are mohajirs more progressive?

Rajput yaar….what kinda jackass came up with the term “Urdu Speakers”, do you see the contradiction here? It is a dumbass term whereby one is associating a segment of a society based purely upon linguistic affiliation, yet one comes up with an English suffix (i.e., “Speaking”) to describe it. Do you know what I am saying?

I know what your saying, but this ethnic group-- if you choose to classify it as such, is not exactly easy to characterize, no singular culture, location, custom classifies them. Unlike the other 4 provinces of Pakistan, the urdu speakers come from a mind boggling variety of distinct places, cultures etc. Sure this anamoly is due to FORCING a creation of a group that doesn't exist. I mean this whoe issue of classifying migrants from India is more politically motivated than anything else. I have explained numerous times how the "Mohajir" term is as BS as Urdu Speakers-- which is atleast more accurate, despite being a linguistic affilation.

In my part of Punjab, Mohajirs are refereed to as “Hindustanis” (whether they speak Punjabi or not). Now that makes a lot more sense than calling them Urdu Speaking. On top of that, there still is a deep-rooted resentment (however wrong) for it being the official language while only less than 10% of the population considers it their mother tongue.

Well in my part of Punjab, the Pashtuns/Hinkians call all Punjabis and Urdu Speakers hindustanis...From their POV, Punjabis and "Hindustanis" are cousins. I don't mind the term Hindustani, in fact thats more coherent than Mohajir. I have absolutely no deep rooted resentment towards Urdu, as a fellow Punjabi you know how we have adopted Urdu quite willingly. If anything, we have neglected Punjabi specifically to promote Urdu.

Since you argued that it were an isolationists’ term (e.g. giving an impression of insularity) that’s why I said that it was not, and it indeed is a term which should be acceptable. This community is not much different from Auslanders in Germany or Outsiders in Southern England. The bottomline is that it is an issue that requires a lot of discussion and some common sense solution. I can see that some get touchy about being called a Mohajir, (and may be rightfully so, MAY BE), but that’s just the history of their ancestors. You keep talking about over 50 years of independence, I would hope that even in 5000 years from today, they should remember what their ancestry was, and how they came to Pakistan.

Ok let me describe a discussion i had with a good family friend whose background happens to be from Rajasthan. His family crossed into Pakistan in 1947, and was considered to be Mohajir. This fella was born in Larkana and considers himself Pakistani. So when he conveyed his frustration and anger over the term "Mohajir" it made sense. Although this person has never seen India or his ancestoral home, he is immediately detached from the larger Sindhi community because he is a "foreigner" not a son of the soil eventhough his Sindhi is superb and knowledge of the culture rivaling Sindhis. WHAT THE HELL is the Mohajir ancestory? There is no Mohajiristan or the like. They can and do remember their history by discussing the place their ancestors are from like UP, Hyderabad etc., When you talk about ancestory, being a Mohajir doesn't come into the picture beyond the fact that yes their grandparents migrated to pakistan in year so and so.. Ever go to Karachi? Talk to a large group of "Mohajirs" and watch the identity evaporate as the discussion gets deeper, suddenly those from South India will begin to adopt a common position while North Indians doing the same...to the extreme point the breakdown comes down to Allahbadis vs. Delhvis. Like I have said that "Mohajir" label is limited to dealing with Sindhis, Baluchis, Punjabis and Pashtuns...while the community is more fractured than the other ethnic groups of Pakistan.

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*Originally posted by Zakk: *
Hmm touchy subject; for people from my side of Attock, we use the term Muhajirs or Mohajirs for the Afghani refugees. When referring to urdu speaking people some say "karachi Muhajirs".

I think the term Mohajirs shows the Urdu speaking community's need for some sense of ethnic or national identity which is distinct from their Pakistani identity. A reaction probably to seeing how the other ethnic groups defend their sense of identity and language.

If I remember right, a similar controversy happened when the MQM was in talks with the PONM( Pakistan oppressed Nations Movement) alliance to join them. The PONM, people refused to accept Mohajirs as the "Nationality", instead calling them a Urban Middle class political "tehrik". That wasn't acceptable to the MQM. But a fundamental shift occurred after the MQM broke with Nawaz Sharif since then, with it's alliances with the JSQM, the MQM wants to project the Urdu speaking community as Urban "Sindhi's", that's probably a good move on their part, because if you can't accept the people who gave up land and opened their homes for you as neighbours, things won't work.
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Bingo :k: right on the money Zakk!

Well then the Afghani Refugees are appropriately considered Muhajirs since they are migrants from Afghanistan, AND their arrival has been in the 1980s-Present. For their first generation to be classified as a Mohajir, it would be more appropriate.

I think Zakk’s account supports my belief that the word Mohajir is a highly charged political term that is isolationist and inaccurate. Urban Sindhis is a good move, eventhough I consider JSQM to be inherently anti-Pakistani in ideology.

Let me hasten to add that by arguing against the Mohajir identity, I am not intending to degrade the migration experience, but rather asking the progeny of Muhajirs to become integrated into their communities in Pakistan, without forgetting their heritage.

well pakistan was created primarily by urdu speaking muslims of up, bihar bombay. the migration in punjab took place because of the voilence that occured at the time.
and you should know that the non urdu speaking muslims (exept punjab and bengal) were not too much involved in the pakistan struggle gujrati muslims prefered thier gujrati culture and language,likewise tamils keralite muslims assamese muslims and to some extend even the kashmiri muslims were not a part of the pakistan movement it was the urdu speaking elite that were at the forefront

kabir that is because pakistani mulims were laready majority in thier own states .

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by RajputFury: *

In my part of Punjab, Mohajirs are refereed to as “Hindustanis” (whether they speak Punjabi or not). Now that makes a lot more sense than calling them Urdu Speaking. On top of that, there still is a deep-rooted resentment (however wrong) for it being the official language while only less than 10% of the population considers it their mother tongue.

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RF, that doesnt make sense...if the pashtuns call the punjabis as hindustanis, it makes sense, but the culture of hinkians is similar to punjabis, so much so that the pashtuns consider them as punjabis...

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*Originally posted by zaavia: *

RF, that doesnt make sense...if the pashtuns call the punjabis as hindustanis, it makes sense, but the culture of hinkians is similar to punjabis, so much so that the pashtuns consider them as punjabis...
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I know Zaavia, but try telling that to the Hinkians..the stock answer you get from them will be that they are a distinct group or they are Pashtuns. In any case, they are a distinct group with Punjabi/Pashtun influences.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by kabir: *
well pakistan was created primarily by urdu speaking muslims of up, bihar bombay. the migration in punjab took place because of the voilence that occured at the time.
and you should know that the non urdu speaking muslims (exept punjab and bengal) were not too much involved in the pakistan struggle gujrati muslims prefered thier gujrati culture and language,likewise tamils keralite muslims assamese muslims and to some extend even the kashmiri muslims were not a part of the pakistan movement it was the urdu speaking elite that were at the forefront
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Kabir, your definately on target with what you have said. Clearly Pakistan's history and creation attests to the vital role of Urdu speakers.