Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
Wasn't he tried for a murder ?
Did he not make people fool all the time ?
But I guess for us pakis being deceiving is equal to being smart.
And above all, why after getting never heard of power for 5 years, people totally rejected him?? ????
Wasn't that smart after all.
Its little late to learn the lesson, but TRUST ME, honesty is smartest thing to do.
It pays off big time.
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
he was the best politician and leader we had. None and I mean none of your present lot can even come close to him. Yes he had his drawbacks but his positives outweighed his negatives by a mile. If he was alive today Pakistan would not have been in the mess it is and he certainly would not have been an apologist for taliban like some leaders today.
Under his watch, ahmedis were declared kafir and other Islamic law were introduced. You cannot hate Zia in that case for only strengthening the things that Bhutto introduced in the first place. Sure, he might have been "better" than Zia but considering that he was an opportunist, who knows that we might still have madarsas if soviet rule was threatening his power? His grab for power allowed the army high command to be rigid (NAP was willing to negotiate with mujib) that lead to 1971 loss and his nationalization + quota system further destroyed whatever half of the Pakistani economy that was left after E. Pakistan left. He sure had his positives but lets not say that his positives far far faaar outweigh any of his negatives. This personality cult has to stop!
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
Also I think we as a nation were more united when he had one unit system in Pakistan namely West Pakistan and East Pakistan i.e. until Ayub. It helped eliminate ethnic and parochial prejudices. I don't know who is to blame (Yahya or ZAB) but Punjabi, Sindhi, Seraiki, Urdu-speaking etc. nonsense all began after the division of one unit into 4 provinces
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
Only PPP and JI were against restoration of provinces . Even mob attacked at PPP office Hyderabad for this . Bhutto said that if dissolving of one unit is necessary than it should be ten provinces .(West was having ten divisions those day ) . It was our intermediate pass intellectuals who did this all on 1st July 1970 ,swallowed Bahawalpur and made BALUCHISTAN A PROVINCE .You try to knowfrom history . Balochistan was never a country ,state or a province in the history before this date .
http://sphotos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/p480x480/542652_517868381598854_1954156647_n.jpg
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
Under his watch, ahmedis were declared kafir and other Islamic law were introduced. You cannot hate Zia in that case for only strengthening the things that Bhutto introduced in the first place. Sure, he might have been "better" than Zia but considering that he was an opportunist, who knows that we might still have madarsas if soviet rule was threatening his power? His grab for power allowed the army high command to be rigid (NAP was willing to negotiate with mujib) that lead to 1971 loss and his nationalization + quota system further destroyed whatever half of the Pakistani economy that was left after E. Pakistan left. He sure had his positives but lets not say that his positives far far faaar outweigh any of his negatives. This personality cult has to stop!
I dont have any personality cult but outright hatred is not good either. Ahmedis were declared non muslim under his rule that was not right but he was not alone in that, there were many culprits in that drama. So let your hatred not blame him alone. Similarly Abdul Wali Khan was flying BD flag in Dhaka well before BD came into existence. So NAP was equally culprit in breaking up Pakistan yet you try to give credit to them because of blind hatred of Bhutto. He was not solely responsible for the breakup of Paksitan. Agartalla sazish had started well before, yet you hear such naive things like Bhutto stood up and said "Idhaar hum Udhar tum" and Pakistan broke. Was Pakistan that fragile it broike with one speech. There were many other factors the biggest was the army and to cover up its crimes it spun all sorts of stories after 1971 to absolve itself from the mess it created in east Pakistan. His positivies did far outweigh his negatives.
He made a lot of mistakes but to try and blame Zia's stupidity like madrassahs on him is nothing but blind hatred, something which needs to stop as well.
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
I never heard Bhutto saying that he would sit in opposition in deference to mujib winning the elections. The point is that NAP wanted to negotiate with Mujib unlike Bhutto, who had won Sindh and Punjab. Many of those "evil" generaals ended up in PPP like the infamous tikka khan who went to jail for PPP in Zia's tenure. Hatred would be me saying that he wasn't responsible for the nuke program, but what I have said is pure facts, especially quota system and nationalization. Many of his early co-founders (one of them is in ghinwa Bhutto's party, you can find out.. ;) ) left him after they figured the sham of a socialism that he fooled them and took them for a ride. No real land reforms were done when he could easily do socialist nationalization. The reason was that bhutta family itself is a feudal entity and who would want to let go of their slaves?
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
Also I think we as a nation were more united when he had one unit system in Pakistan namely West Pakistan and East Pakistan i.e. until Ayub. It helped eliminate ethnic and parochial prejudices. I don't know who is to blame (Yahya or ZAB) but Punjabi, Sindhi, Seraiki, Urdu-speaking etc. nonsense all began after the division of one unit into 4 provinces
We had Pashtun nationalists and balochis along with sindhis so this is taking a very shallow view of things. I do agree with AP here (for once) that it was wrong to merge bhawalpur into Punjab and that there should have been more provinces. Pakistan didn't have a strong local govt system so more provinces does somewhat solve such a problem. That is another issue how PPP is playing politics with it with the whole junoobi Punjab province that supposedly has mianwali in it as well.
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
I never heard Bhutto saying that he would sit in opposition in deference to mujib winning the elections. The point is that NAP wanted to negotiate with Mujib unlike Bhutto, who had won Sindh and Punjab. Many of those "evil" generaals ended up in PPP like the infamous tikka khan who went to jail for PPP in Zia's tenure. Hatred would be me saying that he wasn't responsible for the nuke program, but what I have said is pure facts, especially quota system and nationalization, so it seems that you are an old timer PPP jiyala. Many of his early co-founders (one of them is in ghinwa Bhutto's party, you can find out.. ;) ) left him after they figured the sham of a socialism that he fooled them and took them for a ride. No real land reforms were done when he could easily do socialist nationalization. The reason was that bhutta family itself is a feudal entity and who would want to let go of their slaves?
Your blind hatred doesnt even allow you to take his name properly, as for ANP they were in cahoots with Mujib. Accusing me of being a jiyala is laughable, is that the best you can do. I am out of here. You can continue. I am surprised you havent blamed him for taliban and the current war in tribal area. If you think hard enough you will find some evidence during his regime which mightl link him to these events. Carry on.
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
For a person culprit in breaking up of Pakistan, we should call him a hero? Take that pseudo patriotism somewhere else. Tons of parties in Pakistan fly their flags instead of the Pakistani flag, so are they traitors as well?
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
Pasha sb
Ehsab bahi,
Call me stupid but I can help you see the problem.
You just said there is no leader like him in current lot.
So please tell me how do you him with other leaders around the world?
What was his calibre.
1-nahro
2-indra
3-rajeev
4-nelson mendela
5-qazafi
6-che guevara ?
7-gandhi
8-manmohan
This can help you identify that you still living in spell he cast on people.
And I know I always talk non-sense.
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
We had Pashtun nationalists and balochis along with sindhis so this is taking a very shallow view of things. I do agree with AP here (for once) that it was wrong to merge bhawalpur into Punjab and that there should have been more provinces. Pakistan didn't have a strong local govt system so more provinces does somewhat solve such a problem. That is another issue how PPP is playing politics with it with the whole junoobi Punjab province that supposedly has mianwali in it as well.
I don't dispute that we need more provinces now. Whoever is responsible for it, provinces should have been carved along administrative not ethnic lines
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
One of the most over rated politician we ever had!
Full of Corruption!
Zia-ul-Haq use full force to dugout any corruption case against him. Mardood also printed 100 pages of white paper, could not find any corruption charges. It is a shame people like you who are neither provide any proof nor perhaps was born in that era. You are just saying what you have heard from your seniors. Link any corruption case during his PM tenure otherwise as OP suggested shut it negative lies on his 44 year death anniversary. Pay due respect to the greatest politician ever Pakistan produced. Present politicians are even not close to his shoes.
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
For a person culprit in breaking up of Pakistan, we should call him a hero? Take that pseudo patriotism somewhere else. Tons of parties in Pakistan fly their flags instead of the Pakistani flag, so are they traitors as well?
As usual full of crape and BS lies. Shame on you.
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
Do remember that he got the ball rolling on the blasphemy law, even if they became much strict in Zia's rule, if you are against that sort of thing. You might not be since many jamatis support Imran khan as well. Pakistan was "liberal" but zamindari was still there and quota system + nationalization was destroying the economy. I think that ultimately bhutta had the qadaffi or Mubarak complex of holier than thou who would not leave power voluntarily.
Lets see quota system still exists even after 44 years of his death. The vision he left was carried on by dictators and non dictators leadership. I understand your pain you know where, but the system exists in different forms all over the world for people belonging to less developed areas or in minorities.
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
Lets see quota system still exists even after 44 years of his death. The vision he left was carried on by dictators and non dictators leadership. I understand your pain you know where, but the system exists in different forms all over the world for people belonging to less developed areas or in minorities.
Quota system was introduced already . It was before his government .
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
Ye sufaid hathi mera Kuch nahi bigad skate! No doubt he was a great leader and speaker but few of his blunder mistakes take him to death row!! And as Capt. said this thread for his some positive efforts not for mistakes. But love to share his mistakes in some other thread.
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
Quota system was introduced already . It was before his government .
Not all jobs were given on quota after private enterprise was nationalized. Sorry try again.
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
Lets see, blasphemy laws still exist after two stints of your BB while taliban were the sons of naseerullah babar and fazlu, the pir of taliban, has been in power with you in the last two govts. Zia has been vindicated as well! 
I can understand your joy in supporting a third class system because you probably got a job through it hence the unconditional love for PPP. Some jobs are given on quota but no where in the west (yes, the wealthy europe and the US where you live) is private enterprise discouraged by nationalization and all jobs given to friends on quota. If you love what bhutto did so much then what are you doing in the anti-socialist capitalist West?
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
To put it simply enough, noone is wrong all the time, and noone is right all the time.
Bhutto did do things that should earn him praise, but on the same token, Zia did a lot of things that should earn him praise. Heck, even Zardari has done a thing or two which one could praise him for.
But from a leadership perspective, Bhutto had a gift which he misused. Had he channeled his energy in the right direction and not lusted after absolute power, he might have been remembered fondly by a lot more people. Most of the ills that PPP blames its opponents or the army for, were Bhutto's initiatives.
Re: Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto
Shame on You Even Zia and his whole machinery ,who killed him ,could not lrvrl any corruption charges on him and you wrote full of corruption with two strokes on your computer . If you can not admit his greatness it is alright , But please , don't try to change the history .
See how much you are burning when I said that he was full of corruption
Now tell me does Imran Khan has any corruption charges NO .......Is he a murderer No......A Bank Defaulter NO
Still you call him Dirty Politician and bllah blah
Then why are you burning when someone calling Bhutto a corrupt politican WHY
Shame on your double standards
If you cannot admit Imran's greatness then you dont need to call him bad too