Being killed for marrying a christian man and leaving Islam

shaasavera · June 12, 2014, 2:29am

Re: Being killed for marrying a christian man and leaving Islam

You are not gonna slow down to look at what both you and Southie are failing to understand. Yes, even Southie, because as long as he continues to say that you are doing nothing wrong, he too has failed to understand.

Let’s address the comments I’ve highlighted in the above quoted post of yours.

If you were seeking advice on a personal matter in which you want a general opinion on whether your actions were right or wrong, that’s a different thing altogether. But what you’re basically doing here is conducting a poll. And a poll is usually not conducted without a purpose. People use poll results to prove a point or to use the results to make a decision. Why do you need to know “how many” people condemn this “law?” Tell us Bella, tell us why you need to see “how many” of us condemn this killing and why does Southie think it’s okay for you to conduct this “head count” of sorts?

Nobody is sugar coating the shariah laws. Go read my last post where I provided info regarding the scholars’ interpretation of the apostasy laws. That was the second time I posted information that I researched. You don’t want to consider or accept the research findings posted. If we tell you of how the scholars interpret the law…you call that “sugar coating.” Bella, shouldn’t you be happy or even relieved in knowing that some scholars don’t believe that the death penalty applies to individuals or simple apostasy such as your own and that it refers to high treason? Shouldn’t you be relieved that the scholars say that ordinary simpletons like us cannot call someone an apostate and sentence them to death…that this is not a simple thing but a matter in which there is an actual process? Shouldn’t you be relieved in knowing that the Prophet SAWS didn’t kill anyone for being an apostate? Or are all these things “sugar coating” to you? Would you rather hear us say that this atrocity which took place is connected with Islam? Would that make you feel better?

Sure we’ll condemn this act, and we all do. If you want to call it a law, then fine, we’ll call it a law. We condemn this law, but we don’t associate it with Shariah and Islam. And is our condemning of this woman’s death not enough for you? Or will you only be at peace if we condemn it specifically as a “shariah” law?

I understand your viewpoint. Maybe her wording was not clear or use of words unclear. I think she also apologised for offence caused. Like others also who did the same. This shows it is a civilised discussion. Personally, i felt when Bella did ask for how many people condemn the law she was asking in her community and wanted to see that others did condemn it.
Her initial posts may have some emotion to them which i think is because of her personal connection. Perhaps this is not a question she would bring up to those close to her in real life. People are casting doubt on her based on her history. Well, i have seen her comment in showbiz Pakistan on pakistani dramas and I have seen her offer her condolences to the victims of Sunday. She is as Pakistani as others and we don’t know her reasons for her decisions and also her decision is not part of the topic. Maybe she just wanted to see consensus against this in her online Pakistani community. If her friends or non Pakistanis/non desis point this news out and ask do most Pakistanis agree..Bella can say she is part of an online Pakistani community where majority is against this. These views coming from someone who is not part of the majority Pakistani population will show Pakistanis are as open minded as any other ethnicity whether they be Turkish or Albanian Muslims who are seen to be liberal minded.
Not much but positive perceptions can count.

Now maybe my assumption is incorrect but when i read “sugar coating” laws i felt Bella was talking about the existing laws (note im not saying they are religious or not) which are unequivocal about punishments for apostasy and are supported by clerics as being “sharia” when they are not. I agree we shouldn’t be quick to conclude that these are “sharia” even if insisted by some misguided clerics. I feel Bella was giving this the label those clerics had and leaving it open to discussion. I have posted an article by someone who was an ex muslim who actually used scholars and points in Quran for why this is not allowed. The issue is that this practice is in many countries and speaking out and challenging it can only be good for all. Why would anyone who is apostate or non believer have any issues with better laws existing and scholars supporting them over the current ones? It’s better for them and it’s better for believers as it’s better for overall image and portrays it in right light.

I think both sides if they think the other is not part of “agenda” or has “ulterior motives” could use the knowledge gained on this thread for better and for educating others out of the community. Let’s not either side base our assumptions based on what we’ve heard about the other in the past. While it is not right for some to base our idea of what is “sharia” law on what some outlier radicals or clerics say is “sharia” which is unfortunately what is portrayed in media when they take statements of such people and is used in practice in some countries like this case. I feel that Bella was concerned with practical application of the law and this is where her perspective is coming from. Also, at the same time let’s not base our assumptions that people like Bella, Southie and others are out to portray all people here in a generalised way based on what media perceptions we have of apostates and non religious people. That they must hate what they have left behind or look down on others. It is not necessary that all think that also. There are many who are neutral to what they have left behind. It could be simply that due to their situation and choices they do not think they make a good religious person and want to be honest rather than pretend. No one likes pretenders. They still belong to their nationality such as Pakistani for Bella and Indian for Southie even though they are not religious like the vast majority of the population. And to the non-desi they are still part of their nationality and are equal targets for racism based on news like this when circulated in media.

Both groups if they understand each other and wanted to can counteract stereotypes and make positive change.

Religious people here who are knowledgeable can voice these misinterpretations and bring up those scholars with alternate interpretations to those in their community and others. Let others know that these cases unfairly put unfavourable light on people. I know they do but on a larger scale. At the same time knowing some people in the community can be in a similar personal situation make them feel more sympathetic to it.

At the same time people who are non religious here can understand the religious perspective. They can challenge stereotypes to outsiders who assume all religious people secretly believe this or that as non-religious people they face persecution because they no longer belong. They can counteract this and state while religious people exist in the community they do not impose their views on others…and there is no compulsion etc.
This actually has more impact coming from someone who is non religious/does not belong or is an ex-religious person of that community. It can change others views.