Al-Wahab

[lethal_kamikaze]

Re: Al-Wahab

@vroom

These are all wahabis. Is it supposed to be a impressive list? Or just a list?

Do not try to imply that Ahlus Sunnah are disrespecting the name of Allaah Subhanahu waTa’ala when we refer to wahabis as wahabis. That would be an incorrect allegation, but possibly a popular one within wahabi circles and wahabi influenced circles

Peace vroom,

You are the only person here who is all alone talking about “Ahlus Sunnah”, “wahabis”, “khawariji” etc., yet accusing me that I’m trying to imply disrespect? Applause for you man

btw I just wanted to share some hadith here.

**Book “Afflictions and the end of the world”, Sahih Bukhari, Hadith No. 197. **

Narrated 'Abdullah: The Prophet , said, “Abusing a Muslim is Fusuq (evil doing) and killing him is Kufr (disbelief).”

Book ‘Good Manners and Form (Al-Adab)’ of Sahih Bukhari, Hadith No. 71 and 72.

Narrated Abu Dhar: That he heard the Prophet saying, “If somebody accuses another of Fusuq (by calling him ‘Fasiq’ i.e. a wicked person) or accuses him of Kufr, such an accusation will revert to him (i.e. the accuser) if his companion (the accused) is innocent.”

**Narrated Anas: Allah’s Apostle was neither a Fahish (one who had a bad tongue) nor a Sabbaba (one who abuses others) and he used to say while admonishing somebody, “What is wrong with him? May dust be on his forehead!”
**

[vroom]

Re: Al-Wahab

@psyah

I agree that to say “Wahabi” is not necessarily an insult … It is, if it is intended to be an insult … Not all people who disagree with a certain position are followers of ibn abdul Wahab … Some of the most ridiculous accusations are that Deobandis are Wahabis, some plain moderate Muslims who just knock around through life are also called Wahabis if they happen to disagree with some people’s stance. I’ve heard people call Shafi’s and Malikis Wahabi too.

The usage of the word wahabi is used to signify a deviant stroke anti muslim movement, also the term is applied to deviants who have sufficiently changed their religious positions to move closer to the religion of wahabism on any aspect. so it signifies where the position has come from rather then all out belonging to the group. So disagreeing with a stance can rightfully gain a person a wahabi tag. that is both fair and right

The deobandis can be called wahabis, because many of them are bigger wahabis then wahabis. Talib Ur Rehman the wahabi munazir is less Wahabi then deobandis because he admitted the kufr statement of his imam (the first indian wahabi) but deobandis have defended that statement since before their time till now. Deoband is built upon tolerance of diverse opinions such as fatwas of kufr which are not applied to their own. last few days of sunniforum general chat (before they closed it down!) was an eye opener for this type of revelations! I have heard of some shafis, i know one, who are wahabis. The phenomenon exists like deobandi wahabis. Even if the world fills with wahabis, they will still be wahabis and not Sunnis

Some members of Ahl-al-Hadith call themselves Wahabis … I also feel saying Deobandis or Barelvis is not insulting … But some Deobandis want to be called Sunnis or just Muslims and many Barelvis think they are Ahl-us-Sunnah and don’t realise that they are really a small part of it.

Deobandis can be called as they did name themselves ‘Ahlus Sunnah Deoband’
The Sunnis (aka Barelvi) are ‘Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaat’ and from my study this is a True name, and they follow the mujaddids of previous centuries

The fashion of the newer groups calling themselves Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaat in other countries has not caught on in pakistan yet. At least not where I live, I was called Sunni by a person denying to be a sunni who was a wahabi. makes sense as well since the hadiths on the name ASWJ are weak, and acceptance of weak hadiths upon approval by scholars is a hallmark of Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaah

Barelvi is a name which is being used in different contexts. In one context it is all the Islam which has existed ever. In another it is the Islam of Ahlus Sunnah from the west to the east. In another it is the Sunnis of India, Bangladesh and Pakistan. But then we can say it is people who take Imam Ahmad Raza Khan as a Mujaddid. This is the most constricted and hard to obtain position of being a Barelvi. However this is where the sunni Islam you have travelled the world to find is:

Mujaddid! Such a high rank, I think He The Imam deserves to be called Barelvi more then me

IF YOU LOVE IMAM RIDA KHAN** YOU ARE FROM AHLUS SUNNAH WAL JAMAAH
**by criticizing him we know who the other party are! wahabis!

So no it is not a small part of the Ummah but the pinnacle of the Ummah. Remind me the name of your Sheikh again, what is the Name of your Sheikh? and where is he from(country)? Where is his Father from (country)?

There is a reality between certain aspects of Salafis and Khawarij but they are not the same either … Salafism is a new movement that had it’s origin in the people from Ahl-al-Hadith from Saudi but has deviated even from the “Wahabi” setting, the Salafis of today follow Al-Uthaimeen, and Al-Albani … Both of whom have been influential and alive within the past 70 years or so.

Many Salafis are politically wound as are the Ikhwaan … And Ikhwaan have many sub-groups … Here’s is what Yasir Qadhi says about a few things … He has adjusted his position although many people would still consider him a Wahabi.

Yasir qadhi is a wahabi but he is also worse, I have him down as a Nasibi. I watched one of his lectures and it was disgusting

I have argued with nawasib and they all use deobandi literature, often written using false names

[KKF]

Re: Al-Wahab

OMG...you guys have too much time on your hand. what do you wanna achieve by indulging in unending debates? at the end of the day, all of you gonna be what you are...nothing will change!...

...koii bhii kisii ko qaa'il ma'qool nahiiN kar saktaa to phir is jiraH, is baHs kaa faai'da? ba_juz waqt ke ziyaaN ke aur kuchh nahiiN. kasheedgii, dil_Kharaashii, dil_shikanii oopar se haath lagtii hai.

yeh ek sa'ii-e-laa_Haasil hai.

aage aap logoN kii marzii.

[teggy]

Re: Al-Wahab

It's surprising to see that any muslim who fears a day when he/she will be held to account for his/her actions, even words, would feel so confident that only he/she has it right, and the rest are all on kufr. Just wow. Allahu Akbar. May Allah guide us all, and save us all from intolerance. I shudder at the thought that If I should wrong anyone even with my words, that it may come to haunt me on the day of Reckoning when each deed will become more dear than the whole world and all that is in it.

Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w.) has warned us about bankruptcy of hasanat on the Day of Judgement. (Coming loaded with good deeds, but having to give them out to people we wronged, to the point we start taking their sayyiaat to repay for our actions/words/etc.).

[psyah]

Re: Al-Wahab

@vroom

The usage of the word wahabi is used to signify a deviant stroke anti muslim movement, also the term is applied to deviants who have sufficiently changed their religious positions to move closer to the religion of wahabism on any aspect. so it signifies where the position has come from rather then all out belonging to the group. So disagreeing with a stance can rightfully gain a person a wahabi tag. that is both fair and right

The deobandis can be called wahabis, because many of them are bigger wahabis then wahabis. Talib Ur Rehman the wahabi munazir is less Wahabi then deobandis because he admitted the kufr statement of his imam (the first indian wahabi) but deobandis have defended that statement since before their time till now. Deoband is built upon tolerance of diverse opinions such as fatwas of kufr which are not applied to their own. last few days of sunniforum general chat (before they closed it down!) was an eye opener for this type of revelations! I have heard of some shafis, i know one, who are wahabis. The phenomenon exists like deobandi wahabis. Even if the world fills with wahabis, they will still be wahabis and not Sunnis

Deobandis can be called as they did name themselves ‘Ahlus Sunnah Deoband’
The Sunnis (aka Barelvi) are ‘Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaat’ and from my study this is a True name, and they follow the mujaddids of previous centuries

The fashion of the newer groups calling themselves Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaat in other countries has not caught on in pakistan yet. At least not where I live, I was called Sunni by a person denying to be a sunni who was a wahabi. makes sense as well since the hadiths on the name ASWJ are weak, and acceptance of weak hadiths upon approval by scholars is a hallmark of Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaah

Barelvi is a name which is being used in different contexts. In one context it is all the Islam which has existed ever. In another it is the Islam of Ahlus Sunnah from the west to the east. In another it is the Sunnis of India, Bangladesh and Pakistan. But then we can say it is people who take Imam Ahmad Raza Khan as a Mujaddid. This is the most constricted and hard to obtain position of being a Barelvi. However this is where the sunni Islam you have travelled the world to find is:

Mujaddid! Such a high rank, I think He The Imam deserves to be called Barelvi more then me

IF YOU LOVE IMAM RIDA KHAN** YOU ARE FROM AHLUS SUNNAH WAL JAMAAH
**by criticizing him we know who the other party are! wahabis!

So no it is not a small part of the Ummah but the pinnacle of the Ummah. Remind me the name of your Sheikh again, what is the Name of your Sheikh? and where is he from(country)? Where is his Father from (country)?

Yasir qadhi is a wahabi but he is also worse, I have him down as a Nasibi. I watched one of his lectures and it was disgusting

I have argued with nawasib and they all use deobandi literature, often written using false names

Peace bro vroom

Firstly that video you posted is of Shaykh Muhammad Al-Yaqoubi - he is my Shaykh I have taken bayah with him on his hands. He is a Maliki and has authority to teach in both Maliki and Hanafi fiqh, but he is a Master in the Shadhili Tariqah, I feel I understand his position better than you.

Now when you said that “Wahabi is used to identify a deviant stroke anti muslim movement” - this is now truly disrespecting of the Name of Allah (SWT) Al-Wahab … It is now that your whole claim crumbles that it is used from the name Ibn AbdulWahab … If that was so then Deobandis do not count - your real intent and use of the term - is as a slur - an insult … and for that reason the name “Wahabi” should not be used.

Do not use good names for bad intents or else you will start to think those good names are bad to have … How many Barelviyya have you seen keep the name Abd’ul-Wahab? It is because you have turned it into a curse for no good reason.

Please be careful with Yasir Qadhi’s videos some are old and he has since changed his position.

Coming back to my Shaykh - note again he says the followers of Imam Ahmad Raza Khan (RA) are FROM Ahl-us-Sunnah-wal-Jamaa’ - that does not mean my Shaykh is Barelvi (because his learnings are not from their tutelage chain) nor does it mean only the Barelvis are from the Ahl-us-Sunnah as you will hear from the same video.

Furthermore, my Shaykh will condemn any such talk that you have mentioned about killing Wahabis and for the awam to be involved in takfir of others. There are many members of Barelviyya who do not condemn as you do … there is no reason for this rampage you have adopted. It’s better to be a nice person. Furthermore I accept the superiority of Imam Rida Khan (RA) in their time … that does not make me Barelvi either, but I have no qualms if you wish to call me Barelvi - for you will only do so as a way to show your support for me if you do … So I try to understand the “name” giving from the intent it is used. The rest is immaterial.

Your last post has justified the OP in his concerns … If you stuck to the initial argument about Ibn AbdulWahab’s followers then that would have been better - now it is clear you use that term “Wahabi” as an insult and no name of Allah (SWT) should be used as an insult.

(This is my 10k post )

[Ibn_Sadique]

Re: Al-Wahab

Respected brother psyah Assalama Alaykum wa rehmatullahe – Let me be the first to congratulate you on reaching the a great milestone.

I have indeed (along with many others) learned a lot from your informative, well thought out, very balanced posts. May Allah Almighty give you more knowledge which you can then share with us all over here.

Looking forward to next 20,000 even sooner!!!

[psyah]

Re: Al-Wahab

^Wa'alaykumuSalam wa rahmatullahi wabarakatuhu dear respected brother Ibn Sadique ... sometimes I wonder what I am doing here. I hope that this is not just an escapism for me and my intentions remain and become more sincere - I often wonder that I can do more in other ways ... There is only so much words can do ... actions are of course better.

I pray that Allah (SWT) gives us all tawfiq to be activists for the sake of Islam raising its name amidst the ever so increasing voices trying to bring it down.