“The fact that husbands’ rights are a degree greater does not effect the claim that in Islam men and women have equal rights, since men’s greater rights within the marriage relationship do not mean that men also enjoy greater rights outside that relationship and since within the marriage relationship men’s greater rights are completely justified by their greater responsibility. We must remember here that whenever we talk about members of a society having equal rights it is never precluded that members of that society cannot freely enter into terminable arrangements in which some take greater responsibility and therefore also have greater rights. Equality of rights can only be asserted on the assumption of equality of responsibility. This principle sometimes works in favour of women. For example, as mothers women give much more to children than do men as fathers and so Islam recognizes greater rights of mothers over children than of fathers except where economic considerations demand otherwise.” http://www.themodernreligion.com/family/family_marriagelegal.html
I do not believe that there should be any INEQUITY in Islam, but there is!
My objective is to create awareness! If you think I am a lier then you are entitled to your opinion. So far, our records are impeccable! None have beaten us other than hurl abuse at us!
Tell me: How is the situation of women under Islam in Saudia & Afghanistan which rules by Sharia'h laws!
Now, you are not going to tell me that they[Saudia & Afhganistan] are deviants and not really practising Islam, are you?
A woman is not allowed to ask for divorce without a legitimate reason, such as her husband treating her very badly or that she hates for certain acts he has committed such as adultery or that he violates her rights. Once a legitimate reason is established, she can ask for the divorce through the court. Otherwise, if no legitimate reason is established, the person asking for divorce is cursed by God.
Dr Loveless
Change your signature otherwise your posts will be deleted.
[This message has been edited by Girl from Quraysh (edited September 20, 2000).]
I do not believe that there should be any INEQUITY in Islam, but there is!
My objective is to create awareness! If you think I am a lier then you are entitled to your opinion. So far, our records are impeccable! None have beaten us other than hurl abuse at us!
Tell me: How is the situation of women under Islam in Saudia & Afghanistan which rules by Sharia'h laws!
Now, you are not going to tell me that they[Saudia & Afhganistan] are deviants and not really practising Islam, are you?**
[/quote]
I really dont know why you insist on saying something that's absolutely baseless. Dont you get it?? Afghanistan, Pakistan and other Islamic countries are governed by Islamic laws in NAME ONLY.
Women have been forbidden to go to schools in Afghanistan. That is un-Islamic. Any Muslim, male or female, is obligated to gain and increase education and knowledge.
Even in Saudi Arabia, women are hardly seen outside. They cant drive. They cant let anyone take pictures of them unless they ask permission of their husbands so on. Now tell me, does Islam forbid women to drive?? NO
In Pakistan, Jordan, countries that are supposed to be Islamic, honour killings are common. Does Islam tell anyone to kill a girl just because she likes a guy or is seen talking to him?? NO. The killing of a fellow human is one of the biggest sins in Islam.
In Egypt, young girls are circumcized!! This is considered a sin by Islam, they're basically mutilating little girls. This practice is centuries old and is prevalent among African tribes. Would you say Islam has anything to do with this?? I DONT THINK SO.
) but I have this to summarize the topic ..if fact this applies to all religions… The holy books ( Quran, Bible, Geeta) were like the “complete reference guides” or textbooks to the way of life as God wanted us to follow. ( call this the exam)
WHat we are facing in reality, however is that man being man could not study from the “textbook” for the “exam” and hence when confronted with diffcult situations or “questions” he wrote his own interpretation.
Thus as is universal in all college exams, the answers written in the exam are not exact copies of whats is the textbook but according to the logic and interpretation of the exam writer.
Who will correct the “marks” for this “exam”?
There is only one invigilator.. The great one in the blue yonder.. And you have have to go to the university “gates of heaven” and your “marks” will decide whether you “graduate” (heaven) or not (hell)