Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

Lifestyle Relationships
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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

I doubt he has kharadar type English, khatti, seems like you married into a reasonably well off memon family. Their English isn't THAT bad. But if your English is such that you actually came out of an Urdu medium school, you really need to question whether the guy really is an Engineer or Finance "Professional".

I notice everyone lists themselves as a "finance professional". WTH does that mean anyway?

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Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

Pcg, he actually comes from a lower socio-economic class, my MIL is not educated at all still uses a thumb print for signature on docs ...he was a completely self made/educated man once he came to the US. His families educational background, linguistics and all was worlds apart from mine. My point is, if the guy is a hard worker and good, decent human being, and all things like employment etc check out, I don't think it's fair to reject him based solely on what OP has described.

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy’s English speaking skills?

nicely done… I can see the " English major" part in action. off the topic but have to ask. what would be the best way to improve once English? I am really bad at it, so wanted some tips.

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

Its ok if you object on someone's English speaking skills. But if you extend it to the point where you start assessing someone's smartness and intelligence based on how good or bad English he speaks then i don’t have any words to convey how weird this statement is.

OP, I don’t think you should proceed with this guy because today you are finding his English speaking skills awful to the point of embarrassment. Tomorrow, you will find many other things in him which will make you feel embarrassed and the poor soul will keep on feeling insulted and you two will keep going into arguments. Spare him please.

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

English is the medium through which MOST business is done universally. If you're working in UAE for a foreign corp, which is what most of these desi guys end up doing, and if you're in an actual position where you are in leadership or you have a "good job" and you aren't just a paper shuffler, you need to know decent English skills. And if the English is atrocious enough that someone like Madz is cringing (let's face it, in GS everyone uses crappy grammar), then I believe her. Likely she is seeing sumting lyke aisa being typed on whatsapp.

Like I said, a lot of people from Pakistan deliberately type like crap, for fashion, but are actually educated people. I have plenty of engineers and other educated people in my family who type like that because it's fashionable amongst the guys from back home. But if you talk to them, they're not stupid.

That's why, you need to talk to a guy, and when he opens his mouth, you'll hear his language skills.

And I don't think it's attractive to type like that when you're talking to a potential rishta. You want to do with with friends because you think it's fun, like talking in ebonics, then fine. But not with a girl who is judging you and assessing what kind of linguistic skills you'll be passing to your kids.

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy’s English speaking skills?

Madz:

  1. If fluent English is one of your requirements for a future husband, then I see nothing wrong with that. We all have our personal requirements and since we’re talking about a man you’ll be spending your life with…its important that YOU be 100% comfortable with your choice.

  2. It seems that you have only chatted with the guy on Whatsapp so far and not had an actual conversation with him right? If the answer to this is “yes”, then I think you made a mistake in bringing up the language issue right now. Most people I know (including myself) don’t pay much attention to details when typing/texting. But when it comes to carrying a conversation or drafting a document for work…it’s a totally different situation. My husband was born/raised in the U.S. and English is his only language (plus he’s educated). But if you saw his texts, you’d think he barely passed 10th grade! :smack: With the rishta guy, I think you need to actually have a few conversations with him to see how he speaks and then come to a conclusion about his language skills.

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

^I actually like what PCG wrote. Please investigate thoughly as to what position he holds. You just want to be on a safe side. You have no idea....that amount of lie that goes on in these processes. And i know couple of examples, where a fellas from back home..lied about their profession. And if he has temper issues for something minor..then you can be assure that..he will have temper issues. Wo bhi for something small.

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

Yes, I agree with this. When it comes to ANY rishta...always make you sure you actually verify their education/employment regardless of how highly recommended they are by whoever.

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

Wow.

Just....wow.

Really?....really????

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

This reminds of my 12 year old neighbor kid who get's embarrassed when his family speaks Urdu with him in public or anyplace except home.

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

A lot of early immigrants to west barely spoke any english, I don't see how that was any problem for their kids.

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

ola amigo. I no ingliss...but i try to understand u. ok?

This is just a start. If his English on whatsapp is enough to embarrass you, you better find someone raised in US/Canada. Dont even go for UK accent guy. Life has bigger issues that you might run into than correct English later on.

on side note, English is just a language. Don't judge people on basis of language unless you absolutely cant live with it. All Hollywood stars can speak perfect English but their marriages lasts for few years...sometimes months..and sometimes days

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

I strongly disagree with this statement. My MIL's English is poor. She was a SAHM and both her boys(born/raised in U.S.) never had any issues learning English. I came to the U.S. as a pre-teen and needed to learn English. Even 'til this day, my parents English (especially my dad's) is very poor. In fact, I don't recall ever having a conversation with my parents in English. I would hope my posts on GS clearly indicate that I didn't have any issues becoming fluent in English.

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

I'd say getting mad at your question isn't a good sign. If the grammar problem were whatsapp specific, he could have simply explained. Why fly off the handle?

If there is a real problem with his grammar, again the temper won't help once he gets to Canada.

I know my grammar is less than perfect and I have an accent too. But I can't fix my grammar or accent without criticism, so I'm pretty open to it. Heck, if I know someone well, I ask them to analyze my accent and give me a low down on what's wrong with it (apparently a lot, can't even tell the difference between a 'V' and a 'W' much less pronounce them right.).

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

Maybe talk to him over the phone as most posters suggested, but probably be prepared for that it might not be as good as USA born and bred.

About the grammar, well .. Pakistani people are generally just bad at it and it just gets worse on Whatsapp and Viber .. Oh my, the time it takes to decode their message at times, sigh. On a more personal note, I've horrible writing and expressing skills, but my head works just fine with science :D .. My sis always does editing on my projects haha .. She is in a field where wording means big money! :D

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

Aww Saeed, your written English is pretty decent. Don't know about your accent.

Paheli, that's what he said too in his defense that Americans have the worst English yet they are ruling the world.

The thing is, if someone I was frank with gave me a constructive criticism, I wouldn't lash out on them. I would listen and try to understand their perspective and assess whether they're saying it for my benefit or to boost their own ego. If I felt their manner of pointing out my shortcomings was impolite, I would let them know but I would still address their concerns and offer my input calmly.

This guy just dismissed my point as "not important" and he took the argument as me questioning his authority. To him, family is first and foremost. Language, money, job, friends, etc are all secondary and therefore not as important. If there is ever a conflict between any of these and his respect, then he comes first.
He also hates being told how things work in North America. He gets very defensive very easily. Says that he has been managing his career (he is in IT & HR) on his own for so long, so clearly he doesn't need to be told how things are.
He also says Canada is not our country. English is not our mother tongue. A job can come and go. Etc. But family is first. I don't understand how improving one's language goes against family??? Or how one expects to support his family if he is unable to communicate properly and get a job?

To those who are wondering, I did speak to him on the phone a couple times but it was almost always in Urdu. I speak Urdu at home, so I didn't really give it much thought that he replies to me in Urdu even when I say something in English in between.
Also, PCG, no he doesn't wryte lyke dis. He makes grammar mistakes...like you does, or he do...or he'll say "listen it" instead of "listen to it", or "I no keep things in heart," etc.

My sis and mom disagree with my approach and my objection, which is what's making me feel so guilty about calling him out on it. Isn't marriage about listening to each other's concerns and making improvements in yourself? I really liked psyah's recent blog entry where he mentioned how he learned from his wife overtime and that's made him a better person.
I don't cook much now but I understand I'll have to do it once I get married. I am not going to tell my husband, oh food is more important to you than my comfort and you have disrespected me by pointing out that I am not cooking as frequently or as quickly as you would like. I would actually try to find out what's important to him and adjust my schedule accordingly. So why is it so hard for him to show some commitment that he will try to improve overtime? Why do Pakistani guys want to go "abroad" but are so opposed to being guided by someone who is familiar with the culture here? If family and respect is so important, then where is my respect? Why am I being made to feel like I'm somehow below him and my concerns aren't worth discussing? He said, "what do you think about yourself, you're not the only professional in the world and go find a prince charles."

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

The fact that he says Canada isn't his country yet he wants to move there for econimic advancement (he could find a match in the UAE), is a bad sign. Is that the message he will pass to his kids? Sorry kids you can screw this country, it's not really yours? Hai. Everyone wants to make money, no one wants to actually honor their citizenship. Then go back home, why come here?

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

Can't you marry like SaeedinPakistan or something, he seems normal. If my dude were to talk like that I think i'd have ego problems and because the majority of my conversations take place in English I would just find someone with whom i'm more conversationally comfortable with. It is true our parents came here with little knowledge of the English language but we now have choices to choose someone who is fluent in both and it shouldn't be that difficult a preference to get.

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

Ah....forget the language issues......these other issues should concern you more! Family is very important but it's ridiculous for him to believe that job/money etc. aren't important. As you already stated....how on earth is one supposed to provide for their families needs without a stable job/money? Being party of society (ie. having friends) is also important unless he plans on living a very isolated life. His attitude towards Canada/English should also concern you b/c that's not a good view to have given that your children will be born/raised in Canada (UNLESS he plans on surprising you with a demand to move back to Pakistan down the road). You really need to look deep within yourself and figure out if you really want to spend the rest of your life with a man like this. And is this the type of person who you want guiding your children.

P.S. Don't get your mother/sister or anyone else make you feel guilty about rishta decisions. After marriage, its YOU who will be living with his man....not your mother/sister or anyone else. Its easy to say things when the consequences will effect someone else on a daily basis. So stay focused on what YOU are willing to comprise/put up with.

P.S. 2: My point with my husband wasn't that his English is horrible. It's not. My point was that he doesn't pay any attention to being proper when texting/chatting etc. But when it comes to speaking English and/or drafting formal documents.....his English is far from poor.

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Re: Am I a horrible person for inquiring about the guy's English speaking skills?

Yeah talk to saeedinpakistan. He no longer in pak, he hang in hoooston know.