Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Government
Balochistan’s share up by 600%: PM
ISLAMABAD: Balochistan’s share in development spending has increased by 600 percent in the last six years, Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz said at a meeting of the parliamentary sub-committee on Balochistan at Prime Minister’s Secretariat on Saturday. He said that Balochistan’s share has risen from Rs 5.4 billion to Rs 33.3 billion, an increase of Rs 27.9 billion. This additional amount will cater to a variety of projects encompassing important social and economic sectors, he said.
He appreciated the keen interest taken in Balochistan by the committee’s members from the government and the opposition, saying that the implementation of the recommendations will be beneficial to the people of the province. The committee also reviewed the status of implementation of its previous recommendations, and praised Aziz’s decision to convene the committee’s meeting on a monthly basis.
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Governmen
There is a difference. The movements that you’ve mentioned [other than the current one in Pak] all have their roots in the grassroot grievances of the common people, not just the grievances of the few from the tribal elite. I do know for certain these feudals are WORSHIPPED in Baluchistan – they are the ultimate menace, the ultimate authority, their word is taken for the word of god. They exercise their power by depriving the people of the most basic knowlege of their rights and the easiest way to go about doing that is to prevent them from being absorbed into the mainstream, by blocking any sort of development and access to education.
Baluchistan remains a tribal domain that is why it is the most backward province in the country. Punjab’s feudal culture is GENERALLY not as authoratrian , and the feudals in that part, and to an extent in Sindh and the Frontier have not been as averse to devlopment as Baluchistan has been. Some years ago these Baluchi feudals and their “enslaved” tribal subjects were bombing the newly contructed schools in Loralai, they also have been known enforce some age-old tribal customs which have no basis in religion, e.g preventing female literacy. Now they’re bombing Karachi, Gwadar not to mention those poor Chinese engineers which they have been kidnapping for ages. I have to mention Saindak here, which has the world’s largest [or atleast among the largest] copper reserve and it doesn’t take a genius to figure why that area is not being developed.
What the need of the moment is that this whole feudal structure needs to be dismantled, and people have to be tought to live like normal civilized citizens of the rest of the world. A heavy price is being paid for not having done so.
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Government
*I believe in Pakistan and believe that given more decades things can be worked out. *
I hope that happens. But frankly I don't see that happening.
The militant minority of Balochs should be more patient, should wait several more decades.
The MILITANT MINORITY was wat the Bengali Resistance called 35 years ago. Come on. We've got to be realistic. We need to FACE the problems we have created over time and try to SOLVE them, instead of IGNORING them and Putting them behind. LISTEN TO THEM. Don't ignore them by calling them a MILITANT MINORITY.
Injustice is very hard to face. The bengalis waited for 2 decades n then they couldnt wait more. So I doubt your SEVERAL DECADES FORMULA will work.
The ruling elite isnt SUFFERING. Thats why they talk of PATIENCE. They should instread show some courage and ADDRESS THE REAL ISSUE.
You don't have to kill them all - you need only target those who're trying to fight.
And they are called the SONS OF BALOCHISTAN. People have been singing songs in their praise. The dead ones are revered like martyrs.
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Government
But the biggest thing in disfavor of balochis is that they are cutoff unlike east pakistan (punjabis / army couldn't be pumped as much as they are being now in balochistan). Plus bengalis' population was bigger and more politically / economically motivated (this is a quality issue which can be changed but i don't think the balochi sardars would want it as these progressive factors can work against them too..).
Rest are factors like many bengalis had been in the army before the '71 revolt (some say it did play a part as it helped india find pak defence weaknesses which might be true as pak didnt adapt itself well to the insurgency) but so do balochis with the land they know more well than the army (including where and when to hideout).
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Governmen
There is a difference. The movements that you've mentioned [other than the current one in Pak] all have their roots in the grassroot grievances of the common people, not just the grievances of the few from the tribal elite.
Every place has its own culture. And cultures change over a period of time. You don't TEACH A WHOLE NATION HOW TO LIVE. Instead, you EDUCATE them, n then they LEARN BY THEMSELVES how they will live. n the justification that they don't let the females to get education is not valid. If it is so, how many male members of the baloch families educated? THE REASON FOR LACK OF EDUCATION IS THE LACK OF INTEREST OF THE GOVT OF PAKISTAN. THEY ARE ONLY INTERESTED IN LOOTING THEIR WEALTH. AND SPENDING THAT WEALTH TO QUENCE THEIR OWN THIRST. Now they're bombing Karachi, Gwadar not to mention those poor Chinese engineers which they have been kidnapping for ages.
Thats how thieves are treated. What the need of the moment is that this whole feudal structure needs to be dismantled, perhaps in the whole country. and people have to be tought to live like normal civilized citizens of the rest of the world. No where in the civilized world an army kills its own people.
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Government
Rest are factors like many bengalis had been in the army before the '71 revolt (some say it did play a part as it helped india find pak defence weaknesses which might be true as pak didnt adapt itself well to the insurgency) but so do balochis with the land they know more well than the army (including where and when to hideout).
Lets see what happens.
Lets hope the Indians don't help them out.
Lets hope the Americans don't help them out.
Lets hope the Russians don't help them out.
Lets hope the Pak Army doesnt get engaged in more fronts.
I wish my hopes could prevent all these threats.
The result of the war/insurgency is another issue. THE ISSUE IS THE RESISTANCE.
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Governmen
Shadan you obviously feel strongly about this, and your emotions are blocking logical reasoning. I've made my point and I've a rticulated it well. The problem in baluchistan is not lack of Pakistani government's interest, but the lack of will on the part of the Baluchi feudal lords to integrate into Pakistan. How they do that, I pointed it out. And let me tell you ONE thing: All the royalties that have been paid for the last many decades over the whole Sui Gas thing have been landing in the pockets of these same feudals. What do you think the Pak govt can do to solve THAT? Perhaps, create some magical system where the money can land directly into the pockets of every Baluchi? And then you'd debate who exactly a Baluchi is. Like say, Makaranis were brought to Baluchistan and they aren't Baluchi. The argument would never end. And I think on the same note, corporations mining salt in Kewra and minerals in many other parts of Pakistan are "thieves". Duh. Learn to live in the modern world, learn to integrate.
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Government
The only big factor is america (india cannot help out much if america doesn't give a big nod to it in afghanistan). This leaves Iran. Believe me when I say that Iran doesn't like balochis too much either (being sunni also doesn't help...) and it will be like Turkey helping Kurds form a kurdistan and you know what are the chances of that happening.. ;)
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Governmen
Sardari system needs to end in Pakistan but also for the "sake of federation", Pakistan needs to become a federal state where Pakistan is more than just Punjab (a punjabi army running a country is first NO NO!!!! ).
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Governmen
Shadan you want Baluchis to have the same fate as Bangladesh? That sucks, coz in every Economics class I've taken so far, Bangladesh is given as the model for everything which is wrong with the third world. It is at the bottom of the totem pole, and now they're having ANOTHER insurgency. Guess the problem wasn't Pakistan, after all :)
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Governmen
Well I agree with you that there HAS to be a division of responsibilities. It’s essential. But then you can not exactly blame Punjab coz with over 95+ million people out of the 140 something in Pak are Punjabis. Their representation everywhere would hence be proportional to their size. Block them out, and they’d say you’re depriving them of THEIR right. Btw, on the army thingie, the current top brass of the Pakistan army is VERY diverse. Mushie and lots of other generals are the prime example of that.
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Governmen
That was just alqaeda terrorists!
And as for the punjab issue, maybe you are a punjabi yourself and don’t see the issue but there have been excesses as east pakistan wouldn’t have had separated (when you come to grips with the situation that bengalis were one of the most pro-Pakistan supporters and Muslim League started in bengal, NOT Punjab!). Even today statements like Punjab will topple any government that doesn’t build KBD or stops midway in its construction doesn’t really help the so-called interprovincial harmony!
People in Pakistan needs to admit their mistakes otherwise the federation will fall apart !
NFC needs to be revamped or scrapped all together and a US type tax system needs to be introduced (federal, state, and local taxes) so we don’t have situations like zia or moreso Nawas Badsharif spending money on all of Lahore while Karachi is neglected!
I shudder to think what will happen in Karachi if there had been no Edhi Foundation. Such is the state of health and everything in the biggest city of Pakistan!
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Governmen
^^ The only solution is to set out new provinces on non-ethnic lines. That is the ONLY thing I can figure out.
The state of health in Karachi is no better than in Lahore, Peshawar, Bombay, Calcutta etc. No point complaining there. But yes, Eidhi absolutely rocks! He's single handedly transformed the whole health setup in Pak.
Oh and please, I've lived in Karachi for so long. It's a great city, just go there and look at the new fly overs and other developments. I remember what a Dutch philanthropist who dedicated his life to Khi [can't remember that guy's name] who recently died had said. He had blamed the KDA for all the mess in Khi. But yes, more funding wouldn't have hurted and the fact that those wild bedouines of Dubai could take their city to THAT level while Khi, being in a better position missed the bus is what bothers me too.
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Government
What is the likelihood of that happening?
The biggest hurdle would be the feudals (chaudhris, waderas) but don’t underestimate the power of so-called educated but big provincial lobbies.
Mush floated this idea but I don’t see it happening considering how he has now chosen to more solidify his power like Zia or Ayub Khan than take a risk like that?
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Governmen
^^ All this stuff is really off topic. I would want to talk about Bangladesh in specific, however. Their grievance was that they aren't getting their share. Like West-Pak sells jute, they make money, we don't get money. 35 years later, Bangladesh STILL has a third of the forex reserves Pak has, it's per capita GDP is not only the lowest in South Asia, but among the lowest in the world. So they got their independence, got their rights, had all the opportunities, and now THIS? Where is all the wealth going? With a population almost equal to Pakistan's, their budget expenditure as of 2004 was HALF of Pakistan's. Their per-capita GDP is nowhere near Pak's. Poverty is still huge. 40% of Bengalis are still unemployed [yeah check that out, now!]. And if I get that stuff out of freedom, I'd be depressed as hell.
Re: Baloch tribal elders urge action against Nawab Bugti; Support Musharraf Government
Wasn't Pakistan and nepal in the LDP (low developed countries) list in the human development index a year or so back?
Pakistan did copy the Grameen bank program of Bangladesh in its rural areas. Atleast now they have a say in their own decisions and they have a better armed forces (though they cannot defeat india but before they were totally defenceless as their argument goes?????).
