arabization of islam - great article

i think this is quite relevant to a lot of areas in the muslim world where arabization = increased piety

im glad some are seeing the light

http://www.altmuslim.com/a/a/a/2648/

Re: arabization of islam - great article

I don't think most people like to talk about this or that there even is an Arabization of Islam.

Re: arabization of islam - great article

^ im sorry, thats just not the case. Infact its a debate thats occurred on GS many times.

Heres 4 threads I opened on the topic. and I dont brand need to brand myself alt-muslim either.

http://www.paklinks.com/gs/showthread.php?t=157521
http://www.paklinks.com/gs/showthread.php?t=177274
http://www.paklinks.com/gs/showthread.php?t=186053
http://www.paklinks.com/gs/showthread.php?t=217482

afaik nobody in all those 4 threads really said Arabic culture was part of Islam. then again its not really about what people say they believe in, its about what you believe they believe isnt it semi

Re: arabization of islam - great article

What is arabization? What does it mean? If it means learning Arabic for the sake of understanding the primary sources of the faith...then so be it.

If anything, the *westernization *of Islam - that remoulding of the faith more or less as an exercise to make it more paletable to the Western eye - is more of a concern than arabization...

Re: arabization of islam - great article

One can NEVER fully understand the meaning of the Quran if one reads it in English or any other language other than Arabic.

In Arabic, God sounds sad and compassionate in the Quran and in English, God sounds angry and vengeful.

Re: arabization of islam - great article

i dunno. i know arabic to the extent that I understand 70 percent of what I read, but although I know no translation can match the beauty of it, if a translation doesnt render true meaning isnt that a flaw of translation?

I mean a translation is the meaning as expressed by an absolute expert. In your mind you're translating anything you read into your primary language, so reading it directly is equivalent to reading the translation of a novice.

Re: arabization of islam - great article


Sorry I didn't take into consideration the 4 threads you posted over the last several years (where 2 of them had to do with Arabic language and not culture).

I realize that no one said Arabic culture is part of Islam. That's my point. No one wants to admit to it. So in this particluar case, yes, it is what I believe that they believe. The practice of Islam has huge Arabic cultural aspects to it. The article posted here does a fair job of outlining some of the areas.

Re: arabization of islam - great article

those are 4 just by me, im sure theres plenty others. and language and culture are very related, even the article posted talks about language and arabic language names.

i think there is a lot of arabic language pushing. not much else to a very significant level. but yeah, i disagree with it.

Re: arabization of islam - great article

:k:

Re: arabization of islam - great article

If someone says that the message and power of message in Quran cannot be captured in any other language. They should talk to those who revert or convert to Islam because of power of this message not because the beauty of lexicon of Quran. Most of the reverts or converts to Islam do not know how to read Quran in Arabic. What does that mean ?

Some Muslim scholars in their zeal to prove that the the lexicon of Quran in itself is a miracle therefore it is impossible to translate it . They try to do that to impress the non muslims , for a true muslim it does not matter if the lexicon of Quran is Miracle or not.

Should Quran be read by a Muslim to judge its beauty and appreciate beauty of language or for the message it carries ? More than 85 percent of masses of Muslim countries are illiterate and cannot even read their own language. They are communicated the message of Quran by imams of masajids they go to. Does it make them less of a Muslim ?
It is not true that beauty of writings of one language cannot be captured by another language. If the translator is expert in both languages and understand the message carried by that language he/she can capture the beauty of message in his/her native language completely. Yes I have seen people crying in namaz when the listen to certain iyats of Quran . So do the Shia's when they listen to a noha or marsia, so do concert goers in USA and UK and other countries.
My point is the beauty of Quran can be captured in other languages so make it more appealing and meaningful for the native listeners. Allah and our Holy Prophet knew this that is why it was never mandated that to be a Muslim you have to know Arabic. So many people in Arab countries do not understand and comprehend the major portion of Quran because it is in classical Arabic.
Yes Allah Challenges non believers to produce surahs like it. But that challenge does not apply to the lexicon the challenge applies to the message and the power of the message in those surahs.

Re: arabization of islam - great article

The article doesn’t denounce learning Arabic for the sake of understanding and appreciating the Quran better, so why are those of you ag/the article crying foul about this?

Try to read the article better next time… :rolleyes:

Re: arabization of islam - great article

some names were not considered islamic and sahaba who had them their names were changed by the Prophet, so this practice is correct in some cases
e.g sahabi shaheed sulaiman b surad [ra] original name was yasar but was changed by the Prophet[saw]

just beacuse somebody wears an arab dress or headgear does not make him/her more holy , however if one adapts arab customs out of devotion to the prophet[saw] as they were the ones followed by our beloved prophet[saw] then who are we to blame them?
what picoico is hinting at * is the hypocritical new trend which encourages muslims to adapt western rolemodels yet at the same time ridicules them for following arab customs*

Re: arabization of islam - great article

The question was: what is arabization? The article even pointed out how the Salwar Kameez was construed as "Islamic" when in fact it is South Asian...odd for an article proclaiming the arabization of Islam. So again, where is the arabization? What does it mean?

Yes, I do know some desis who absorb a lot of Arab cultures....but to their credit, they lived and studied in the Middle East...

Why cry foul? Because, in spite of the intent of the article, it feeds into a sense of racism many have against Arabs...odd, I know, since it seems to be Arab racism the article seems to be railing against. Fair enough...but that wasn't the main focus of the article. So I need to know, even if people do go all "Arab" in an effort to be more pious...what's so bad about Arab culture anyway...especially (as Das Riech so rightly pointed out) as it pertains to how we practice the faith? People are bending over backwards to defend Valentines Day in one thread...and here some bemaon the "arabization" of Islam...granted, not the same people...but there's a problem here if people refuse to point out the double standards being applied...

Re: arabization of islam - great article

Peace All

Islam has allowed me to be very cultural. I can wear clothes from Morroco, Algeria, UK, Saudi and Pakistan ... the problem in the initial article is it assumes a person dressed in a given way is becoming arabized - whatever that means. I do to some extent understand this and believe some Arabs feel a monopoly of Islam exists with them but that is the extent of it.

As for Muslim names ... to answer the question "what is wrong with the names their parents gave them?" Well if they have meaningless names or names with contra-Islamic meanings then changing them is necessary. Of course the new name chosen does not have to be Arabic.

As for Arabic as a language I don't see what problem people have with it. English is an international language but such sentiments are not brought up about it taking over the world, so Arabic should also be allowed to spread too.

As for translation of Qur'an I do believe many of them are accurate but to have 'true' meaning the Arabic needs to be known in the context of it's culture and time of revelation. The best thing for non-Arabs is never to restrict themselves to any one translation, but to get a view from lots of angles by reading at least three or four different translations, from people of differing backgrounds. This is because some terms are translated more or less literally based on the theological stance of the Muslim translator.

Re: arabization of islam - great article

What are you talking about?

People all over the world complain that globalization has resulted in the imposition of generically American culture in their countries, at the expense of their traditional languages and customs.

If people want to learn Arabic to gain a better compregention of the Quran, thats fine. But I do take issue with the culturally imperialist idea that Arabic language and/or customs are in any way superior to my own.

Re: arabization of islam - great article

If Islam claims to be a religion for all people and all time, then the dress, culture, language, names, etc should have nothing to do with Arabia. An American should be able to convert without changing his name, learning Arabic or changing the way he dresses. Yes, Arabia in Islam has built-in supremacy by dictating hajj and facing Mecca 5 times a day, but outside of that a person should be allowed to live in his culture as long as it does not violate Islamic principles.

Re: arabization of islam - great article

Noone is forcing anybody to be Muslim. Islam is a choice. However, don't convert to Islam if your intention is to corrupt it by bringing in your white Amsterdam homosexual-friendly lifestyle. If you don't like Islam as it is, you have the right to follow any other religion. we will still respect you as a human being, but don't try to corrupt/change Islam.

Re: arabization of islam - great article

Mr. Hazara.

Islam is not your McDonald or Burger King. White culture is trying to destroy native cultures and replace it with homosexuality/MTV/ Paris hilton's sex scandals.

Islam has a 1500 year old history, if you think it is too "arabinized" then please join any other religion that you feel comfortable in.

Re: arabization of islam - great article


The people who changed Islam were the ones who took the Quran and made it an Arab-specific religion.

BTW, can you make one post without referring to whitey? You take Arabization of Islam to a new level - the browning of Islam.

Re: arabization of islam - great article

The article is not suggesting all muslims become westernized instead. The writer might be from a western country, so maybe that's where the confusion comes from. The article is suggesting why can't we hold on to certain cultural practices, as long as they don't violate Islam?