TLK, I asked Mirch a question regarding a post HE wrote. I was looking for clarification because it makes no sense to me. If he can help me understand this 4-wives rule...what is wrong with that? He may know more about it than I do. Why cant I ask Mirch a question?
There has got to be more to this than what you write here. A man cannot simply marry anytime he wants because he starts feeling a little frisky. Where is the self-control? The way you put it, it seems like men have none.
There is no hadees , no ayat in Quran about seeking permission from existing wives that is why. I do not question wisdom of Allah(SWT) I do question Ahadees though , but not all of them , some of them.
I can only guess a reason my guess would be that no woman in her right mind will want to share a husband and will permit him to go for a second go at it. That can create a fitna for a man who might have a genuine reason to get married second , third or fourth time. Then I can also guess that on the contrary if women would have been allowed to have more than one husbands there will be chaos in the society and there will be many murders every moment. Men tend to go to extremes when it comes to sharing their love for a woman. It is all a guess and my personal opinion. It is prone to flaws.
Allah created men and women , and Allah knows what kind of rules and regulation will be suitable for us.
As far as self control goes , as I said , someone in this day and age will marry more then one woman only if they lose their sanity not self control.
History proves that this is got to be the only reason. Any other reason was not proven as a general case.
I am not sure if it makes a man appear weak or strong, but that is the only reason.
Infertilty can be taken care of by Medication or adoption. If wife is incapabale or simply frigid, a divorce is the answer, if helping or providing support to a poor woman then one can give her money, marrying her is not the solution.
Every other reasoning has other solutions available, Sexual drive is the only reason that can be taken care of by marrying more.
In past, sexual drive and creating more social links with elites were the reasons.
In my opinion, Islam allows polygamy as a way to protect orphans and widows and maintain population numbers in society during natural catastrophes and war. That too, only under specific circumstances with especially vulernable women.
In the example of the prophet p, we find he practiced monogamy with his first wife, even when others were dying of famines, plagues, floods and earthquakes in addition to wars. As another example, Ali r asked the Prophet for permission to take a second wife, and the prophet replied, only after he divorces Fatimah. So Ali remained monogamous with his first wife as did the prophet.
As far as polygamy is concerned, it is only after the death of his first wife, during these catastrophic times that he participated in polygamy with women who would have been rejected by society. Here it needs to be remembered that even Aish r came from a broken engagement (i.e. rejected by another man), which tarnished her reputation in a soiciety in which women were often considered at best a commodity and at worse a humiliating burrden.
Hence, from an ethical point of view, polygamy is okay in Islam if:
There is a natural catastrophe like the one in the days of the Prophet p.
The man is a widower (first wife has passed away).
The women are widowed, divorced or possibly orphaned, marrying because they need a man to take care of them.
The man has resources to take care of these wives.
^Thank you.....and here i was repeating this over and over again..in multiple threads..thinking..maybe just maybe..it will make sense to people under the impression....."men are horny.. thus need to have multiple wives to prove it."
History proves that this is got to be the only reason. Any other reason was not proven as a general case.
I am not sure if it makes a man appear weak or strong, but that is the only reason.
Infertilty can be taken care of by Medication or adoption. If wife is incapabale or simply frigid, a divorce is the answer, if helping or providing support to a poor woman then one can give her money, marrying her is not the solution.
Every other reasoning has other solutions available, Sexual drive is the only reason that can be taken care of by marrying more.
In past, sexual drive and creating more social links with elites were the reasons.
TLK where there is man...there is sabr...and sabr is not an alien concept...
self restraint teaches you to NOT satisfy every erec****. otherwise there is no difference between a man and janwar/haiwan.
I was interested in getting your opinion on the following topic as it proved to be an interesting debate at the dinner table yesterday evening.
Assuming a man has the capability of taking on 4 wives and treating them all equally, is it justified that he does so? Islam permits him to do so.. so religiously i appreciate there is not the obvious restriction, but on (a) moral and (b) ethical grounds, is it right?
Girls what do you think..could you share your husband?
Gentleman - your thoughts??
Absolutely not...shall not...will not...cannot...share a man with another woman. There are plenty to go around now...why does she want mine?
How would I raise a child in that home? What is my child going to call this other wife? Aunty Ji? Khala Jaan?
There has to be more to this 4-wives rule than meets the eye. It seems as if marrying a second time while the first wife is still there - especially without her consent - cannot do anything but cause trouble.
How can this bring any good?
Where is the reward in hurting your spouse and making her feel like less of a woman by marrying again and bringing that wife in her home?
Mirch, these questions are not directed at you necessarily but if you have anything to offer, feel free to.
TLK where there is man...there is sabr...and sabr is not an alien concept...
self restraint teaches you to NOT satisfy every erec****. otherwise there is no difference between a man and janwar/haiwan.
Dekhain Ji, I agree with you in principle. But you cannot deny the fact that Islam allows men to marry 4 times and a pure Sexual desire could very well be a reason and he will not be accountable for that act on the day of judgment.
Only thing he is accountable for if he did not treat all the wives equally.
Mind it, I am not saying that if he did not keep all the wives happy, cause that is not possible.
There is no hadees , no ayat in Quran about seeking permission from existing wives that is why. I do not question wisdom of Allah(SWT) I do question Ahadees though , but not all of them , some of them.
I can only guess a reason my guess would be that no woman in her right mind will want to share a husband and will permit him to go for a second go at it. That can create a fitna for a man who might have a genuine reason to get married second , third or fourth time. Then I can also guess that on the contrary if women would have been allowed to have more than one husbands there will be chaos in the society and there will be many murders every moment. Men tend to go to extremes when it comes to sharing their love for a woman. It is all a guess and my personal opinion. It is prone to flaws.
Allah created men and women , and Allah knows what kind of rules and regulation will be suitable for us.
As far as self control goes , as I said , someone in this day and age will marry more then one woman only if they lose their sanity not self control.
Thank you for taking the time to answer. I dont want to question the Quran. I just dont know what to think of this. If men go to extremes to express love for women...what about women and how much we emotionally invest ourselves into our husbands? Personally, I will never be able to do it but Im sure there are people who can and are okay with it.
"You will never be able to deal justly between wives however much you desire (to do so). But (if you have more than one wife) do not turn altogether away (from one), leaving her in suspense..." (Qur'an 4:129)
so if you do leave her in suspense, to go marry someone else, does that qualify as being unjust??
if it is, then you would have to leave her, making her unhappy...
so yes judging from the nature of women and the statement, permission is part of the whole picture. I would say..keep the whole picture in perspective.
"You will never be able to deal justly between wives however much you desire (to do so). But (if you have more than one wife) do not turn altogether away (from one), leaving her in suspense..." (Qur'an 4:129)
"Taking the example of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) is instructive. He was married to one woman, Khadijah, for twenty-five years. It was only after her death when he had reached the age of fifty that he entered into other marriages to promote friendships, create alliances or to be an example of some lesson to the community; also to show the Muslims how to treat their spouses under different conditions of life.
The Prophet (peace be upon him) was given inspiration from Allah about how to deal with multiple marriages and the difficulties encountered therein. It is not an easy matter for a man to handle two wives, two families, and two households and still be just between the two. No man of reasonable intelligence would enter into this situation without a great deal of thought and very compelling reasons."
Polygamy provides a solution to some of life's real problems...not sexual problems!!
When there is a shortage of men, for example after a devastating war, many women will be unable to find husbands...Mass conversions, most women in that situation, given the option, would rather be a co-wife than no wife...
a replacement for a terminally ill wife..
or a barren wife..
though I have known men is such cases..who didnt get married...
