And honestly this whole point that Islam gives the women the right to live seperatel really makes me LOL. Because how convinent for all these girls to bring in Islam when they desire. They fail to however understand that with this right Islam also gives women the responsibility to make sure their husband is happy with their conduct and that they obey their husband and his rules. How many of you are willing to do that? Do you know you are not allowed to go out of your house if your husband prohibits you to do so? I bet none of you would be aware of this fact.
And obviously if the parents live in the same house they will interfere. Whatelse will they do? I mean they also want to be part of decision making process and want to be part of everything. How can they let the wife make all the decisions because after all they raised the son and feel its their right to have a say in how things are run.
Ok?! SO you think moving out is the way to go about it cuz it wl not allow the parents to have a say in how their son n his family lead their life....?
Whatever.
Later when the couple moves out, more troubles come in...guy often thinking their is too much influence of the girl's family n blah blah. There is no end to this problem if you keep runing from it.
Ok?! SO you think moving out is the way to go about it cuz it wl not allow the parents to have a say in how their son n his family lead their life....?
Whatever.
Later when the couple moves out, more troubles come in...guy often thinking their is too much influence of the girl's family n blah blah. There is no end to this problem if you keep runing from it.
I am not talking about running away from the problem, im talking about ENDING it. The cause of all these problems is the joint family system. Why should the guys parents have any say on how he should run things in his home with his wife? He's married now and he has a seperate way of living. He should be making decisions with his WIFE, not parents! Thats why two people get married, so that they can live their life together. How can you do you things your way when you have your parents living with you?
Just because you are livng seperatly with your wife doesn't mean you stop careing for your parents.
Do you think americans don't love their parents?
Basically, she should ask, and he should grant her permission. For regular, every day tasks, she shouldn’t have to ask permission everytime. In fact, in a healthy marriage where the spouses love and trust one another, there shouldn’t even be a need to ask permission for every little out-of-home errand. At least that’s how I interpreted what they said in the above website and the hadith (Volume I, Chapter 167) on women asking their husband’s permission for leaving the home.
As for the living separately thing…a man has a duty to house his wife with privacy and comfort, and if that requires an individual home, then so be it…at the same time, a man has a duty to take care of his parents (as a woman has a duty to take care of her parents), so some sort of compromise should be reached where both can be accomplished. Perhaps moving into a house a short distance away from his parents or living in the same apartment complex while maintaining separate apartments. This explains it a bit better:
^ They probably do, But their way of living is different than ours. Our culture, our set up is so that we are meant to live together. So are our values and norms.
I am not saying live together at any cost. Don't if things dont wrk out but dont just move away from the opportunity of making a happy family for small issues. Like if your inlaws want to have a say in how you guys lead your life, why does it tick you off so much? Havent your parents have that right over you all these years? Eventually when you get your kids you will have that rite over them. Why must we make it a ego issue?
Our culture is set up that way. But it doesn't make it right. Everybody needs a little privacy and Islam, which contradicts and ultimately trumps our culture, has dictated that we should receive it if it is possible. It doesn't sound like the poster's friend is royally ticked off or anything. She just craves her own space and wants to be able to make her own decisions after years of not being able to do so. Those are not massive expectations...they are her rights under Islam.
Plus, the inlaws are described as understanding and good people, so there may not be a problem with them living separately but close by...sounds like it's only the husband who is having the issue.
^ They probably do, But their way of living is different than ours. Our culture, our set up is so that we are meant to live together. So are our values and norms.
I am not saying live together at any cost. Don't if things dont wrk out but dont just move away from the opportunity of making a happy family for small issues. Like if your inlaws want to have a say in how you guys lead your life, why does it tick you off so much? Havent your parents have that right over you all these years? Eventually when you get your kids you will have that rite over them. Why must we make it a ego issue?
So our culture can't be wrong? There was a time when slavery was acceptable in many cultures that doesnt mean we need to stick to it. Racism was a norm too back in the day but now its considered unacceptable.
We need to move ahead in a positive direction, not stuck in a hell hole of inlaws and crazy idea of everyone living "happily" together which almost never happens in real life for the vast majority of joint families. Theres a reason why we keep hearing of saas-bahu or devrani-jhetani- nand fights all the time.
It ticks me off only because when im marrying someone, i want to have my independ life with that person where i can make my own decision whether its somethign as minor as the curtain selection or decisions regardin my children.
I don't have a "right" over my kids decision once they are mature enough to have thier own jobs, live on their own and get married. ONce you get married, its you and your spouse who should be running thier households.
So yah if my mother in law is demanding i would do my best to understand her point of view and adjust however if she is just demanding me to do something thats against my ethics, morals i will sit down with her and let her know.
No sane person can ask you to do wrong but if its just different customs then i had try and strike a balance. See even parents at times have different views than you but that doesnt make you leave them or dislike them.
NO desi MIL would sit down and have a heart to heart chit chat with her DIL so they can work things out.
It's great that you have such open mind and would like to keep things in balance but that would only happen in Utopia (I believe someone has already said that).
And yeah it would be THE SANE PEOPLE who would say and do stuff that would make you go....are they for real? Why are they actin so insane.
However not all inlaws are evil. There are some real messed up dils out there as well. You do your part by doing everything right and hope for others to do theirs. But if you think everything is going to be fine and dandy all the time then unfortunately that's just being in denial.
So our culture can't be wrong? There was a time when slavery was acceptable in many cultures that doesnt mean we need to stick to it. Racism was a norm too back in the day but now its considered unacceptable.
We need to move ahead in a positive direction, not stuck in a hell hole of inlaws and crazy idea of everyone living "happily" together which almost never happens in real life for the vast majority of joint families. Theres a reason why we keep hearing of saas-bahu or devrani-jhetani- nand fights all the time.
It ticks me off only because when im marrying someone, i want to have my independ life with that person where i can make my own decision whether its somethign as minor as the curtain selection or decisions regardin my children.
I don't have a "right" over my kids decision once they are mature enough to have thier own jobs, live on their own and get married. ONce you get married, its you and your spouse who should be running thier households.
I never said everything about our culture is right but atleast i happen to think the family system is great and its not only cultural but has great value in our religion too.
However i understand everybody wants to have independence in life, the rite to make their choices and all...I believe if you make an effort and build a strong relationship with your inlaws in the begining you will automatically be given all these rights. Nobody would want to burden their self making your decisions or selecting your curtains for you. I believe all these issues rise when the sense of competition comes in these relationships...like the sass thinking how dare she think she can make my son do all that when i who is his mother would never think of him doing that or the bahu thinking how dare my husband still listen and do as his parents advise him 2 do so why cant he be a man enuff to make his own call, blah blah. But if you guys understand each other and respect then i dont think such negative thoughts would occure. Both would be happy in their places.
Anyway, maybe this is just my wishful thinking but i would give it a chance and do my 101% to make it the reality :)
NO desi MIL would sit down and have a heart to heart chit chat with her DIL so they can work things out.
This is the attitude i think is very negative. Do you have to say the same when somebody advises you to sit down and clear out your issues with your mom or dad?! I hope not. Then why can't we give the same respect to our inlaws? Or for that matter any elder person. I am not saying go beg them but i dont see how it makes any small if they intiate to solve any issues there may be.
And talking about utopia, even here there are some very committed and God fearing people so i dont think its about utopia but only about clearity and goodness of your heart and soul that makes you think deeper than your whims. Mind you, i never said everything is gonna be glory by being your good self but atleast it gives you that satisfaction that you did your part and honestly. Not all good is well recieved in this world but that shouldnt make you not do it especially if you believe in the life after.
I never said everything about our culture is right but atleast i happen to think the family system is great and its not only cultural but has great value in our religion too.
However i understand everybody wants to have independence in life, the rite to make their choices and all...I believe if you make an effort and build a strong relationship with your inlaws in the begining you will automatically be given all these rights. Nobody would want to burden their self making your decisions or selecting your curtains for you. I believe all these issues rise when the sense of competition comes in these relationships...like the sass thinking how dare she think she can make my son do all that when i who is his mother would never think of him doing that or the bahu thinking how dare my husband still listen and do as his parents advise him 2 do so why cant he be a man enuff to make his own call, blah blah. But if you guys understand each other and respect then i dont think such negative thoughts would occure. Both would be happy in their places.
Anyway, maybe this is just my wishful thinking but i would give it a chance and do my 101% to make it the reality :)
Our family system actually sucks. Why do you hear about so many saas-bahu-nand-devrani-jheetani fights? look around you, you'll see it for yourself. This is a sign that this joint family system DOESN'T work. Why should anyone have to built a strong relationship with inlaws as you just mentioned? Am I marrying my inlaws? The only person i need to build a strong relationship is with my husband, not his family. And sense of competition is natural when you have so many people living in the same house. If everyone is living seperatly in their own homes, there will be no cold war.
I'm all for having my own space and I know that Islam provides me with that as a wife. But I also am a fan of the joint family system and believe it can work...because I've seen it work. Sure there are hiccups when you have so many people living together, but those hiccups don't decrease just because you live apart. In fact, I've seen just as many family feuds turn nuclear between family members who DON'T live in a joint system.
It's not the system that's messed up. It's the people who mess it up. Some of the crazy fights you see in a joint system break out over genuine issues such as the saas never letting the bahu have any say in her married life or the bahu saying nasty things about her susraal to hubby and anybody who will listen. But the majority of the ones I've seen start over stuff that just makes you think "let it GO already." Such as the saas not approving of where she was seated during the wedding, bahu being in a snit because saas got her the wrong shade of blue for the valima, random relative X is in a fury because his invitation was lost in the mail, etc. Seriously, I'm not making this up. So when you have people losing their marbles over stuff like this - joint family system or no - you're going to have problems.
As for no desi MIL sitting down and discussing problems with a DIL to figure things out...I beg to differ. Two of the women in my life that I love best in this world - my mother and MIL - do just that. I've seen examples of many more.
Mistral you rasie some fantastic points in your first post.
If the husband is willing to give his wife her private space then living close by shouldn't be an issue. I know of a family who does just that. Their in-laws live about a mile away from them and they visit them often/constantly.
I think in your friend's case, it looks like she'll have to compromise with her husband's wishes and have the in-laws stay with them.
This is the attitude i think is very negative. Do you have to say the same when somebody advises you to sit down and clear out your issues with your mom or dad?! I hope not. Then why can't we give the same respect to our inlaws? Or for that matter any elder person. I am not saying go beg them but i dont see how it makes any small if they intiate to solve any issues there may be.
And talking about utopia, even here there are some very committed and God fearing people so i dont think its about utopia but only about clearity and goodness of your heart and soul that makes you think deeper than your whims. Mind you, i never said everything is gonna be glory by being your good self but atleast it gives you that satisfaction that you did your part and honestly. Not all good is well recieved in this world but that shouldnt make you not do it especially if you believe in the life after.
Maham,
who said anything about NOT giving respect? After all the only way to earn respect is by giving it, right? I am all for giving respect no matter who's at the receiving end.
You have this notion if you'll give it a 100 % so will others. If you are willing to work out things, so will the rest. It just does not work like this unfortunately.
It's great that you are so positive about the whole inlaws issue and I am not asking you to change your thinking at all. All I am saying is it just doesn't happen the way you think it will.
Our family system actually sucks. Why do you hear about so many saas-bahu-nand-devrani-jheetani fights? look around you, you'll see it for yourself. This is a sign that this joint family system DOESN'T work. Why should anyone have to built a strong relationship with inlaws as you just mentioned? Am I marrying my inlaws? The only person i need to build a strong relationship is with my husband, not his family. And sense of competition is natural when you have so many people living in the same house. If everyone is living seperatly in their own homes, there will be no cold war.
Huh? So most love marriages end up in divoces so that means its a wrong idea to go for love marriages?. Seriously, Grow up!
If you believe marriage is union between two people only and their strong bond only then i guess i rest my case here. I don't want to waste my time arguing with you beyond this cuz you clearly show your understanding of what a marriage is to you and i think its not even worth a discussion.
You know I'd give more weight to the words of the one who's been married for years than someone whos just engaged or not married.
Sureeee....and i guess same could be said for sassu maa's too rite...we shouldnt listen to other people on what they say abt their experience but trust what the saas says cuz after all her words must carry more weight too cuz of her experience being the sass compared to what the onlookers have to say.
who said anything about NOT giving respect? After all the only way to earn respect is by giving it, right? I am all for giving respect no matter who's at the receiving end.
You have this notion if you'll give it a 100 % so will others. If you are willing to work out things, so will the rest. It just does not work like this unfortunately.
It's great that you are so positive about the whole inlaws issue and I am not asking you to change your thinking at all. All I am saying is it just doesn't happen the way you think it will.
If it doesnt happen, its ok i will move on but until that "doesnt" happen i shall remain positive :-). Otherwise i dont see all these trends ever changing if we dont step up and try and change them ourself.
