hehehe it was the same laatain that brought Europeans out of the caves.. 
May be you should brush up on “dark ages” 
Think of this this way abdali. Muslims were basically the caretakers, nannies if you will, of collective human thought. The achievements in science, mathematics, art and music had already been part of human conciousness and muslims were an indellible part of it. It is not due to Islam as a sole reason. This distinction is necessary because achievements in those categories often are against the mandates of religion. ala the title of this thread.
Using your reasoning no culture made any contribution coz one culture was a nannie for the other ..LOL….. But the question here is not what contribution a certain civilization made but how civilized was the civilization in question and what changed it…
So did you find out about the dark ages 
may be you should try none Indian history for a change.
Abdali, before the esteemed prophet got the message, many cultures had already been there and done that. I am sure you have heard of the greeks and romans.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Chaltahai: *
Abdali, before the esteemed prophet got the message, many cultures had already been there and done that. I am sure you have heard of the greeks and romans.
[/QUOTE]
Well who is talking about other cultures.. the question is islamic contribution and the dark ages.... And I am sure you must have heard of dark ages...
Yes Abdali, but it is by no means due to religion but more to a structure. If the chinese were ruling the mideast, it would have still happened. The concept is called evolution of knowledge.
there is a book called "Lost discoveries" by Dick Teresi. It is one of many out there their talks about how human knowledge is not a domain of one single entitiy but a compilation of collective human thought. While you are heading to Amazon, also read A History of Knowledge by Charles Van Doren. (Name ring a bell?)
Of course religion plays a great role in shaping civilazations. Let me ask you this if those arabs were not civilized by islam and were still barbarian hoards would they have made those contributions.. Of course not so religion played a great role, it groomed them for what they did for the next 800 years a period in the west known for inventions and prosperity...
Try the second episode of "Islam Empire of Faith" Here is what it says.
It was Islamic ideology of seperation of faith and reason that form the bases of all modren scientific inqueries and led to European Renaissance.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Abdali: *
Of course religion plays a great role in shaping civilazations. Let me ask you this if those arabs were not civilized by islam and were still barbarian hoards would they have made those contributions.. Of course not so religion played a great role, it groomed them for what they did for the next 800 years a period in the west known for inventions and prosperity...
Try the second episode of "Islam Empire of Faith" Here is what it says.
It was Islamic ideology of seperation of faith and reason that form the bases of all modren scientific inqueries and led to European Renaissance.
[/QUOTE]
what about china and japan did religen play any role?
Abdali, that is one view of many. No one is discounting the contribution of "islamic" people in the collective human knowledge. While the reason for this occurance in Arabia, might be due to the structure Islam provides. It is just true for the arabs. Not for the chinese, the Indians, the europeans, the africans or the mayans or the incans. Therefore, it is not a universal truth to suggest that Islam was the leader in knowledge.
Secondly, some argue that the rennaisance had a greater impact on open thought in the muslim world. Particularly in the arts.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by rvikz: *
what about china and japan did religen play any role?
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of course it must have religion is not there for nothing it disciplines.
Secondly, some argue that the rennaisance had a greater impact on open thought in the muslim world. Particularly in the arts.<<<<
Chaltahai, funny you said that, caz scholars of Islamic history would disagree with you. Almost everyone says that the Islamic world has not had a renaissance yet (in the way the European one). The Islamic contribution to the world is monumental in politics and theory of governance, but Islam per say does not provide the framework for independent and progressive thinking (I would say, it hinders it). Arts, sciences, and literature are not a consequence of Islam, but the civilizations that predate Islam by huge stretches.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Chaltahai: *
Abdali, that is one view of many. No one is discounting the contribution of "islamic" people in the collective human knowledge. While the reason for this occurance in Arabia, might be due to the structure Islam provides. It is just true for the arabs. Not for the chinese, the Indians, the europeans, the africans or the mayans or the incans. Therefore, it is not a universal truth to suggest that Islam was the leader in knowledge.
Secondly, some argue that the rennaisance had a greater impact on open thought in the muslim world. Particularly in the arts.
[/QUOTE]
Religion has played a role in every culture/civilization even the failed ideology of communism made contributions... Not that religion gives you the formula for certain problem but it has shaped civilizations.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Abdali: *
Religion has played a role in every culture/civilization even the failed ideology of communism made contributions... Not that religion gives you the formula for certain problem but it has shaped civilizations.
[/QUOTE]
it can be both ways. japan and chian have no relgious conflicts like mid-east and south asia so it gives stability needed to pregress.
Abdali, what religion are you talking about? The Egyptians or the Greeks; caz they certainly didn’t need God (of the kind we have today) to leave huge impact on people for ages to come. If you don’t believe me, watch My Big Fat Greek Wedding, the father proves that everything originated in Greece.
wah wah are you saying those Egyptians who build great pyramids had no religion… LOLz…
P.S: For those with limited knowledge can join MIT to educate themself about Islamic Architecture… http://libraries.mit.edu/guides/subjects/islamicarchitecture/
Ah but wait a minute don’t bother coz there is zero chance you meet the entry requirments. 
Abdali, Well, if those Egyptians had God, then what the hell was Moses upto? Where did I say they didn’t have religion? You need help with reading. I was suggesting that they didn’t think of God as you do. In fact, they promoted themselves to be Gods.
The reason they lumpsum all architecture into one is because that's the only thing going for that particular group. How can a 1400 year old organization keep up with the 5000 year old civilizations? The Dome of the Rock was once the seat of Christianity…how do you like them apples? Islamic architecture, yeah sure. The people who designed those monuments were anything but Muslims.
Can you show some proof from Quran as to how to build museums or mosques?
Chaltahai
Of course religion plays a fundamental role in shaping civilizations.
Whether it is prior to the advent of Islam as you know it, people were following ideologies based on beliefs.
Furthermore, Islam introduced a number of things which were not known prior to the Qur'aan revealing them.
We're not saying that the Qur'aan is a total book of sciences or mathematics or inventions and so forth. But the fact remains that numerous topics were confirmed and records put straight at it's advent.
What you must do in order to counter the argument, is give examples of what was already here prior to the Qur'aan. And I will give you examples of what came with and after the Qur'aan.
NYA you should take deep breadths relax and go right at the top and start again.. Better yet before you do that take some crash course in English it will certainly help.. And after going through this thread line by line, if you still don’t get it let me know I will make it real easy for you with pictures…
And yes you are right there is no such thing as Islamic architecture those MIT, Oxford and Harvard professors must be morons.
This is what I said,
Religion has shaped human civilizations and
You won't find scientific formulas in quran...
But wait you start at the top you need pictures to graps... better yet sholay has repeated my words may be his accent is better then mine ...:)
reason for arab stagnation is described in this article
The barrier to better Arab performance is not a lack of resources, concludes the report, but the lamentable shortage of three essentials: freedom, knowledge and womanpower. Not having enough of these amounts to what the authors call the region’s three “deficits”. It is these deficits, they argue, that hold the frustrated Arabs back from reaching their potential—and allow the rest of the world both to despise and to fear a deadly combination of wealth and backwardness
Abdali, I generally skip the bullcrap and get right to the bottom. Fine, there is Islamic architecture, like the Hiram (which was built by a few weeks before Islam came). The best example of Islamic literature is Satanic Verses, going back to the Topic at hand. You can't be picky and not consider contributions of Muslims that you don’t like, and praise the ones that you do. Of course Religion (belief systems) has shaped the way people think, produce, what's there to debate? The problem is that you talk thru your behind and wouldn’t consider all belief systems to be equal, that's where the problem emerges. Now go and say Ram Ram.