Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"'

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

Kindly ignore the first class averages of all these players and compare their test averages only and you will find Shoaib Malik ahead of every one except Inzi, Younis and Yousuf.

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Re: Breaking News…Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to “The Nation”

Imran Khan backs Malik for Captaincy… Yaar GA..ab tau Imee bhee khe rahay hain…

Imran backs Malik for new skipper

Pakistan great Imran Khan has backed Shoaib Malik as the best choice to take over as national team captain.

A new skipper is needed following Inzamam-ul-Haq’s decision to give up the job in the wake of the team’s first round exit from the World Cup.
Batsman Mohammad Yousuf has declared an interest in the captaincy, but it is thought Malik may be the favourite.
“He appears to have a good cricket brain and could turn out to be a very good choice,” said Imran.
“I hope he accepts the challenge. It could make him into a better player and bring out the best in him.”
Malik is only 25, but has played 18 Tests and 137 limited overs internationals.
His career has not been without controversy - two years ago he was given a one-Test ban for throwing a domestic Twenty20 game and his bowling action has twice been reported to the International Cricket Council.
He is, however, seen as a good choice for the future as Pakistan look to rebuild.
**Asked about the captaincy, he replied: “I don’t want to say anything about it because no-one has spoken to me about it yet. When it happens, fine.” **
Imran, meanwhile, has criticised Inzamam’s former deputy, Younis Khan, who was offered the chance to take over as skipper but turned it down because he was angry at the reception the team received when they returned home from the World Cup.
“I don’t understand it. If he didn’t want to be captain, he should not have accepted the vice-captaincy for the last two years. His refusal has led to a crisis,” said Imran, who led Pakistan to victory at the 1992 World Cup.
“It is useless trying to convince Younis to lead the team if he does not want to do it, but what he did was wrong.” Another former skipper, Javed Miandad, said Younis’s decision was symptomatic of the indiscipline in Pakistan’s cricket set-up. “It is disappointing for me that someone should turn down the honour of being asked to captain his country. It is not a good sign for Pakistan cricket,” he added.

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

Can't believe you are so vain that you will combine, merge and scrub stats to fit your viewpoint. What's first-class stats got to do with a player's ability to captain the test side. Until now, I merely didn't agree with you, but now you have also lost my respect. Some ego you have man!

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

what for? for god's sake, Captaincy and V.Captaincy are not 'REWARDS' that need to be handed out to players as recognition. Vice Captain is supposed to be someone in training who could eventually take over, which Asif makes a wonderful candidate for. What's the use of making Yousuf Captain?

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

^ Alona is kiddin' dude. Chill! The point, humorous as it was, which you obviously missed, that Younis stuck to being a VC for two years and then said he is not gonna be the captain. By the way, it was 'Younis' not 'Yousuf'. Changi tarah paRh te liya karr yaar....

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

AA: I think you mean Yousuf. :D

Sir Dig A Lot: Totally agree with you. Asif is a better choice as VC.

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

I think it's ridiculous to say that a captain must have his place confirmed in the side.

Remember Mike Brearley of England? Average in the low 20's from what I remember. Couldn't bowl. But was an amazing captain, that took an average team and made them into a top class one.

Malik place is reasonably secure and I look forward to seeing what he can do.

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

Sir dig got too tied up from Sa1eem extracts from his book.

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

aray GA yaar...you did not get it either....read Faisal's post...he got it down perferct...

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Re: Breaking News…Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to “The Nation”

Great work Sherlock :smiley:
how come everyone else missed it…

ghubbaray kee hawa nikal jatee heay agar joke explain karna parhay..:snooty:

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Re: Breaking News…Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to “The Nation”

Bhai, yea tou garbar hou gayee, what I should do? Should I cry that your highness lost his honourable respect for me? :rolleyes: Have you thought that if I have any respect for you?:no:

If a person cannot digest information based on facts and figures, who cares? Facts and figures are not viewpoint or opinion, it is facts and figures. None of the figures I quoted is concocted by me. I have zilch respect for such person who becomes ignorant and start feeling uneasy in front of facts and figures.:disgust:

Just cool down. If you do not agree with figures, make objection. Learn from Pakistani politicians :D. You can easily write that inforamtion given in cricinfo cricketer stats are bias. You can claim that cricinfo is on payroll of anti S Malik group.:halo: Akhir hamary politicians also do that, don’t they? So, learn from them :smiley:

As for what figures means in Cricket, well, that is what cricket is all about. The team that has higher figures on scorecard wins. That’s it, nothing more. How averages are made? It is made if player makes runs. More runs per inning by a player mean higher average and more contribution to the team score.

How a player is selected in test team? Because that player is making runs in first class matches. Where that runs would show? In averages of the player, that’s it.

Now forget about Captaincy as captaincy is given to those that are selected in team. No Captain could lead a team if he is not even selected in the team. Just justify why a player that has such low averages in first class matches gets selected in test team and many players with better averages are not in the team?

[Note: If one takes off test runs of Shoaib malik from his frist class averages, his first class average falls further down. He made 1825 runs in 82 innings with an average of 25.00 runs per inning. Does that figure justify a player to get selected for test? Why Shoaib got selected when Hasan Raza that has more then twice his average in first class matches (above 50 runs per inning) is not, why?]

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

Sa1eem...

Your obsession with stats is bordering on ridiculous...

Are you honestly suggesting Hasan Raza deserves a place over Shoiab Malik in the Pakistan team...Raza had his chance and he flopped...

Are you going to tell me that Taufiq Umar and Imran Farhat are better batsmen than Yasir Hammed and Asim Kamal...

Are you telling me that Hasan Raza is more deserving of a place than Younis Khan?...

This is craziness...initially i based my argument on the fact that a captain cant be deduced on averages alone...cos as you have it MoYo would be our best capatain...

But now ill state that Shoiab Malik is more than good enough to get in our test team...he is one of our most gifted batsmen and hes one of the few players in our team who deals with pressure well...before his injury we were going to open with him...are you honestly going to tell me that any of our current opener are better than him?...

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

Naughty_bY_Nature:

[quote]
Your obsession with stats is bordering on ridiculous...

Are you honestly suggesting Hasan Raza deserves a place over Shoiab Malik in the Pakistan team...Raza had his chance and he flopped...
[/quote]
Yes, I believe that Hasan Raza is 100s time better batsman then Shoaib Malik. There is no comparison betweem two. Hasan Raza deserve a place in Pakistan cricket team 100s time more then Shoaib Malik.

You mean, 10 innings in patches and you have declared that Hasan Raza flopped?

I do not think that Hasan Raza flopped. With his performance in first class matches (average of over 50), he deserves much more chances rather extended chances in test. But then who get extended chances? It is player like Shoaib Malik with an average of 25. I believe that Hasan Raza is victim of nepotism at the expense of Pakistan cricket and Hasan Raza.

I believe that Hasan Raza did not get extended chances because Pakistan selfish in Management believed that if he gets extended chances and establish himself, it would be difficult to dislodge him. So, give him chances in patches and with so much pressure that he could not perform.

[quote]
Are you going to tell me that Taufiq Umar and Imran Farhat are better batsmen than Yasir Hammed and Asim Kamal.
[/quote]
Yes. I believe that Imran Farhat and Faisal Iqbal are as good or better batsmen then Asim Kamal and Yasir Hameed. Taufeeq Umar is also as good a player as Asim Kamal and Yasir Hameed.

[quote]
Are you telling me that Hasan Raza is more deserving of a place than Younis Khan?.
[/quote]
I certainly believe that Hasan Raza is better player then Younis Khan. It is different matter that Younis Khan got plenty of chances in Test and in the end, proved himself a worthy player. As for Hasan Raza, he was never given enough chances at Test level to prove himself. I believe that if he was given enough continuous chances, probably he would have had much better performance then Younis Khan (as Hasan Raza first class figures shows).

It is possible that if given chances, Hasan Raza might have shown better performance then Inzamam and Yousuf. Just imagine that Yousuf, that has average of 56 today, he started with 5 runs (out) in first inning and 1 run (out) in second. If he was dropped, what Pakistan would have lost? Best Pakistani player. But he got further chances straight away and eventually established himself.

[quote]
This is craziness...initially i based my argument on the fact that a captain cant be deduced on averages alone...cos as you have it MoYo would be our best capatain...
[/quote]
I also did not say that a captain should be best player in the team. But still, I believe that his performance should be amongst the best in the team. Certainly he should not be a player that does not deserve to have permanent place in team due to lack of performance.

[quote]
But now ill state that Shoiab Malik is more than good enough to get in our test team...he is one of our most gifted batsmen and hes one of the few players in our team who deals with pressure well...before his injury we were going to open with him...are you honestly going to tell me that any of our current opener are better than him?...
[/quote]
If he was gifted batsman, his figures would have shown. How come a gifted batsman could not make runs and thus have an average below 30 in first class matches (where he played most). His test runs is not enough to make any opinion on his performance, but even there he does not show any excellence? What are your criteria of calling a player gifted? Is it that the one that gives lowest performance is the best? :D

Shoaib Malik has lowest first class averages amongst all current batsmen playing cricket in Pakistan test team. Probably you mean that Shoaib is gifted in finding right person that can make him get selected in test team even when he has lowest performance in first class cricket. ;)

Waisay, we are talking about Pakistani team and what is important in Pakistani mentality, where nepotism, personal like/dislike and Safarish is more important than merit, hard work or Pakistani Interest, so I am sorry, I should not make an issue of non-issue (in Pakistanis context).

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Re: Breaking News…Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to “The Nation”

Sa1eem I like your arguments, i havent read the entire thread, but they seem fair and supportive and seems like your catching a lot of flak from certain members abt losing respect and such which was pretty pathetic tho kind of funny to read lol

You do have a point, i feel now like many people have jumped on the malik bandwagon quickly (i have too) and a look into his performances might be needed. I still do feel he has a lot of potential as a player and a captain and that his stats dont do him justice, and if that means going back to domestic cricket and proving himself then so be it. And you raised a good point at the end of your post, i dont know if PCB is strong enough to change that selection process but i hope it does for the betterment of cricket

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

Sa1eem - I am definitely impressed by your passion and commitment to your cause. Not all of us take so much pain to present our arguments in such great detail. I am a bit sad though, that I couldn't read more than a paragraph of any one of them cuz they were so damn long and fragmented. But you have me convinced. Shoaib Malik doesn't deserve the captaincy on grounds of not being an automatic selection (your view not mine). Well, who do you make the Captain then, and are the cons of your alternatives less troubling than those of Shoaib?

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

First class averages for players who are NOT in the national team are bound to be higher than those who are IN the national side. Firstly, thats because our national players rarely play domestic cricket and if they do, its only one or two games here and there, and they just go through the paces. The guys who are NOT in the team, have nothing else to fall back on and as such they play a lot more domestic cricket and hence their averages are bound to be higher.

So...pulling up a bunch of domestic stats is irrelevant. I remember Hassan Raza very well. He was given a test debut for publicity reasons despite the fact that one of the selectors at the time, Haroon Rasheed, publicly stated that it would destroy the young man's career. However, the PCB and the other selectors went for the record, and a few games later, Raza was tossed aside.

He's a decent player and should be back in the 15 now - however how good he is remains to be seen. You cannot compare him to Malik. Malik has achieved a lot more already...Raza has yet to show what he can do.

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Re: Breaking News…Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to “The Nation”

hassan raza is better than Shoaib, says it all. No need to argue anymore. Why can’t the nation and the rest of the world see it that way? :smack:

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

thats why i love Imran, for Pakistan crickets sake and for the country in general he has backed Malik!!! I was never in favour of makin malik captain but after my fav player, younis khan chickened out, we should all back Malik!! He is our future!

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Re: Breaking News…Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to “The Nation”

They need to read and obey the “Sa1eem’s Memoirs of Cricket”… :smiley:

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Re: Breaking News....Shoaib Malik Gets Pakistan Captaincy according to "The Nation"

Sa1eem: Talking about averages of different batsmen is very easy, get the stats from cricinfo and post 'em. The stats do have an advanced filter though, use that and see how many places Malik has been sent to bat on in the short career. First of all Malik has been one of the most consistent performers in the ODI's for the last couple of years, secondly I believe he had nailed down the #3 spot in the ODI's till everyone jumped up and down and said Younis deserved that spot more. Malik averages almost 40 playing at one down position. Then he was moved way down to bat at #6 which is normally a time to hit out and in the last few overs, there were also times that Malik was skipped and Afridi, Razzaq or Akmal were sent ahead to swing their bats around. He is one of the best fielders in our side, one of the most consistent performers and and underused off spinner. Him along with Afridi can fill the role of the 5th bowler easily and at times can easily bowl the full qouta of 10 overs.

Although I am not too certain about his place in the test side but he is one of the better options available. He seems to have a good head on his shoulders and doesnt shy away from taking responsibility. For the sake of the team he doesnt mind playing at any position unlike some other fussy world class players with mind boogling averages who can only bat at certain number otherwise the whole word would go upside down.