In one of the post on Hadith on Imam Hazrat Ali A.S. which was recently deleted… Kaleem posted that Quran is enough and thats why he don’t feel a need to books of knowledge like Najul Balagah… I am not doubting the authenticity of Quran… for sure its the best of the best book… and the final message of God… Nor do I want to offend or degrade anyone but here are some questions I have.
1. If quran is the only source thats enough.. why do people send kids to school… I mean didn’t Prophet Mohammad P.B.U.H. said…seek knowledge even if you have to go to China for it.
2. If quran is enough … where does it say in Quran how to pray, do wazoo…or Arkan-e- Hajj…
3. I don’t know if its in there..but can you show me where is the nikkah sigah in quran
I have heard a famous hadith from the sunni brother saying that Prophet said he is leaving behind two things .. Quran and sunnah… but PERSONALLY I don’t get it either because of the following ayat in Quran… “Today I have perfected your religion and completed my favour upon you, and I was satisfied that Islam be your religion.” (Qur’an 5:3)
How in a perfect religon Prophet Mohammad P.B.U.H. leave Quran..which no doublt is the best source of knowledge but he didn’t mention what is a good book to follow sunnah… why would he leave that vague… I mean gupshup is a perfect example where people pick and choose hadith… I have noticed people like Armughal, gupguppy.. I mentioned them hadith from his own books but he ruled it out.. Why would in a perfect religon as islam Prophet Mohammad leave a good source of knowledge like Quran but a vague source for Sunnah…
**5. Shia on the other hand have a hadith **
The Messenger of Allah [s] declared:“It seems the time approached when I shall be called away (by Allah) and I shall answer that call. I am leaving for you two precious things and if you adhere to them both, you will never go astray after me. They are the Book of Allah and my Progeny, that is my Ahlul Bayt. The two shall never separate from each other until they come to me by the Pool (of Paradise).”
And history is a witness Imam has always been a good source of knowledge.. a good example can be seen in Najul Balagah http://www.al-islam.org/nahjul/index.htm
Imam Jaffar -e- Sadiq is a very good example of knowledge of his time… They were always there when needed to defend islam, a good example can be seen Hazrat Ali AS was awarded sword by Allah SWT… Sacrifices of Imam Hussain A.S. are a good a example.
Probably thats the reason eventhough shias have 12 Imams, and still their teachings are the same…whereas sunnis have four imam not to mention all of them came after Prophet Mohammad P.B.U.H. and there are still differences in different issues
Re: A question for fellow guppies on Quran and sunnah
Thanks for sharing
Probably thats the reason eventhough shias have 12 Imams, and still their teachings are the same…whereas sunnis have four imam not to mention all of them came after Prophet Mohammad P.B.U.H. and there are still differences in different issues
errr, they are not the same “Imam” as the concept of Imamat. They just tried to explain some issues according to their understanding of Islam
Can you please share brief introduction of 12 noble Imams here, so people can learn about them. Thanks
Certainly, being the members of the parties of such Satanic Imams has been severely denounced in Quran, and the followers of such parties will meet the fate of their leaders. However, Quran also reminds that there are Imams who are appointed by Allah as Guides for the mankind:“And We ASSIGNED from among them some Imams who GUIDE by Our authority since they were patient and believed firmly in Our Signs.” (Quran 32:24)
Re: A question for fellow guppies on Quran and sunnah
This is primarily for obtaining religious knowledge.
The Prophet (saw) also said the following:
"Acquire knowledge. It enabled its possessor to distinguish right from wrong; it lighted the way to Heaven; it is our friend in the desert, our society in solitude, our companion when friendless; it guided us to happiness; it sustained us in misery; it is an ornament among friends, and armour against enemies." I am sorry I don’t have the reference for it on hand.
Quran has all the guidance that is needed for the salvation of mankind. Nothing more can be added to it. Neither did the Prophet (saw) add anything to it.
Sunnah and hadith are not second edition of the Quran but Prophet’s (saw) example of how to follow the commands of the Quran.
Quran talks about Tawheed; Prophet (saw) has instructed us in detail of all the implications of Tawheed.
Quran asks us to pray, observe the fasting of the month of Ramadhan, perform Hajj, give Zakat , marriage etc: Prophet (saw) has shown us practically how to carry out these instructions.
Why are you so confused?
Quran is the primary source of Guidance and the Sunnah of the Prophet (saw) is following the Guidance of the Quran.
Hz. Aisha(ra) was asked what is the Quran and she replied: Prophet(saw) was “the walking Quran”
I am sorry even the Shia scholars believe that about more than 65% narrations in the best of Shia hadith book [Al-Kafi] are unreliable. You can imagine the state of affairs in the other Shia hadith books.
You are mistakenly using Shia to mean 12’er Shia [also called Imamis].
There are other Shias who are called 5’ers and 7’ers and they do not believe in the 12 Imams either.
Re: A question for fellow guppies on Quran and sunnah
You probably didn’t answer my question if sunnah are most important why didnt Prophet Mohammad PBUH didn’t mention a correct source for it… why do you have to pick and chooose… Islam is perfect why would he leave a vague source of his sunnah…
Hmm I can make up so many stuff unreferenced and use it to spread like sunni guppies here… where did you learn this from…look at the websitte above I have a link posted with the references to the hadith i mentioned… this is just playing ignorant to hide the truth…
Re: A question for fellow guppies on Quran and sunnah
One can also find a detailed debate held between shia and sunni scholars on the following … after which sunni scholars converted to shia on the following website http://www.al-islam.org/peshawar/
Or a person who converted to shiasm…why and how? http://www.al-islam.org/guided/
Re: A question for fellow guppies on Quran and sunnah
I love it when you guys twist the meanings of ayath to make it appear as if its talking about your Imams. Why did you not quote the ayath before it? I will tell you why because it talks about Moses and the ayath you quoted is a continuation of that ayath. Furthermore, its not Imam..its a leader. For people who care, here are the two ayaths.
032.023 وَلَقَدْ آتَيْنَا مُوسَى الْكِتَابَ فَلا تَكُنْ فِي مِرْيَةٍ مِنْ لِقَائِهِ وَجَعَلْنَاهُ هُدًى لِبَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ
032.023 We did indeed aforetime give the Book to Moses: be not then in doubt of its reaching (thee): and We made it a guide to the Children of Israel.
032.024 وَجَعَلْنَا مِنْهُمْ أَئِمَّةً يَهْدُونَ بِأَمْرِنَا لَمَّا صَبَرُوا وَكَانُوا بِآيَاتِنَا يُوقِنُونَ
032.024 And We appointed, from among them, leaders, giving guidance under Our command, so long as they persevered with patience and continued to have faith in Our Signs.
Al-Qur’an, 032.023-024 (As-Sajda [The Prostration, Worship, Adoration])
Re: A question for fellow guppies on Quran and sunnah
Sorry for not providing with source I thought that it was common knowledge among the Shia.
Well check the following, it is from Shia source.
The number of traditions in al-Kafi is 15,181;[8] according to another reckoning 15,176.[9] If the traditions reported in different sections are counted, the number is over 1,000 more. Of the basic traditions, 5,072 are considered sound (sahih) by scholars, i.e. first category; 144 are regarded as good (hasan), second category; 178 are held to be trustworthy (muwaththaq), third category; 302 are adjudged to be strong (qawi), fourth category; and 9,484 are considered weak (da’if), fifth category.[10] The fact that a tradition is considered weak does not mean that it is not true. What it means is that the scholars of tradition have found some weakness in the tradition, usually one of the persons in the isnad, which suggests the possibility that the tradition might not go back to the Imam as claimed.
Re: A question for fellow guppies on Quran and sunnah
Yeah, Shias are the righetous owners of Islam, they claim to be the descendants of Holy prophet:saw:, eventhough most of them could not even tell you their great grandfather’s name, besides their lineage goes to Ali (r.a) not to Prophet Muhammad:saw:. It is pretty simple really.
Re: A question for fellow guppies on Quran and sunnah
Another false accusation… I am not a syed or descendent of Prophet Mohammad P.B.U.H. or Hazrat Ali A.S… and Alhamdullilah still a shia…
By the way Kaleem sahab…care to answer the three question I asked… Aren’t you the one who said Quran is enough… We don’t need any other book of knowledge… How about explaining the above three questions for me..
**1. If quran is the only source thats enough.. why do people send kids to school… I mean didn’t Prophet Mohammad P.B.U.H. said…seek knowledge even if you have to go to China for it.
If quran is enough … where does it say in Quran how to pray, do wazoo…or Arkan-e- Hajj…**
3. I don’t know if its in there..but can you show me where is the nikkah sigah in quran
Re: A question for fellow guppies on Quran and sunnah
Not all Shias have 12 Imams, some have five, others, six or seven. Just looks at Ismaelis, Khojas, Zaidis, Nizaris, Druze, Bohras etc. with further sub-sects. Which one do you follow? All their Imams are from Aal-e-Muhammad :saw:.
Re: A question for fellow guppies on Quran and sunnah
Its not a flase accustaion. It was meant for your brother in faith 420.
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Do you really want me to answer this childish analogy? Can you not use your brain and see that this parallel does not work? I will answer it anyway. Quran is enough for religious matters. You go to Quran to get spiritual/religious guidance. Plus, I never said that other books were not needed for knowledge (science, technolgy etc). This was not too hard to understand, was it?
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You are right. Quran does not supply the details of Wazoo or praying. These actions have been explained in Ahadith and could have been easily carried down the generations by the simple act of mimicking/following.
3. I don’t know if its in there..but can you show me where is the nikkah sigah in quran
I am not sure what sigah means?
Now, do you care to explain about the ayaths I presented to refute your claim of Imam’s mention in Quran? I know you need some time to google, I will be patient.
Re: A question for fellow guppies on Quran and sunnah
Of all the shias I've come across, include those who are subcontinental in appearance (bihari in this case) and do not from any stretch of imagination have any Arab-lineage all claim to be decendents of the Prophet and this phenomenon is true of all shias.....This is just hysterical to say least.....
Re: A question for fellow guppies on Quran and sunnah
Aren’t you the one who said you don’t need to read Najul Balagah.. Quran is enough for you for knowledge… Didn’t you? Everytime a hadith is brought up you if I remember right and Asayb…ask to show it in Quran..thats the point I was trying to make…??? I am glad we are on same page now on some matter atleast…
By Nikkah Sigah I mean the phrases that are read to perform Nikkah…thought you’d be smart enough to guess but OH well !
All their Imams are from Aal-e-Muhammad :saw:.