Would like to hear opinions about adopting a 3-4 year old from an edhi home in Pakistan. Anyone done it?
Would any of you consider going for it? (Yes, the couple already has 3 kids, they’re thinking of adopting a little boy as a naiki)
Would like to know whats the emotional impact on biological kids and other immediate family members.
Re: Adopting a child - impact?
Nothing like the kid saying you're not my two parents, other than that it's pretty cool. If they treat their kids and the new kid equally then there won't be a problem and relatives are gonna relative.
Source: experience.
Re: Adopting a child - impact?
imo, the couple should consider the following:
-if they are Muslims *, they MUST know that adoption, as we know it, is NOT allowed in Islam...however, you are allowed to pay towards the child's sustenance.
-if they have young kids, better wait till they are a bit older
-if their kids are older, talk to them and get their sorta approval before adopting
-talk to the biological parents of 'to-be-adopted child and ask the reasons for their putting the child up for adoption
-the adoptive parents should make a WILL explaining who gets what after their deaths [according to Islam, the adopted child is NOT entitled to any inheritance].
that's all i can think of right now. may add later.*
Re: Adopting a child - impact?
They need to do extensive research about adoption and how it impacts adopted as well as biological children. Tell them to read about attachment and please not to ever say to anyone they are adopting for naiki. Thinking of the child as charity will have very negative impact on the child.
Re: Adopting a child - impact?
I think its a great thing, unfortunately not very many people actually adopt in our culture which is why its soo facinating when someone does! Also, for this reason, adoption also opens up the door for a lot of opinions and criticisms from others.
I think the parents should seriously ignore anyones backwards comments and go for it. Also, it might be a good idea for them to familiarise themselves with the 'laws/rules' of adoption in Islam (assuming theyre muslims) since the procedure is kind of different from how muslims adopt and how other people go through with it. But yeah mA they should go for it!
Wish them all the best :)
Adopting a child - impact?
My cousin has an adapted daughter from Pakistan close to my age and we don't even notice it. She's just as much of a member in our family like anyone else.
Adopting a child - impact?
I have always heard of this but never understood why. what is the reason that Islam gives for not adapting?
Re: Adopting a child - impact?
I have always heard of this but never understood why. what is the reason that Islam gives for not adapting?
it's about protecting the inheritance of the adoptive parents' children and also to protect the adopted child's identity.
Prophet [saws] had an adopted son, Hazra Zaid (ra) [before it was forbidden]...Huzoor [saws], upon Zaid's divorcing his wife, he married his divorcee in order to leave a tradition to prove that adoption is NOT allowed in Islam and that adopted children are NOT your children. that's why one must not hide the adopted child's identity and not change his/her last name. [in case someone adopts in spite of the ruling].
Oh good god... Adoption is allowed is Islam but there are a few guidelines. Key one is inheritance and the other is not hiding that the child is not biological offspring. There is no Islamic ruling against raising a child who is not your offspring in your home. Also, the inheritance is not just to protect the interests of those with an inherited e stake, but also so they don't oppose adoption as they protect their financial interests, and importantly the assets of the orphan too. Idea being you can't adopt the kids of some rich relative of friend or neighbour who died at war..and then since you have adopted the kid you have ownership of all the assets that are the right of that child.
Not sure what kind of god would pass a religious decree that you can't bring an abandoned infant home and raise her, but pay some orphanage instead for her to be raised in an institutional setting.
Does the rule change when it's a blood relatives kid? Sorry kiddo, I know I am your chacha and live in a mansion, but why don't you go stay at edhi center and we will send them some money each month.
When the essence of the message is lost and people do intellectual gymnastics on semantics, it gets rather amusing to watch. The ruling wrt Zayd was to provide specific guidelines and not of prohibition. The messaging was very focused on the topic of mehram issues which are bloodline related and would thus not be same as for someone who is not biologically if the family and bloodline.
Re: Adopting a child - impact?
...the other is not hiding that the child is not biological offspring.
Wow, I did not know that. What is the age limit of the kid before which parents are obligated to tell him or her?
[Wow, I did not know that. What is the age limit of the kid before which parents are obligated to tell him or her?
It's the point of hiding from the world, you can not pass an adopted child as your biological child. One key way to address that in those days was the naming. The child does not have your last name so it's known that the child is not a biological child. I don't know of any sort of religiously mandated dates or ages to tell the child, but input from a psychological pov, experts suggest that you introduce the concept soon. Like 4-5 year of age, so it's not something hidden or seen as something that has to be hidden.
Re: Adopting a child - impact?
Makes sense.
Re: Adopting a child - impact?
Oh good god... Adoption is allowed is Islam but there are a few guidelines. Key one is inheritance and the other is not hiding that the child is not biological offspring. There is no Islamic ruling against raising a child who is not your offspring in your home. Also, the inheritance is not just to protect the interests of those with an inherited e stake, but also so they don't oppose adoption as they protect their financial interests, and importantly the assets of the orphan too. Idea being you can't adopt the kids of some rich relative of friend or neighbour who died at war..and then since you have adopted the kid you have ownership of all the assets that are the right of that child.
Not sure what kind of god would pass a religious decree that you can't bring an abandoned infant home and raise her, but pay some orphanage instead for her to be raised in an institutional setting.
Does the rule change when it's a blood relatives kid? Sorry kiddo, I know I am your chacha and live in a mansion, but why don't you go stay at edhi center and we will send them some money each month.
When the essence of the message is lost and people do intellectual gymnastics on semantics, it gets rather amusing to watch. The ruling wrt azide was to provide specific guidelines and not of prohibition. The messaging was very focused on the topic of mehram issues which are bloodline related and would thus not be same as for someone who is not biologically if the family and bloodline.
This.
Re: Adopting a child - impact?
I know a few couples that have adopted newborns...I've noticed people prefer newborn versus an older child.
My friend's cousin just came back with her second adopted baby. She is happyyy...I swear you cannot even tell these kids are not her blood...they look like they found each other...meant to be or something.
Her family has accepted, welcomed and received both kids with open arms, they're not treated any differently. If you didn't know her story, you'd never guess these kids are adopted.
And yes, when the time is right...I will definitely go for it Inshallah. Whether I have biological kids or not, I want to adopt.
Re: Adopting a child - impact?
Oh good god... Adoption is allowed is Islam but there are a few guidelines. Key one is inheritance and the other is not hiding that the child is not biological offspring. There is no Islamic ruling against raising a child who is not your offspring in your home. Also, the inheritance is not just to protect the interests of those with an inherited e stake, but also so they don't oppose adoption as they protect their financial interests, and importantly the assets of the orphan too. Idea being you can't adopt the kids of some rich relative of friend or neighbour who died at war..and then since you have adopted the kid you have ownership of all the assets that are the right of that child.
Not sure what kind of god would pass a religious decree that you can't bring an abandoned infant home and raise her, but pay some orphanage instead for her to be raised in an institutional setting.
Does the rule change when it's a blood relatives kid? Sorry kiddo, I know I am your chacha and live in a mansion, but why don't you go stay at edhi center and we will send them some money each month.
When the essence of the message is lost and people do intellectual gymnastics on semantics, it gets rather amusing to watch. The ruling wrt Zayd was to provide specific guidelines and not of prohibition. The messaging was very focused on the topic of mehram issues which are bloodline related and would thus not be same as for someone who is not biologically if the family and bloodline.
If a couple adopt a boy he is na mehram to wife and if it is a girl she is na mehram to husband.
i have seen few examples in my family where kid is made mehram through razaiyet.
for example a couple in our extended family adopted a boy so wife's sister breast fed the baby so now wife is mehram to the boy as she is her razaiy khala.
this baby is the most loved baby in their family.
3 quick points
1- first and foremost good example set and shared.
2- while I understand the flexibility and comfort provided with a razaiy mehram relationship. It’s not always possible. What if the adopted kid is older? So intentions are important.
3- The mehram point is important to some people and they observe it in their family and social life. I understand and respect that. But families where there is free mixing of cousins and cousins friends etc etc..dudes and chicas dancing in mehndis etc in front of assorted guests, and then the mehram point is presented as an issue, I just chuckle.
Anyways, moving beyond the haram patrol rulings and back to the original set of questions.
1- impact on children. It's hard to say, and would vary by family. Sibling rivalry is very strong in some families and even without that, attention going to a new child often makes kids act out. Add to it the adoption factor and how well they will accept and understand it.
2- extended family and their emotional impact. - my pov, who cares...log kiya kahain Gaye, kya socchain Gaye, type of worries should be cast aside. If that is truly what this couple wants to do, what assorted ppl may feel should be inconsequential.
Re: Adopting a child - impact?
Adopting a child is allowed in Islam as long as the general community knows that it is not ur biological child. U don't have to go around shouting it in the streets but as long as u tell ppl word always gets around. As far as the last name is concerned, u can keep the baby's name the same as before but I read up on this at some point (I don't remember why) and u are also allowed to give them ur last name for paperwork purposes. Because i think its quite a hassle for paperwork throughout ur life (and when ur initially bringing the baby over to whatever country u stay in) so to make that easy its allowed to give them ur last name (as long as u r not doing it specifially for the purpose to pass him off as ur own). That means that as long as ur general community and relatives are aware that the child is not biologically urs ur good to go.
Shariah inheritance laws do not apply to adopted children so u would have to specify in ur will what u would like to leave to that child. Best case scenario is to somehow have the baby breast fed by a close relative (whatever renders the baby mehram to both u and ur husband). However it is not necessary that they will also be a mehram to ur biological kids. In fact I wonder how u might do it so that baby is mehram to all? The grandmother breast feeding the baby? I'm a little hazy on all the specifications for being mehram. I think all maternal paternal aunts and uncles and their spouses right? Anyway this specification is always difficult to fulfil all the way around because even if ur sister breastfed the baby, the parents would now be mehram, but their biological children would tehnically be first cousins to the baby and therefore namehram. Yup that's a doozy.
Re: Adopting a child - impact?
Adopting a child is allowed in Islam as long as the general community knows that it is not ur biological child. U don't have to go around shouting it in the streets but as long as u tell ppl word always gets around. As far as the last name is concerned, u can keep the baby's name the same as before but I read up on this at some point (I don't remember why) and u are also allowed to give them ur last name for paperwork purposes. Because i think its quite a hassle for paperwork throughout ur life (and when ur initially bringing the baby over to whatever country u stay in) so to make that easy its allowed to give them ur last name (as long as u r not doing it specifially for the purpose to pass him off as ur own). That means that as long as ur general community and relatives are aware that the child is not biologically urs ur good to go.
The general rule of thumb is to have someone who is a Shariah inheritance laws do not apply to adopted children so u would have to specify in ur will what u would like to leave to that child. Best case scenario is to somehow have the baby breast fed by a close relative (whatever renders the baby mehram to both u and ur husband). However it is not necessary that they will also be a mehram to ur biological kids. In fact I wonder how u might do it so that baby is mehram to all? The grandmother breast feeding the baby? I'm a little hazy on all the specifications for being mehram. I think all maternal paternal aunts and uncles and their spouses right? Anyway this specification is always difficult to fulfil all the way around because even if ur sister breastfed the baby, the parents would now be mehram, but their biological children would tehnically be first cousins to the baby and therefore namehram. Yup that's a doozy.
The general rule of thumb is to have a close mehram from the father's side breastfeed if the child is a girl and a close female from the mother's side if the child is a male. Generally the milk relatives are the same as the biological. Your meharams are your parents, grandparents and their parents ....., siblings, parent's siblings, siblings' children, children and children's children .......
The siblings will become mehram of the child and the parents this way. According to most schools of thought the breastfeeding has to be done within the first two years of the child's life at least once to a minimum of five times.
Guys, all you are sharing is technically accurate. We must be able to look broadly though, because limiting to these as required conditions becomes a whole diff issue. Eg If person A's brother dies and leaves a 12 year old boy, who is na mehram to person A's daughters and wife, should he not bring that boy in his home? What if the kid is 16?
Some Saudi cleric apparently suggested that women breastfeed their colleagues at work or drivers etc to tackle the mehram issue. Err no thank you is probably what most ladies would say.
Adherence to certain allowed options is fine, but there is more beyond that.