Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

Society Pakistan & World Affairs
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Without getting agitated, without answering in tangent, without being illogical and talking absurd, without giving ridiculous statements, without showing ignorance of simple facts … and without avoiding answers to clear the issue and keeping quite.

Please let us know that when you (or your party) talks about muzakarat (talk or negotiation) with terrorists, or even muzakarat with terrorists who accepts Pakistani constitution and do not want to fight, what you (or your party) really mean … because, from my understanding;

1: Those who accept Pakistani constitution and do not want to fight, then they would be same as any law abiding Pakistani citizen and there is no need for muzakarat so why demand and talk about muzakarat (governments do not start muzakarat with peaceful citizens). This group can throw their guns, stop killing innocent people, stop attacking Pakistani forces and assets, stop suicide attacks of all kind, stop sectarian killing, and then disappear in population (join sane people of society), become law abiding citizen, and live peacefully. No need for muzakarat or all this drama.

2: Those who do not accept Pakistani constitution and want to fight Pakistan (state and ordinary Pakistanis), then muzakarat is not only waste of time but obviously undesirable so why demand and talk about muzakarat. How can government do muzakarat with those who want to fight the state, kill innocent Pakistani citizens, keep doing suicide attacks, keep killing people on sectarian grounds, and keep breaking law of the land?

So … please help to understand the situation … and what you or your party really mean when they talk about muzakarat?.

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

Well, Its not that simple, man. Govs have to see many things... Before offnsive. I Personally feel that army operation should be launched against TTP but without touching Haqaani network and Organizatnz linked with afghan talbans.

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

What I mean when I talk of peace is the same way the US government talks of peace with the Afghan Taliban.

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

^^^ Taliban is not fighting USA government in USA, nor killing American citizens, neither USA thinks Taliban have capability to do so. Purpose of USA is to neutralize mad mullahs of Pakistan and Afghanistan so that they could not harm their interest.

For America, they do not care if mad mullahs of Pakistan and Afghanistan kill innocent citizens of Pakistan and Afghanistan.

Taliban also do not want to fight USA or impose their way of life on America and kill Americans who do not follow their way of life or understanding of Islam.

Thus, Americans can afford to negotiate, rather that is the best solution for them, unless they like to stay in Afghanistan permanently and keep the country occupied.

To compare American negotiation with Taliban with Pakistan negotiation with Taliban, is like comparing Halwa with Haddi.

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

Do we know what kind of Muzakrat we want to do with them?

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

Sa1eem bhai I came across this petition set up by a guy from Lahore addressed to gov urging them to take more action. What are your views? Could signing make gov feel they should be more accountable. Petition · Crush the Taliban, Long Live Pakistan - Pakistan · Change.org

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

^^^ I do not know what type of muzakarat Pakistan government want to do with Taliban, that is why I asked.

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

Shaasavera: I think it would have helped if Pakistan government was interested in Pakistan and not corruption ... plus, my feeling is that, government of NS has soft corner for Taliban, as they are killing innocent Pakistanis with whom Nawaz has no interest and sparing those Pakistanis with whom Nawaz and his team associate themselves.

Be assured that Taliban may kidnap son of Yasuf Gillani and Salman Taseer (what they did) ... but would not put their hands on children of Nawaz and his team. Taliban may do suicide attack on Sunni and Shia mosques and mazars ... but would never touch Raiwand gathering or Deobandi mosques. And so on ...

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

I guess the US government made a mistake when they said they will negotiate with the Taliban. But you are obviously right and the past 3 years were just some hashish induced dream for the rest of the world.

Sorry my mistake. Its not like the Taliban have killed Americans. Its not like the Time Square bombing was a TTP sponsored event. Its not like the Taliban have stated they wish to convert the entire world to Islam and they didn't try to convert the US soldier they held hostage.

Nope none of that happened.

But I love your last sentence. It is okay for the US to negotiate with terrorists. But it is bad for Pakistan to do so. Mashallah.

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

When 10,000 mad dogs are in your backyard then you kill them (best is to poison them) … but if they are far away in remote continent, you do not take the task of killing them, you make sure they do not come near your backyard, so you do tight immigration control and quarantine the dog if any dog do get in (maybe put the dog down).

Taliban has infected Pakistan and not USA. If USA would find out that a Taliban got into USA, they would put him in quarantine so that this rabid animal does not spread the disease.

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

Thanks for invalidating the US interventions in Afghanistan and Iraq. Because that is the exact opposite of what the US government said in 2001.

Well done.

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

^^^ Please try to answer what I asked in my first post and do not answer in tangent or something irrelevant.

I am not here to defend what USA has done or is doing. I can only give opinion about their invasion ... and that is, USA invaded Iraq and Afghanistan to safeguard their interest.

Iraq: They went in so that their puppet Kuwait get liberated, other puppet Saudi Arabia feel secure ... and their concubine Israel feel safe.

Afghanistan: They felt that Afghanistan under Taliban can be used to spread terrorism across the world hitting their interest, so they came in to neutralize Taliban. If they are negotiating with Taliban than it means, they must be trying to secure their borders from mad dogs of Pakistan and Afghanistan, and after giving lot of bashing to Taliban they feel that Taliban would come to table and obey their orders (regardless of what these rabid animals claim for public consumption).

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

I gave my answer. You didn't like it so you decided to defend the US rather unsuccessfully.

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

^^^ What answer did you give?

Am I stupid that I could not get your answer ... or ... maybe you want to say that since America is negotiating with Taliban Pakistan should do the same ... but that is not answer, or is it?

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

pakistan knows the language, culture, religion etc of these people way better than the US, have assets amongst them from at least the last 30 years, and still is unable to make significant headway into dialog. why is that?

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

People who talk about 'muzakarat' should be arrested and handed over to these animals first before exploding nuclear device on all of them. There is absolutely no other solution.

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

Purpose of 'negotiations' was to separate groups within Taliban who want to continue attacking from those who do not want to fight and are interested in peace. In last few months fight within Taliban has indicated that the some groups separating themselves from criminal thugs who want to spread destruction. I hope government has identified clearly which groups want peace and which groups are not interested in peace. The groups who still want to fight can be marked as TTP and the one who want peace should be considered Pakistani/Muslims.

Government/military should start target-killing of TTP leadership. Blind-bombing/shelling/F16-bombing will not help the cause as errors will generate more fuel for TTP.

I was watching Kashif Abbasi program yesterday and he had invited many people (Sh Waqas, Hameed Gul, representative from PMLN, PTI, Samiul Haq etc.), in that program to answer one of the questions the PTI rep said that there is no question/doubt over action needed over 'foreign' elements (like these Uzbeks/IMU) within Pakistan, they need to be eliminated.

My personal opinion is that any bombing-operation is shooting yourself in the foot. Countering terrorism requires multi-faceted program which includes revising anti-terrorism laws (specially which requires evidences), controlling financial transactions, curbing hate-speech, curbing takfiri-fatwa business, controlling (or preferably closing of) Pak-Afghan border, ammunition control, strict monitoring of mega-city entrances etc.

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

kiss munh say taliban ko support kartay hain aap..................................................taliban say muzaqrat!

bariee himat hai aap kee....

we are dead, saray jism say lahoo beh raha hai......................blood is draining from each and every spot, mosques are burnt, airports are destroyed, markets are bombed, no one comes to our country and we cant get any visas...

everything is burning but zafra and many like him still support taliban directly or indirectly

they are OK to be killed, to be massacred by these animals, to be slaughtered by these barbarians but they will continue blaming USA for everything and somehow supporting taliban

People, just remember these folks...because one day we will eventually going to win against these taliban animals....and these folks will change their color and will suddenly portray to be talibans' biggest enemies....yaad rakhna Zafra and many like him who used to support taliban. They were real culprits for not letting develop a consensus against taliban and for all the bloodbath in pak

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

Captain Saheb, kash aap meri post parh laytay aur sawal samajh laytay. :)

You wrote that purpose of negotiations was to separate groups within Taliban who want to continue attacking from those who do not want to fight and are interested in peace. … But … what is the need or requirement of talk or negotiation for that separation?

Those who do not want to fight and are interested in peace, they would not fight, surrender their weapon and start living peacefully just like all law abiding Pakistanis are living … no one stops them to do that and there is no need to talk or negotiate. Read my post … and read clause 1.

You will know that I did talk about this group … and it is obvious that for Taliban to live in peace, negotiation is neither needed nor required, as their start living peacefully would be just them changing their attitude without negotiation … as negotiation means condition getting attached for changing attitude … that means the group not interested in not fighting and peace, but condition … what they can get for peace … and Pakistan cannot accept conditions as Pakistan is in no position to give them anything for peace except death to them.

As for those who want to fight and keep creating fitna in Pakistan … talk or negotiation is again neither needed nor required … because they would be armed and fighting … and with them, Pakistan should use full force to fight. Read clause 2.

Now tell me, what you think is the need or requirement for talk or negotiation?

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Re: Att: PTI, PMLN, JI, JUI, Deobandis, etc … who supports muzakarat with terrorists

When a "hostage" situation takes place, why they do "negotiations" first?