Advise to a an engaged friend

Lifestyle Relationships
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I have a friend who recently got engaged. The wedding, they are planning to have sometime next year, but don’t have a date yet.

The problem is, well, to her it’s not, but to me it is. Having been married previously, and recently again, I know what to expect and how things can change etc once married.

But this girl, absolutely refuses to see that. She is so stubborn, and constantly brings up how “I will not change for anyone, I don’t care what anyone thinks, including my in laws say” etc etc.. Now, (to me anyway), it’s nothing major, but she refers to change as something like, not wearing a sleeveless shirt in front of her inlaws who are very conservative. Her fiance doesnt mind, but in front of the family he requests her not to, but she doesn’t care.

And even wearing shorts at home with her mother in law around, her fiance doesnt want that, because the mom would obviously get upset, but my friend’s like, I will have a talk with my fiance because I can’t change my ways for her.

Another example, because her unmarried future sis in law ignored her a few times (they never fought or anyhting of the sort, so I don’t know where this is stemming form), my friend refuses to visit her inlaws house because she lives there, and even refuses to include her in the upcoming wedding and any festivities/gatherings she has in general !!! I asked her to go up to her and talk to her, try to clear up the air, because you ARE family and it’s not like she insulted you or fought, but I get the “I’m not changing for anybody speech” again.

And while I get, to a certain extent, why she’s mad at being ignored like that, she doesn’t understand that living life like that, and you aren’t even married, is going to be very tough down the road.

These are just examples, there are many more.

I tried explaining to her that change is inevitable, and just because you might have to change a few things like the above, doesn’t mean they are making you do a 180 !!!

Should I just stop with my advise and hold my breath, seems like I am going no where in trying to make her see its not that big a deal in the first place. And to hold HER breath instead, cuz once married, your entire life changes in a minute !!!

And my friend, she’s not some 18-yr old little naive girl either, and has been divorced previously, so it’s not like she’s new to being married.

Are people this oblivious and stubborn to ?

Should I just shut up and keep my thoughts to myself?

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

she's right about not changing her life choice for anyone.Her fiance knows this and if he has a problem then he should break up with her right now.Why should she fake who she is in front of future in laws?it will only cause a resentment in her heart.They should either accept her how she is or move on.
The second thing about the sister in law not being invited, well this is something she can change her stance on and honestly, its all coming from the first point above.She's annoyed at her fiance trying to tell her to act differently around his family members so now she doesn't want them around in her events.
If the couple wants to be with each other,they better make separate living arrangements for themselves because living in a joint family system will be a disaster in this situation.
So my advice to u if you are her friend, is that you can just tell her to discuss with her fiance to live separately and not pressure her to change her ways.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

If her fiancé doesn't want a wife who will wear sleeveless in front of his family or someone who's not going to wear shorts at home with his mother around....then it's his responsibility to find a woman who is willing to follow those rules. If your friend had made it clear to him that she's not willing to do those things and the guy is choosing to move forward with the wedding regardless, then your friend is not the one with the problem here.

I'm not sure why you think you're more of an expert on marriage than your friend. You know what to expect and how things change because you've been married before and divorced. By your own admission, your friend has the same experience! She is an adult who has experienced marriage before and obviously understands the pros/cons of a divorce. She's not a naive little girl who needs you to give her advice she did not ask for. So yes, you need to keep your thoughts to yourself UNLESS she is directly asking you to share your opinion about her relationship/marriage.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

Agree with the poster here who said your friend is not the one with problem but her fiance. Also, instead of using the word change, maybe you want to use the word respect. Dressing a little conservatively around elders out of RESPECT. She doesn't have to change if her fiance is okay with it and you should let her be.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

I don't get the vibe that the OP believes herself to be an expert. Now being single myself, perhaps my advice would carry the least amount of weight or value...but I can totally see where OP is coming from.

If her friend refuses to make any compromise at all ....if it kills her....then she shouldn't get married period. She shouldn't marry conservative guy or moderate bloke or even liberal dude. For those who will argue that it's sooooo the guy's fault and that he should marry someone more conservative like himself.....the same can be said for the girl. She should look for a guy who is more liberal like her.

The girl, however, has to keep a couple things in mind. Generally speaking the older Desi generation (parents/granparents/auntis n uncles) tend to be more conservative when it comes to dressing and other things as well. That said, she should just look for a guy who doesn't live with his parents. Now what if her in-laws live separately and came for a visit for a week or two....or a few hours....would she still traipse about the place in her knickers and a tank top all in da name of individuality? If she can't even manage a temporary adjustment, then she's part of the problem and not a thorough bechari.

And if this girl is divorced, then I agree with OP's sentiments in being surprised at her attitude. If you don't like a member from your in-laws.....then keep a distance as opposer to taking measures that would cause more drama. IF your previous divorce resulted partly because you failed to exercise diplomacy or sabar in your last relationship....then it would be surprising to see the same mistakes being repeated.

Op's post is not strictly about a girl who is being stifled....the girl in question has an ego issue...she doesn't have her priorities in the right order. This is evident in her wanting to exclude her fiance's sister from the wedding celebrations. What kind of soch is that? Um...she's the sister of your husband-to-be. She's not some coworker or your next door neighbor or some chick from high-school that you could easily exclude from a wedding. You might hate her guts....but out of regard for your husband's feelings....you suck it up and invite her to the wedding festivities even if you're mostly going to avoid her. That would be the more mature thing to do. What would you gain from hurting your fiance by not inviting her? Would it strengthen your marriage? Would it increase your respect?

If she's gonna live with in-laws, it's gonna be messy. But if she'll be living separately....and if she truly believes that this guy is the one for her....then avoiding shorts and sleeveless tops when his parents visit is not too much to ask for. Resume with shedding your clothes after they leave.

If girl wants to be a thorough individual, then she should stay single and live by herself. You will not have total freedom when you share a roof with another person....be it even your immediate family members....or your bestest friend. When you read about the more serious issues that some women face from in-laws...sleevelees and chaddis kinda sorta pale in comparison.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

OP stated that she knew what to expect and how things change after marriage because she has been divorced and re-married. It's silly for her to make a statement when discussing a friend who has also been married and divorced. It's not like OP is giving advice to a friend who doesn't understand what marriage is like or what it's like to go through a divorce.

OP's question to us is whether she should keep her thoughts to herself because her friend had made it clear that her advice is not welcome. Her friend and the friend's fiancé isn't here seeking advice to offering detailed opinions on their relationship is useless. And since her friend has made it clear to her that her advice/thoughts are not welcome, OP needs to stay out of that woman's relationship/marriage and focus on her own.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

Nah I don't think it's silly or ridiculous. And even if I did think it were silly....silly does not necessarily equate expert to me. If someone goes through a bad experience only to come out of it acting in a way like they're hurtling for another failure.....then it's only natural to feel surprise. Reminds me of how only last week I had chided a student for stealing and warned him of the dire consequences that await him...and today he repeats the same mistake. I felt surprise/shock, concern, annoyance. Yeh to phir bhi aik bacha hai....but here you have an adult woman who has had one failed marriage....and is planning to marry a guy who is not only more conservative than her but seems like he lives with his parebts who are more traditional than he is. AND the girl's own attitude is not one of total maturity. So, if OP is feeling gobsmacked and thinking to herself, "Woman, are you looking to get another divorce? If you're not gonna pick a guy who is more liberal like yourself....then at least try not to fuel the existing tensions with other bull-headedness." Again, I understand OP's bewilderment. As for whether she should keep her thoughts to herself....it can depend on the closeness of the friendship. I just got off the phone with a friend who knows I don't like hearing certain suggestions but we're close enough to where she'll push it out of concern. And OP sounds like a concerned friend to me. However if advice is not being heeded.....then it's better to just leave well alone. As for the expert honay ki baat...ya even the view that it's totally the guy fault...and girl has no adjusting of her own to do....I don't agree with any of those.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

Based on OP's quoted statements below, looks like you and I agree on how she should proceed. :)

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

@redvelvet, where have you been? Welcome back! Things like these should be sorted out prior to the wedding. But a bit of compromise on both sides isn't too bad.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

Just stop giving her advice. Stubborn people rarely, if ever, listen and then stuff blows up in their face. Just let it play out.. It may be fine, it may not. Who knows.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

Paheli - I never said I was an expert, I'm learning myself on a daily basis..

but an outsider sees things differently than the person in the situation.. my concern is just that, my friend doesn't realize that respecting some (not all) of your inlaws wishes, especially when they will be living with you, is not a bad thing, nor does it mean anyone is changing you. I mean come on, if your fiance says wear what you want when its just us, but dont wear shorts/bathing suits in front of my mother, I think thats a reasonable request. But then again, maybe thats only reasonable to me.

At the end of the day, its her relationship, not mine. I was just trying to open her mind up a little. Because these kinds of things can blow up in your face big time later down the road.

We are close enough for me to tell her my opinions, but I'm not going to pin her down and make her listen lol. It's her life, her relationship

But I guess i will just stop advising her unless she asks for it.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

@redvelvet … my thoughts EXACTLY !!! see, this is why I am concerned about all the things I, and you, have mentioned.

But I guess, the verdict is to stay out.. which I will.. I might have let my emotions get the best of me, but I just like being honest and straight up with people.. So with my friend, I sugar coat it a little, but I tell her the truth. Maybe I’m wrong, who knows.. but at least I have a clean heart towards what I said.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

That's the problem though... if she's living with her in-laws they're ALWAYS going to be there, she'll always be bending to their rules. She will have to change her whole lifestyle, which IMO is not fair to her because she's accustomed to living a certain way outside of them. I refused to live with my in laws and my husband respected that because I need my own space to do and wear as I please. But if she's not given that option, I have to agree with her.

I generally don't think it's fair that women in our culture basically have to give up their identity after they get married because of in-laws. It can really take a toll on your mental state to not be who you are and do what you love to do. I wear shorts, dresses, skirts, I love makeup and going out and sometimes having a glass of wine with dinner - this was me before I got married, why should I have to change after marriage to appease other people? It's really not fair. BUT I also made this 100% clear to my husband before that living with my in-laws was not an option and he agreed with me and I'm always respectful around them.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

^^^ yeah, I see your point

I hope they can figure it out on their own and hopefully sail smooth somehow.. cuz shes not about to back down, and Im not sure if the fiance will either

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

They need to compromise. If the compromise is live with in-laws and continue living like she's used to, then he has to respect that. It's a huge compromise to live with in-laws, something men will never understand because it's THEIR parents in most cases.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

yes, that irritates me sooo much, that men always expect women to live with their parents and sis/bros/kids as if its no big deal. when in reality, its the biggest compromise a woman can make, ever.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

That's why you gotta respect your friend for standing her ground.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

^ This. This woman is being told what to wear while she's in the privacy of her home. I wear shorts/sleeveless at home all the time. I can't imagine having to cover-up at home every time I walk outside my bedroom. It's asking someone to completely change the way they dress/act.....even when they're inside the home.

Especially given the fact that this woman is divorced and this is her 2nd marriage, we need to stop acting like she doesn't know anything about being married. Who knows....maybe she did change to "respect" everyone during her first marriage and now regrets doing it. Maybe she did do everything a good desi wife should do during her first marriage and now, she wants to be herself and not back down when compromising on something that matters to her. Point is that we don't know what happened behind closed doors in her 1st marriage. But this is not a naive 20-year who needs to constantly receive advice on how to deal with her fiance/future in-laws....especially when she's not asking for advice. It's fine for a close friend to share opinions once or twice....but after that, it needs to stop.

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

^^she cussed out her ex father in law because he told her to be a little conservative - back home. and then left her husband cuz she couldn't stand being told what to do. her words.

I think I should have given that piece of information beforehand, as a part of my reasoning why I was trying to reason with her.

So, yeah..

But I agree -- no more advice from my side :) where it's not wanted

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Re: Advise to a an engaged friend

LOL.....that's even more of a clue to you that you need to stop giving her advice lol. She's clearly is not willing to compromise and doesn't care if it leads to a divorce. Save your advice/energy for someone who is receptive to it. :)