Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

Arleitter · June 10, 2010, 6:25am

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

I would refute the versions that Aryans came from Persia.The originally y came from Europe.

Arleitter · June 10, 2010, 6:27am

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

Mohanjadaro and Harappa were the cradle of Neo Hinduism.Thy had little to do with Budhism.Shivlings have been excavated from these sites and ofcourse the people of these two had worshipped water,fire,sun moon and all natural stuffs,something very identical and common in Hinduism.

khoji · June 11, 2010, 12:25am

You are correct that they did not come from Persia, but wrong that they came from Europe.
It is believed that all Europeans as well as Iranians and Vedic-Aryans came from Caucasia in southern Russia.
At that time Europeans, Iranians and Vedic-Aryans were the same people. Later the would-be Europeans moved westward from Caucasia to Europe. Iranians and Vedic-Aryans moved southward from Caucasia. Iranians occupied the land from black people of Elam. Vedic-Aryans moved further East, and occupied land from black people of IVC.

Sarsaparilla · March 19, 2011, 9:36pm

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

Majority of Pakistanis do not consider Mohenjo Daro as belonging to Pakistan. It is a culture that originated with India and has nothing to do with them.

Faris_Udeen · March 19, 2011, 9:43pm

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

Well I always believed that Steppes were original home of the Aryans as they were for my own people. I would say that people and animals that are first domesticated by people for example th horse, the dog, and the raptor... are all Steppes related.

Civilisation probably rose after these Steppes dwellers moved Southwards into India and Arabia. Indeed the Middle East might well be cradle of Civilisation but cradle of Tribes is the Steppes and the Aryans started out as an Invading tribe.

Faris_Udeen · March 19, 2011, 9:47pm

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

Please keep such sentiments to yourself unless you can back them up with evidence. Where on earth do you get that idea from if Pakistani's were that against Mohenjeo Daro why do we have it splashed over our currency notes?

Arleitter · March 20, 2011, 6:51am

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

I am doubtful about this portion.Let's have more explorations in this regard.I will come back...

But surely I believe Aryans came from Europe.

(Proud to be an Aryan)

Southie · May 13, 2011, 5:24am

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

Wonderful work Khoji. Makes on go hmmmmmmmmm! Enjoyed it. Look forward to more excavations from the past. Aur Khojo, Khoji :)

kaka_in_usa · May 13, 2011, 9:40pm

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

buddhism is a religion now? :D

great.

Iconoclast · May 13, 2011, 11:05pm

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

I have looked at ancient Indian sculptures in different museums trying to find aryan features in the gods since hinduism is thought to be an aryan religion but failed. The facial features on these statues are very much Indian rather more like southern indians and generally short and plump.

And i dont think brown colour of northern indians means that they are mix of caucasians and black southern indians. Mongoloids are a distinct race yet there are very dark mongoloids and very white mongoloids and brown mongoloids.

queer · May 13, 2011, 11:20pm

Re: Buddha’s religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

what are aryan features again?

lol@all the paindoos trying their hand at geneology..

Arleitter · May 14, 2011, 6:07am

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

Have you been to Bali? I have lived in Indonesia and been to Bali before rejoining the Indian assignment.You can see Hindus over there follow the ancient Hindu style and the caste system.(I have mentioned about it a few times here).Bali is an Island ,part of Indonesia where 93% of it's inhibitants are Hindus. The body features presented in their scriptures and statues are of Mongloid faces,very much native to Baliniese.The reason is very simple.The craftsmen are belonging to Bali and they will have just their body features in mind while making them.Similarily the statues and other things you saw at different museums will have no other marks but it's makers.

Also pls pay a look at the Angkorwat idols(Combodia) and Chmapa civilization(Vietnam).

I will say Hinduism is a mix of Aryanism and Dravidinism.Gods like Vishnu and others are Aryan gods and Siva and others are Dravidians.

Ali_Syed · December 23, 2012, 2:19pm

Re: Buddha’s religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

khoji:

When I first got interested in Indus Valley Civilization, I saw remarkable order of Indus Valley cities WITHOUT apparent signs of strong kingship or military control.
This was perplexing to me. We know order in society can be implemented through a strong government. And this has been the case in most of the early civilizations, like Chinese, Egyptian, and Mesopotamian. All of them had standing armies and strong kings which ensured unity among people and order in society.

But this is not the case with Indus Valley. There are no signs of great armies and strong kings. There are no signs of grandeur in the form of Pyramids and other great architecture. All excavations from Indus Valley point to a very down-to-earth civilization, a civilization of common men, a civilization of farmers and merchants.
And yet this civilization endured for thousands of years.

On top of that, the Indus Valley Civilization covered an enormous land from Eastern Afghanistan to Western India.

I thought that continued existence of such an orderly civilization in such a huge territory, and without strong military, could only be possible through a** very strong religion and traditions**.

I know Hinduism is basically an imported Aryan religion. The seals excavated from this civilization also don’t reveal its clear connections with Hinduism. So I thought there must be some religion other than Hinduism that incorporates characteristics of Indus Valley religion. Buddhism obviously was the next option, especially with its teachings being very pacifist, very down-to-earth, similar to findings from Indus Valley.

So today I did a search using the terms: “harappa civilization buddha teachings”. And the second link said what I was looking for. Here it is:

Fundamentals of Buddhism: Pre-Buddhist Background

In Buddhism we have a religion which draws most of its inspiration from the Indus Valley religion, the ideas of renunciation, meditation, karma and rebirth, ultimate liberation - ideas which were important to the Indus Valley Civilization. The Buddha Himself indicated the Indus Valley origins of His tradition when He said that the path which He taught was an ancient path and the goal to which He pointed to was an ancient goal. We also have a Buddhist belief in six Buddhas prior to the Buddha Shakyamuni within this aeon. All these point to a continuity between the tradition of the Indus Valley Civilization and the teachings of the Buddha.
If we look at Buddhism and Hinduism we will find a greater or lesser proportion of elements taken from either of the two traditions of the Indus Valley Civilization and Aryan Civilization. For instance, if we look at Buddhism, the greater proportion was taken from the Indus Valley Civilization religion, a lesser proportion from the Aryan tradition. That is why we find mention of the Aryan gods in Buddhist scripture, though their role is peripheral, an example of an Aryan element in the Buddhism tradition. On the other hand, if we look at some schools of Hinduism, we find a greater proportion of elements taken from the Aryan tradition and a lesser proportion from the Indus Valley Civilization. We find caste emphasized, the authority of the revealed scripture of the Aryans - the Vedas - emphasized and sacrifices emphasized. Alongside, we find a place made for renunciation, meditation, karma and rebirth.

Interesting, I will have to dig out the history of Budhism. I for sure know that Gandhara Civilization was Budhist (infact Budhism flourished during the reign of Maurya) , but that came much after Indus Valley civilization. Not sure about the religion of Indus Valley.

Ali_Syed · December 23, 2012, 2:37pm

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

According to Wikipedia, Budhism was spread in 6th century BC, where as it flourished in Northern India in 3rd Century BC (Mauryan Empire) and declined in around 6th century AD. The idols that have been discovered during Indus Valley (7500 BC) excavations depicts that it was neither a Hindu nor Budhist civilization.

khoji · December 23, 2012, 5:01pm

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

We can never know if those statues were considered idols or not. They might just be a statue of a man deep in meditation, just like there is a famous statue of a dancing girl.

But the thing is that their religion was not exactly Buddhism. Rather Buddha incorporated many practices/ideas in his religion which were already existing in Indus Valley since long. Things like meditation, etc.

Ali_Syed · December 23, 2012, 5:09pm

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

I think the religion being practiced in Indus valley were called vedic religions, which formed the basis of Hinduism and Budhism.

khoji · December 23, 2012, 5:42pm

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

I agree with the above. And the implications of this thought are interesting.

Iconoclast · December 25, 2012, 9:25pm

Re: Buddha’s religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

Search ancient greek statues and ancient hindu statues and u will know what i am talking about.

calypsodc · December 26, 2012, 12:56am

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

Buddhism originated from the Shramana movement which was a Non-Vedic movement parallel to Vedic Hinduism. Some historians believe that this originated from the Indus Valley Cililization. Some historians don't accept that. The origins of Shramana movement has not been authenticated historically. There has always been a theological and philosophical conflict between the two movements. Modern Hinduism as is practiced today can be regarded as a combination of Vedic and Shramana traditions as it is substantially influenced by both traditions.Though ideas of Karma,Liberation and Samsara are present in the early Vedic texts ,concise arguments and definitions arose from the Shramana tradition.
Yoga on the other hand was practiced in the Indus valley since there have been various seals recovered which have yogic poses on them.

khoji · December 26, 2012, 7:49am

Re: Buddha's religion is fundamentally a religion of Indus Valley Civilization

Oops. I agreed with it earlier by mistake.
Vedic Religion was similar to Old Iranina religion. It was not originally practiced in Indus Valley. Rather it was imported in Indus Valley by white people.
The religion of Indus Valley was the precursor of current Hinduism.

The religion closest to Indus Valley religion is Buddhism. Because Buddha incorporated the teachings of Indus Valley religion in his teachings.

This might not be exactly true. But this is what it looks like.