A Pakistani Girl

[Theorist]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@Mezhgan

Questions for people:

How does a blog about one woman’s experiences incite such vitriol? The poor woman wrote about what happened to HER. Why is this so offensive to some of the posters on here?

Secondly, where are people getting the idea that the author of the blog stated that this happens in ALL Pakistani families? From what I read, she is only discussing HER experiences and what happened to HER. If this type of thing does not happen in your family, great. No one stated that it does.

Put the torches and pitchforks down. Everyone.

I try but then…o wait, I wanted to add a GIF but my ipad wouldn’t let me.

---

Restored attachments:

[Maula_Jatt]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@Theorist

With this post. Maybe it is the way you wrote it especially the last para.

It’s definitely the way I wrote it and I can see how you’d receive it to be that.

I can assure you I had no intent to downplay your or your sisters experiences or anyones in particular (except maybe Reha )

I am merely suggesting that from our experiences we can have positive or negative growth or both.

The women I talk about are the ones who have made negative decisions based on their experiences.

As you pointed out, I don’t know you. Or your sister. I dont know what experiences you’ve had and what you’ve taken from them. Any comment I’d make about it would be invalid anyway.

[Southie]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@PyariCgudia

^ Because she titles it the Pakistani Girl, thereby applying the experience to everyone. Implying most of us suffer like this. When really we don’t. These are mentally ill people in our community creating trouble, and because there is no law and order in Pakistan, they get away with their crimes. Has nothing to do with being Pakistani, has more to do with a dysfunctional law and order system.

The title lf this thread and blog is “A Pakistani girl”

Not sure what the source of confusion is.

[diwana]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@Mezhgan

No. She doesn’t. She titled it A Pakistani Girl. A as in one girl.

Perhaps this was missed by you, you ignored it OR I failed to explain. Not sure.

@diwana

…

As for the blog:

it was meant to create a certain kind of reaction. With an emotional touch.

Many Girls/women unfortunately do have a lot of social problems just like men and not only in Pakistan but outside Pakistan.

its just that the set of problems maybe different based on many variables not just based on differences of sexes.

The title: " A Pakistani Girl" is essentially a generalized statement.

its like saying " An American Girl" " A British Boy" and writing something unusual (read carefully please I said “unusual”) story to use it as a showcase. Hope this point is clear somewhat.

if it was written as " One Pakistani Girl" then it would have somewhat of less generalized but then it would not only look too realistic and… it would have lost the intended reaction altogether.

Now the blog writer would have been fine if he/she had written " Story of A Girl". A specific girl.

And the message would have been less dramatic but still effective.

Please carry on.

And your questions more likely are directed towards those who think somehow there is hatred against girls/women common in Pakistan or Pakistani traditional families.

---

Reading a blog and running amok with generalization is what is absolutely wrong.

Same site has other emotional blog and seems to be running on wild ideas like grandma slit her wrist when a man married to a Muslim girl named Shazia.

---

There is no support for ill-treatment of girls/women anywhere by me and I see no man so far who has approved it.
**
All my posts are/were against utter absurd stereotype shown by some posters. **

Girl or boy when born at least in my experience in any family I know are/were treated equally and there are great lovely families from Pakistan I know who have all girls and nowhere I see any remorse in any of the parents. Not that it would not happen here and there. But certainly not common as being portrayed by some.

[bella88]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

pakistani girls better suck it up! don’t post a blog about your suffering or what you see going on around you. some people here have never witnessed such things OR choose to ignore it and live in denial, and will blame you for making them look bad and you must be a drama queen, liar or simply exaggerating as these things never really happen and are just false stories spread by certain people who have an ‘agenda’. keep your suffering to yourself. No need to vent online and blog. just toughen up and stay silent.
I bet this is what certain male posters want.

[PyariCgudia]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@Southie

The title lf this thread and blog is “A Pakistani girl”

Not sure what the source of confusion is.

There is a source of confusion, because most of us urban girls, and Pakistanis raised in safer parts of the world don’t go through these things. It’s not a cultural issue, it’s a law and order issue.

Stop people from pursuing their dreams and achieving adequate employment in America, and you’ll see these horrors here too. Countries that happen to be poor these days are the muslim countries, so blaming the socioeconomic problems on religion or culture does nothing but marginalize these people more.

Pakistanis don’t believe in sexual molestation as a cultural value. They just don’t. Ask the majority of families. Does that mean criminals don’t exist? They do, because the law is not putting them behind bars, where they belong. Not because Pakistanis value sexual molestation.

And because women face sexual troubles, people react by sheltering them more. Doesn’t make them less important, it’s a protective mechanism.

Now are boys allowed out more than girls, sure, but even those days are gone. Not sure if you guys have been to Pakistan recently, but young guys are not allowed out by sensible families anymore either because of target killings and kidnappings.

[Southie]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

When there is rape in India, it is OK to blame the system, isn’t it. What this gal went through happens in India also. It is OK to acknowledge these things happen. That doesn’t tarnish a country. Acknowledgement is the first step towards addressing the problem.

I agree that socioeconomic conditions and access to education are other factors that determine an individual’s experience in society. So one can expect similar problems in the west if the lack of opportunities were replicated.

You make a good point about law and order being the main issue. Point taken.

Your post implied that the blog was generalizing to all girls by using The instead of A. For starters, we should be accurate in terms of describing what the blog states.

[Southie]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

If I understood post 84 correctly, use of A instead of One is problematic.

Ok. Clear now. How did we miss that.

[Maula_Jatt]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@PyariCgudia

There is a source of confusion, because most of us urban girls, and Pakistanis raised in safer parts of the world don’t go through these things. It’s not a cultural issue, it’s a law and order issue.

Stop people from pursuing their dreams and achieving adequate employment in America, and you’ll see these horrors here too. Countries that happen to be poor these days are the muslim countries, so blaming the socioeconomic problems on religion or culture does nothing but marginalize these people more.

Pakistanis don’t believe in sexual molestation as a cultural value. They just don’t. Ask the majority of families. Does that mean criminals don’t exist? They do, because the law is not putting them behind bars, where they belong. Not because Pakistanis value sexual molestation.

And because women face sexual troubles, people react by sheltering them more. Doesn’t make them less important, it’s a protective mechanism.

Now are boys allowed out more than girls, sure, but even those days are gone. Not sure if you guys have been to Pakistan recently, but young guys are not allowed out by sensible families anymore either because of target killings and kidnappings.

[Theorist]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@PyariCgudia

There is a source of confusion, because most of us urban girls, and Pakistanis raised in safer parts of the world don’t go through these things. It’s not a cultural issue, it’s a law and order issue.

Stop people from pursuing their dreams and achieving adequate employment in America, and you’ll see these horrors here too. Countries that happen to be poor these days are the muslim countries, so blaming the socioeconomic problems on religion or culture does nothing but marginalize these people more.

Pakistanis don’t believe in sexual molestation as a cultural value. They just don’t. Ask the majority of families. Does that mean criminals don’t exist? They do, because the law is not putting them behind bars, where they belong. Not because Pakistanis value sexual molestation.

And because women face sexual troubles, people react by sheltering them more. Doesn’t make them less important, it’s a protective mechanism.

Now are boys allowed out more than girls, sure, but even those days are gone. Not sure if you guys have been to Pakistan recently, but young guys are not allowed out by sensible families anymore either because of target killings and kidnappings.

How is it a law and order issue to reject a girl child instead of celebrating her birth? I fail to understand that and that is the beginning of the entire mess. Not being accepted. You can’t overlook that then go on about how everything is a law and order issue.

[gudiaali]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@bella88

whoever thinks this is an exaggeration lives in la-la land. Being a woman in a desi/pakistani community is the biggest curse. I have seen it as well. Its typical to not even congratulate the mother when a girl is born! instead people say ‘agli bar beta hoga inshalla’ instead of saying congrats! this is how ****ed up our society is. the story in the blog is actually alot better than what millions of girls go through everyday in pakistan.
starting from birth, they are typically unwanted. many are left in orphanage as poor parents cannot afford a girl, they only keep reproducing in hopes of having a boy. if she’s lucky enough to be kept by her parents, she is given the leftover food after her brothers and father eat. if she’s raped, she’s killed her own family because the dishonor is too great, if she is caught dating/running away with a guy, she is shot in the head by her brothers as their ghairat doesn’t allow her to live any more. if she rejects a guy, her face is burned off by acid because a man cannot handle rejection well.
as far as middle class and upper class, even those girls have to live in such double standards. the brothers have way more freedom than the girls. pakistani girls have FAR more restrictions than the boys. then once the girls get married, they are expected to serve their inlaws and put up with them regardless of how they treat them. She must obey his parents, serve them, take care of them. Her own parents are no longer as important! nothing worse than being born in a traditional Pakistani home as a female.

how many years you have actually lived in Pakistan?
highly generalized and unethical statement you have made here by saying being a woman in desi/pakistani community is the biggest curse.

[bella88]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@gudiaali

how many years you have actually lived in Pakistan?
highly generalized and unethical statement you have made here by saying being a woman in desi/pakistani community is the biggest curse.

long enough to see what I have seen. many of the posters here haven’t lived in pakistan either, I dont see you asking them how long they have lived. please go visit a rural area in pakistan and tell me how women are treated. cattle is treated better in those areas than a woman!
funny how one must live in paksitan to know how women are treated. how long have you lived in africa to know there is huge humanitarian crisis and starvation there? how long did you live in Syria to know there is people dying every day there?
please read some news, find out how many girls are killed in the name of ‘honor’, how many girls become victims of acid attack disfiguring their faces, how many are denied education because they are girls, how many are unwanted from day one of their birth, how many girls are treated completely differently from their brothers as they are the favored ones, how many are are sold by their own families as they are worthless and a huge burden, and how many are malnutritioned, anemic, in poor health, because their husbands impregnate them every year in hopes of getting a boy, without any regards to maternal health?? you think these things are rare in pakistan?
the story in the blog doesn’t even come close to how bad it really is for women over there, especially lower income class and rural ones. (which makeup majority of paksitan, not some sheltered rich ones living in defense or clifton and major cities)

[Maula_Jatt]

Gudiaaali dont you know?

You actually get to experience the pakistani culture MORE when you dont live in pakistan.

The more time youve spent away means you will have experienced it more and are more familiar with current social and cultural norms.

Its a tricky concept, I dont get it either but that seems to be how it works around here.

[Maula_Jatt]

@bella88:10070316

… them how long they have lived. please go visit a rural area in pakistan and tell me how women are treated. cattle is treated better in those areas than a woman!
funny how one must live in paksitan to know how

Sure you dont mean India?

I kidd. As you were.

[bella88]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@Maula_Jatt

Sure you dont mean India?

india is no better either. women are treated equally bad

[gudiaali]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

the blog might not have been written with the objective to generalize all Pakistani girls but some posters here have definitely made it so and are persistent to imply that this happens to all Pakistani girls.
this does not happen to all and this is not a story of every girl living in Pakistan or born to a Pakistani family elsewhere.
In my family it has always been a common thing that parents and grand parents( this includes Dadis too) (don’t know why the hell some people label dadis as an universally evil creature): pray to have a first child as a daughter. because they have this believe that having a first child as daughter brings blessings and means that ALLAH is happy with you. a birth of a daughter is celebrated twice as much than a birth of a son in our khandan. Girls are never treated as second rated members, infact they are given the priority over the sons in so many things. be it clothes, outings, presents etc etc. and this doesn’t restrict to my own family but things are like this way in so many other families as well in Pakistan.
i being a girl has been given a equal right to education, to work, to comforts & luxuries of life, to express myself as it was given to my brothers. and yeah right to chose our own live partners and right to say no to rishtas that my parents might like but i dislike.
i can go out with friends on outings, movies, late night dinners/functions/concerts etc and i have male friends too. and my other female friends are given these rights too. so i am not the only one in Pakistan who is provided with all this.
Yes there could be some limitations at times, but that is not because i am a girl but because my family and my parents love me to bits to let any harm happen to me. I don’t remember a time when my mother has told me not to wear jeans when going to bazar, has ever made me feel bad or sad. never felt an unworthy one when my dada used to tell me or my sister not to go out to a friends house without a driver and at the same time would have no qualms about my brother going out alone, because we view it from the angle that he was being careful about us more because we were so so precious to him and he was much more protective towards us than his grandsons.

coming to the blog, yes in some families girls are not welcome as boys, girls do get molested, girls do get emotional and lost themselves to wrong kind of guys but this does not only happen in Pakistan but this is something that happens in every part of the world in every community.

I mentioned all of this here because may be some people would stop generalizing stuff about Pakistan.

[bella88]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@Maula_Jatt

Gudiaaali dont you know?

You actually get to experience the pakistani culture MORE when you dont live in pakistan.

The more time youve spent away means you will have experienced it more and are more familiar with current social and cultural norms.

Its a tricky concept, I dont get it either but that seems to be how it works around here.

have you lived in palestine, africa, syria to know whats going on over there? i have never been to those areas, so can I say there is no atrocities going on over there?

funny how one cannot point out all the horrible crimes and womens rights violation if they are not currently living in Pakistan, but those who ignore/deny all these horrible things dont have to be living there..

[gudiaali]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@bella88

long enough to see what I have seen. many of the posters here haven’t lived in pakistan either, I dont see you asking them how long they have lived. please go visit a rural area in pakistan and tell me how women are treated. cattle is treated better in those areas than a woman!
funny how one must live in paksitan to know how women are treated. how long have you lived in africa to know there is huge humanitarian crisis and starvation there? how long did you live in Syria to know there is people dying every day there?
please read some news, find out how many girls are killed in the name of ‘honor’, how many girls become victims of acid attack disfiguring their faces, how many are denied education because they are girls, how many are unwanted from day one of their birth, how many girls are treated completely differently from their brothers as they are the favored ones, how many are are sold by their own families as they are worthless and a huge burden, and how many are malnutritioned, anemic, in poor health, because their husbands impregnate them every year in hopes of getting a boy, without any regards to maternal health?? you think these things are rare in pakistan?
the story in the blog doesn’t even come close to how bad it really is for women over there, especially lower income class and rural ones. (which makeup majority of paksitan, not some sheltered rich ones living in defense or clifton and major cities)

yes i have asked you because none of the other posters have made such a baseless, unethical statement.
your statement was encompassing all women living in Pakistan. i am not denying that the ugly stuff to some of women doesn’t happen in Pak, but it happens else where too.
child molestation, rape, treating women as second grade citizens, depriving women to equal chances( you tell me how many women in the west you see on the top corporate positions, are they given the equal rights?) forcing daughters and wives to work and earn themselves, putting the burden to run the house on women all of this and much more happens all over the world.

[bella88]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@gudiaali

yes i have asked you because none of the other posters have made such a baseless, unethical statement.
your statement was encompassing all women living in Pakistan. i am not denying that the ugly stuff to some of women doesn’t happen in Pak, but it happens else where too.
child molestation, rape, treating women as second grade citizens, depriving women to equal chances( you tell me how many women in the west you see on the top corporate positions, are they given the equal rights?) forcing daughters and wives to work and earn themselves, putting the burden to run the house on women all of this and much more happens all over the world.

this thread is about pakistani women first of all, not about how western women. and no you cannot compare how women are treated in the west to pakistan. there is some inequality here as well, but nothing to the extent of how it is over there.
you clearly have no idea how tough life is for an average woman in pakistan who comes from a rural area and from lower socioeconomic background.
lol ‘forcing’ wives to earn?? okay. guess how many women are pakistan are FORCED as well? all those maasis and cleaning ladies that come to your home in pakistan, what about them having to work so hard? again, this comfortable luxurious housewive life is only granted to the RICH pakistani women, NOT majority pakistani women who actually live in rural areas. rural women who are working hard physical labor such as farming, working in factories, laying bricks, and many come to cities to work as domestic servants. those women also have the burden of providing for their children and themselves. they work just as hard as their male counterparts, if not harder. again, please go see how life is life for majority of pakistani women, NOT the ones living in affluent areas in major cities. go to villages and kachi abaadi areas and see what women there have to go through every single day.

[gudiaali]

Re: A Pakistani Girl

@bella88

have you lived in palestine, africa, syria to know whats going on over there? i have never been to those areas, so can I say there is no atrocities going on over there?

funny how one cannot point out all the horrible crimes and womens rights violation if they are not currently living in Pakistan, but those who ignore/deny all these horrible things dont have to be living there..

point out but do not over generalize.
its not about ignoring, but if someone tells you it doesn’t happen to all and doesn’t happen to them then you take that as they are ignoring or denying anything?
why not be open minded, liberal and mature person and accept that good things and bad things happen everywhere, all nationalities.