Ali a.s or mavia

Society Religion & Philosophy
61

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

Simple is 2 + 2 = we all get 4 ... when almost 70 different nations ( sects in islam) have different answers for same question then to me its complicated :)

However i do understand the part where people have made islam complicated for themselves ... and its simple after all :)

Wanna Be My Chammak Chalo :blush:
62

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

Brother, your Islam is restricted to few battles and determining which of different people of the past were good and which were bad.

Islam is supposed to be relationship between man and God and man and society.

63

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

^I dunt know y u keep going back to not disccusing few wars that happened ... But if we did learn from the history .... thats sharred by all sects we might come to a conclusion y we have alot of differences following same book ....

Another thing Islam is not only religon thats supposed to be a realtion ship between us and God .. and society thats the goal of every religon.

When following same book we get to different conclusions ... that means either book isnt good enough or one of us is wrong.

I dunno whoz the writter .. last time someone recommnded me the book .. it was a shia book ended up saying Rasool s.a.w had 4 daughters.

UK/London Guppy Meet 2012
64

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

Prophet[pbuh] did have 4 daughters …
this is the book …remember its just an intro

65

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

May be bcoz we are not following the book after all. Or may be some think that book is not in proper order or its explanation is being kept in secret.
I have gone thru war discussions before, but, whats the point. Show me where in Quran does i say that we need to have an opinion on wars, rather, it says, you will not be asked about what others did.

why
66

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

bro aqeel, i wan to thank you for bringing up your argument, over and over again, that when two fight one has to be wrong. alhamdulillah, while i was trying to find an answer for you i came up with an example which i'll use to debunk Islamic haters' arguments. anyhow

Your argument does not work in all the cases and hence it falls under the rhetorical logical fallacies: hasty conclusion & stereotyping.
Here is an example for you to understand this better

Person A: That glass of water is half empty
Person B: That glass of water is half full

Are they both wrong? The answer is no because the glass is half full and half empty and if either one says one, they both are correct and neither their statements contradict each other.

I hope you get what i'm trying to say here

67

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

lol …:smack: both of them are saying same thing. its a differnt way of giving same answer! … my fathers youngest kid’s name is XYZ … my youngest brothers name is XYZ…
If my younger bro and my young cousin are arguing abt it .. i wud be able to stop them and tell them … Guys u r sayin the same thing ! and u r tellin me the guy with the most knowledge after Rasool s.a.w didnt know other person was saying same thing in a different way ! thats where sunni shia aqeeda changes … You Forget greatness of Ali
And if the people we r following were dumb enough to have 72 wars for something thats not even worth discussing … then in the case where both are rite and both are wrong none shld be followed
and if one is rite other is wrong ,then u guys can decide

why do we discuss family matters here
68

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

first Understand the meaning of what he want to say ..

the happy people thread
69

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

For first sentence Actual Islam after Prophet Mohammad was restricted with some Ayats which comes from All mighty on the day of Eid-e-Ghadeer Including Soor-e-Munafikoon if u agree there is no restriction in islam if not agree Islam after prophet restricted with that ayat.

But those who want to use " Razi Allah Talah Anhu " with yazid and Mauwiya have no restriction.

Your second sentence is Very good and Very very nice " Rasool Allah himself told Believers are those :-

  1. Who take care of his brother like whatever he want for himself he purchase same for his brother.

  2. Who take care of his neighbour like his family.

  3. The Bussinessman who is true , very kind and very loving.

  4. The one who raise his voice in front of Opressors.

We love Sahabas ( those who are good with Prophet , and the Society and those who gave Sadqa in the action of Ruku .. we even love that horse so much that we moan for that horse .. that Horse was Animal and so much trustfull that after prophet too he not left the family and presents his Johar in the battle of Karabala ( Shah ast Hussain Badshah Ast Hussain , Deen Ast Hussain Deen-e-Panah Ast Hussain ) - ( Rasool Allah himself told :- Hussain-o-minni Wa Ana Minal Hussain ) , but first know the meaning of Sahaba as per Quran :-

Soor-e-Yusuf :- " Oh mere Qaid khane ke sahabion " - this is told by Hazrat Yusuf A.S and Again told by Allah in Quran when Allah told this story to prophet Mohammad. ( Quran 12-41 )

So Quran is telling :- the Prisoner with Hazrat yusuf in the prison are there Sahabees those prisoners are both Kafirs. So how can we accept all Sahabis of Prophet Mohammad ( bcoz So many are Yahoodis, Isai , Kafir, Munafik, Mushrik )
if u know Quran i am sure u know that Story but you never take care that Yusuf A.S told those Kafir there Sahabees

BUT LOVE OTHERS BCOZ LOVE IS OUR TEACHING - BUT HATE TO BE WITH OPRESSORS

Fear of your own death
Fear of your own death
70

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

If u are restricted with Quran can u plz find where i can get these things in Quran :-
1. Qalma
2. Azan
3. Wudhu ( Wazoo )
4. Namaaz ( What to Pray )

71

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

^O Bhaijaan

I never said that Quran should be taken in isolation, it cannot be separated from Prophet saw's life.

But pray tell me, today, i mean today, what is the relvance of battle of Jamal or Siffin? I do not think that God created us to ask us on judgment day of our opinions on battles.

What is the importance of these wars in following the religion today, in 2008. And if the only answer you can come up with is that its importance lies from whom you take your religion from that is from Hz Ali or Hz Abu Bakr or Omer ra, then tell me how is your Islam better than sunni islam. What things you practice make you better humans than sunnis.

72

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

O Bhaijaan, just pick Ali above Mavia. Do the simple and the right thing. This one step can go a long way towards unity.

If Shak09 wrote a blog entry,
If Shak09 wrote a blog entry,
73

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

nobody needs to have a phd to figure out that this ummayad family had problem with islam since begining ...
abu sufyaan vs Prophet s.a.w >>>>> now he accepeted islam but cant u see he didnt have much choice!
Maviyah vs Ali a.s >>>>> 72 wars yet both were ritee
Yazeed vs Hussain a.s >>>> after what happened in karbala ... watever yazid did ... somone was telling me in this forum that everything is fair in war, so may ALLAH be pleased with both <<<<<< is that Islam ? giving me sources over Quran like every thing is fair in war "shakespear"
now am quoting the words of Aamir Liyaqat hussain
" Siffin isnt over yet, Imam Ali a.s fought it against Maviyah and today we r fighting against maviyah's followers"

74

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

Bhaijaan

This is not enough for the poster. Its just s prelude to further questions. As for picking one over the other, ofcourse i'll pick Hz Ali ra, for it has been unanimous among the sunnis that he was the rightly guided Caliph and hence was on Haq in this war.

75

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

bro thats all i wanned to know :slight_smile:
thanks

well bro i follow the scholars who beleive Bibi Zehra s.a is the reason of creation of Imam Ali a.s … and their history is little different :slight_smile:

76

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

Aqeel by any chance do you belong to the following: Shia Imamia Ithna Ashari Akhbari?

Check the link: Welcome to Akhbari.com

77

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

i think <<<>>>> ithna ashri ... but to be honest my abbu and chacha have different belevies , i think there are alot of sects among shia's now !
i know i am not zaidi or Ismaili and to be honest i didnt even know abt akbari shia's
lets check ur link out

I like the site .... believes are good but I have alot of respect for Mujtahedeens and it sounds like akhbari shia's are mad at em !
well i didnt know abt this sect ... but congradulations to all muslims we have got another sect :) and if u count usoooli its 2 new sects :D

does anybody know how many sects do we have already in islam ?

78

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

i have heard that too ....
they have the notion that since Ali [as] was the ONLY son-in-law of Prophet [saw] he was the legitimate successor ,these people elevate Fatima to a level greater than Ali and almost to the level of the prophet...some also say she was given a book by Angel gabreial as well....thats the reason partly why some shia scholars have failed to mention the other daughters of the Prophet.
why is this such an issue ? didnt the Prophet say that even if Fatima commits theft i will strike off her hand ?
who is greater the principles of islam or personalities ?

personally i think being married to Fatima[as] was one of the many merits of Ali but that was WAY down the list .....and certainly not a factor why I personally think he was the successor to the Prophet ...this might be a merit for someone who had little else to his credit ....but i dont care if Ali married one daughter or all 4 ...the man had FAR better reasons to be made a caliph than this .....

79

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

It would be based on my feelings and attachment to a specific person at the time. If Hazrat Uthman (RA) was one of the Sahabah I looked up to very much I would've been filled with rage and would go all out to avenge his death.

80

Re: Ali a.s or mavia

^ even to the point of violating islamic injunctions ?