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Only Jaahils like you dont know anything about Bangladesh and 1971.
1 USD = 70 takas 1 USD = 85 Pakistani rupees.
Bangladesh GDP: 5.7% (2009 est.) 5.8% (2008 est.)
Pakistan GDP: 2.7% (2009 est.) 3.4% (2008 est.)
For people like you, "world stage" means to be a part of war on terror.
whats this and what has this to do with war-time propoganda???
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lol what barayi??authorities have proved it beyond doubt its nothing more than war-time propoganda
Who are these authorities? Can you name them and can you show us any proof other than videos of that joker Zaid Hamid?
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^dont have time,enough said.
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whats this and what has this to do with war-time propoganda???
It was you who asked: who knows begladesh today?or what exactly is bengladesh today?whats its role on world stage??
I just gave you a small statistic about Bangladesh in comparison to Pakistan, I think they are doing little better than Pakistan as of now
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My concerns BarbieCue sis are not about whether what happened was good or bad, but our attitude here on this forum ... we seem to be in a resigned state saying "these things happen in war" as if it's no big deal. Americans are not my standard or benchmark either.
The people who are and should be for every Muslim are those early Muslims, Sahabis and Tabi'een.
How difficult is it not to rape villages of women? Supposing it is true that it happened we should never be dismissive of it. Supposing it is not true or has been inflated, even then we should show that our moral standard is high. We are not accountable for our forefathers'
deeds but we are accountable for our own.
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^ I understand what you’re saying and I agree. :k: It is unfortunate that we have become accustomed to such news.
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Things like this happen only if invaders have complete control of the invaded territory , which Pakistani Army never got to achieve in Bangladesh. They were engaged from day one inside and on the border.
Given this situation , they were ill at ease to commit these kind of crimes. Also India had a very good opportunity to try those accused when India had 90 thousand Pakistani POW. They did not have any such reported cases or any proof presented to them that is why nothing like this came out in the open at that time.
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we seem to be in a resigned state saying "these things happen in war" as if it's no big deal.
I think you jumped to the conclusion. No one said that its not a big deal. What is said that these are the unfortunate events that are part of the ugliness of war and one should not be ashamed of being a pakistani because few mistakes happened.
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I think you jumped to the conclusion. No one said that its not a big deal. What is said that these are the unfortunate events that are part of the ugliness of war and one should not be ashamed of being a pakistani because few mistakes happened.
I agree, an average Pakistani should be proud of Paksitan. Why should an average Pakistani be held responsible/accountable for actions of Pak Army. That is true for any citizen of any country be it US/Israel/Pakistan/India.
As far as mistakes are concerned, these were not few mistakes but these were historic blunders. Mistakes did not divide Pakistan, it was blunders that did.
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I think you jumped to the conclusion. No one said that its not a big deal. What is said that these are the unfortunate events that are part of the ugliness of war and one should not be ashamed of being a pakistani because few mistakes happened.
I'm saying that this statement to me sounds resigned.
I would rephrase "unfortunate events" to "events that should not have happened", rephrase "part of the ugliness of war" to "those wars were ugly if the reports are true" and rephrase "one should not be ashamed of being a pakistani because a few mistakes happened" to "one should not be ashamed of being pakistani and to demonstrate this best is to clearly state where previous wrongs have been and say we never condone this behaviour, one wrong unto an individual is as though the whole of humanity has been wronged".
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My concerns BarbieCue sis are not about whether what happened was good or bad, but our attitude here on this forum ... we seem to be in a resigned state saying "these things happen in war" as if it's no big deal. Americans are not my standard or benchmark either. The people who are and should be for every Muslim are those early Muslims, Sahabis and Tabi'een.
How difficult is it not to rape villages of women? Supposing it is true that it happened we should never be dismissive of it. Supposing it is not true or has been inflated, even then we should show that our moral standard is high. We are not accountable for our forefathers' deeds but we are accountable for our own.
Your early muslims kept female POW as slave girls and considered it collateral damage.
Not saying that raping female prisnors is right in any way....
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Your early muslims kept female POW as slave girls and considered it collateral damage. Not saying that raping female prisnors is right in any way....
My early Muslims? Anyway they took over lands and maintained the state by catering for the needs of women and children from their own wealth by giving them in most cases the same livelihoods they enjoyed as women to their husbands that had been killed in war.
Raping women has a burden to society because no male takes responsiblity for the consequences, they do their bit and leave. Slavery by the early Muslims is more like domestic servitude to todays standards, not like the slavery of America or Roman empire. I hope this puts a bit of context to what you have hurled in my direction!
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Ok not your....just early muslims.
As for the reasons for slavery and the "good" things about it, you are being biased here because of obvious reasons. its almost same thing you are accusing others in the thread ....not having courge to call spade a spade.
But understandable.........
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Ok not your....just early muslims. As for the reasons for slavery and the "good" things about it, you are being biased here because of obvious reasons. its almost same thing you are accusing others in the thread ....not having courge to call spade a spade. But understandable.........
Peace bebo
Not at all. The bias that I have comes after the fact and knowing the facts. The Sahabah were the best of the followers of the Best of Mankind (SAW). This is not just a title but a testimony of others. People would rather be enslaved by Muslims rather than live under their own kings in documented history. The slaves have rights - the pioneers of employment law - the Muslims. If you don't own a business and you work for a company. Guess what? You are a modern slave! Yes, that is what it meant to be a slave in early Islam - an employee.
The conjugal relations didn't come without a price to the men they had to pay for upkeep. Rapist military men do not have to do this, rather they probably steal food and break their houses while they are at it. For them rape is part of the war ... it is part of the attack. You can never compare that with the slavery that was itself a norm of the day but it was given a reasonable standard when our dear prophet (SAW) came. You can say it is bias, but I say first compare apples with apples.
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Yes, it's true, I'm part Bengali and my mum was living in Bangladesh during the war (the Indian army even took over their house) and some of the stuff that went on back then was horrendous..
One thing she told me that stuck in my mind was about a group of female students at Dhaka University who were held and gang-raped, basically used as sex-slaves.. in fact after the war the Gov launched an initiative to try and persuade men to marry women who had gotten pregnant by Pak soldiers during the war :( I know this stuff happens in every war but doesn't make it any more acceptable to me.. Another thing that happened was that the local religious groups would give hit lists of academics and the more successful families in their areas for the Pakistani army to hunt down and kill. This is one reason the religious parties are still not popular in Bangladesh as a lot of people still resent and don't trust them due to what they did back then (there's one very famous religious guy whose name I can't remember who even now says that Bangladesh should be part of Pakistan)..
Anyway, that was back then and most Bangladeshis don't have any bad feelings towards the average Pakistani who did them no harm, they're very laid-back and moderate people by nature anyway, kinda like Thais and Malaysians.. They just want to move away from that bloody past and go forward..
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It was you who asked: who knows begladesh today?or what exactly is bengladesh today?whats its role on world stage??
I just gave you a small statistic about Bangladesh in comparison to Pakistan, I think they are doing little better than Pakistan as of now
Blind nationalists like early bird will never believe that, they just live in their hateful little bubble..
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Seems like Pakistan has quite a few "Historical blunder's."
I was having a conversation with a Bangladeshi women today who told me her Aunt was raped by a Pakistani person back then. and she gave me the strangest look as to say "ur people done this to my Aunt" and I was quite stunned, and felt almost guilty for something my country had done. and once again I felt ashamed for being a Pakistani. its not right I know but thts the way I felt then and still do
should we hold ourselves accountable? hmmm I guess when the people of Pakistan elect the government for the country then they r held responsible for the government's actions to some degree no? (although I don't think at tht time the government was elected by the people?). In which case we shouldn't be held accountable, I guess.
But the current government of Pakistan is getting away with murder too. most probably 99.9% of people hate the prime minister and don't agree with his government. Why have the Pakistani people even allowed him and his party in government in the first place? as long as we continue to elect these corrupt people to govern Pakistan we hold ourselves responsible for their actions, because we are the ones who choose these people to sit at the top in the first place. and until nothing changes I am ashamed to be a Pakistani :(
Re: a question…
Read Hamid Mir’s article on this …in fact make your friend read it too. We do apologize for our crimes ..
http://thedawn.com.pk/2010/03/30/pakistani-apology-to-all-bangladeshis/
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Blind nationalists like early bird will never believe that, they just live in their hateful little bubble..
hey i am already done with this bogus bengayladeshi thread so keep me out of it.
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Yes, it's true, I'm part Bengali and my mum was living in Bangladesh during the war (the Indian army even took over their house) and some of the stuff that went on back then was horrendous..
One thing she told me that stuck in my mind was about a group of female students at Dhaka University who were held and gang-raped, basically used as sex-slaves.. in fact after the war the Gov launched an initiative to try and persuade men to marry women who had gotten pregnant by Pak soldiers during the war :( I know this stuff happens in every war but doesn't make it any more acceptable to me.. Another thing that happened was that the local religious groups would give hit lists of academics and the more successful families in their areas for the Pakistani army to hunt down and kill. This is one reason the religious parties are still not popular in Bangladesh as a lot of people still resent and don't trust them due to what they did back then (there's one very famous religious guy whose name I can't remember who even now says that Bangladesh should be part of Pakistan)..
..
:(