Your views on terrorism and jihad

Society Religion & Philosophy
21

Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

Thank you, I forget to add that in, this thread is not pro terrorism, we're just analysing others views and opinions, I don't want anyone to go and blow up anything in response to this thread:)

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Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

I must say that your knowledge is very enlightening, but again from what I read in Michael Scheuer's book, Osama took part in the official war between Palestine and Israel, and when that was lost started the Al Qaeda to carry on fighting.

He states in interviews, that he does not want to kill civilians or soldiers, but actually 'bleed America of its money, so it's influence on less well off countries is decreased'

So, to protect Muslims in Palestine, who are unable to protect themselves due to lack of money and forces, would that come under defensive jihad or terrorism.

I would like to add that im non challenging your opinions, but genuinely asking you, as most of the knowledge I have is from the works of Michael Scheuer.

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Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

[quote]
I must say that your knowledge is very enlightening, but again from what I read in Michael Scheuer's book, Osama took part in the official war between Palestine and Israel, and when that was lost started the Al Qaeda to carry on fighting.
[/quote]

Thanks.

Official war between Palestine and Israel? … When that happened? What I know, it happened in 1948 and after that I am unaware of any such war … seems I am ignorant of this happening.

Yes, uprising against occupation did happened on and off and it could still happen anytime. Israel keeps crushing such uprisings but one cannot say that crushing of uprising as ‘war that was lost’.

What I know, bin Ladin is inspired by work of Syed Qutub (of Egypt) and Al-Q is a vechicle Bin Ladin used to promote Syed Qutub work and thinking.

[quote]
He states in interviews, that he does not want to kill civilians or soldiers, but actually 'bleed America of its money, so it's influence on less well off countries is decreased'
[/quote]

For first part, action talks louder then words, and action of A-Q is creating ‘fitna and fisad’ victimising, abusing and killing innocent men, women and children wherever they operate. Actually, A-Q is killing innocent Muslim men, women and children and doing atrocities on Muslims all over Muslim world where they are present, so they cannot say that they do not kill innocent Muslim men, women and children.

As for bleeding American of its money, that is almost impossible task, and show immaturity in thinking. Reason is simple, that is, skirmishes of A-Q cannot bleed USA except make small dents. Anyhow, it maybe dent to USA, but cost to Muslim world is immense financial as well as social.

Just imagine, American economy is several times larger than whole Muslim world and more robust. Economy of many Muslim countries, especially oil rich countries are also under the control of USA. Now, when A-Q try to bleed USA, financial loss to Muslim world is always greater and on top of that there are infrastructure losses, social losses, and life losses.

As for USA, they lose nothing, just few men. Most of their expenses are in wages that go back to USA anyhow. As for arms and ammunition, they make them themselves, and thus their use means more jobs in USA (boosting USA economy). Plus, USA gain influence in area they operate too.

Actually, for every American killed in Afghanistan or Iraq, 100s of Taliban and other Muslims also get killed. For every dollar USA uses in middle-east and Afghan war, Muslim world loses tens or could be 100s of dollars.

So, what A-Q is doing, is bleeding Muslim world then bleeding USA. Actually, AL-Q themselves are killing more Muslims then non-Muslims (certainly 100s of time more than Americans), mostly innocent men, women and children ... and Al-Q is also destroying Muslims wealth everywhere in Muslim world.

[quote]
So, to protect Muslims in Palestine, who are unable to protect themselves due to lack of money and forces, would that come under defensive jihad or terrorism.

I would like to add that im non challenging your opinions, but genuinely asking you, as most of the knowledge I have is from the works of Michael Scheuer.
[/quote]

Unfortunately, I did not read Michael Scheuer’s book neither I would like to comment on his work.

Anyhow, I can try to answer the question you raised (to the best of my knowledge).

War between Palestine and Israel has three elements.

1: Palestinians fighting Israel
2: Muslim states fighting Israel.
3: Non-Palestinian Muslims fighting Israel.

1: First is ‘right of Palestinians’ (Jihad as right)
2: Second is ‘obligatory duty of Muslim states, especially states at the border of Israel’ (jihad as obligation).

If Muslim world is not standing together to fight Israel, then they are not fulfilling their duty, but then, a ruler has to weigh pros and con of waging war (and that is allowed in Islam). If Muslim world thinks they are too weak to fight (as they do not even make their own arms and ammunition, and rely on purchased arsenal ... mostly from those who are in control of Israel ... like USA), then they can wait and try to make themselves strong enough to liberate Palestine (but it seems Muslim world are not even preparing).

3: Third is ‘non-obligatory deed’ of Muslim to join Palestinians in Palestne and help them in fight. (It is Voluntary Jihad, but not duty).

Here I have to add that: Nothing happens without will of Allah, and that means if Palestine is occupied then it is according to will of Allah. Allah might be testing Muslim rulers, Reactions of every Muslim, and also maybe an excuse for bigger future event related to Palestine. Only Allah knows best. As far as Muslims are concerned, we have to keep our belief strong and keep within limits Allah has defined for us.

I know that many in Palestine is suffering so it is not easy to say ... still, one should not over-react, get depress or desperate, as that is what Muslim should do at time of trials and situation in Palestine is also a trail for Muslims (more trial for Palestinians but certainly emotional trial for all Muslims).

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Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

Looking at this ummah, following rules are applied mostly to identify a fighter as jihaidist or terrorist.

For a Brelvi, a fighter is jihadist only if he is Brelvi, otherwise he is a terrorist.
For a Deobandi, a fighter is jihadist only if he is Deobandi, otherwise he is a terrorist.
For a Wahabi, fighter is jihadist only if he is Wahabi, otherwise he is a terrorist.
For a Shia, fighter is jihadist only if he is Shia, otherwise he is a terrorist.

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Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

This is why secularism is better than religious dictatorship of anyone of the above.

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Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

Sharia is not a poetry that could have several interpretations. Infact, scholars are agreed on most things but ego and lack of willingness to bring and accept Islamic system is the problem instead.

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Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

^ Peace ajazali

I used to think this way too. But I have realised that it is not that simple. My Shaykh says, that the majority of the laws of Syria are already compatible with Islamic Shari'ah. I guess, certain things like rib'a in economics and a few other things regarding taxation and the penal system modification would be required. So I think people are getting bogged down with the Shari'ah tag ... And that in turn spurs on the fighting by those fighting for Shari'ah ... I personally am against any type of system that is imposed on people ... For this reason the people need to be part of what happens next.

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Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

Religious or any other form of Dictatorship ... Yes, that is true ... But if people choose this system themselves without any dictatorial influence then that is even better than the secular system.

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Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

Sheikh Ya’qoubi’s fatwas influence those Syrian rebels who are Sufis and moderate Sunnis. He and 60 other leaders and sheikhs have formed a coalition of Sufi rebel groups, called Movement for Building Civilization (تيار بناء الحضارة), which they intend to have operating soon out of an office in Jordan. A draft document (Arabic) containing the principles of the movement is available here.

Rebel groups wanting to join this coalition must sign and agree to adhere to the principles, some of which include:

  1. Removing the regime while not destroying the state—protecting public institutions;
  2. The rejection of revenge, retaliation, and execution during the uprising: keeping the trials of war criminals for after the collapse of the regime and the establishment of a new government;
  3. After the collapse of the regime, rebel groups should cease to carry arms and their members should return to civilian life or join the national army;
  4. All ethnic and religious communities are to be defended as equal citizens under the law;
  5. No ethnic or religious group is to be held responsible for the crimes of the regime;
  6. A future Syrian government must operate according to a separation of judicial, legislative, and executive powers;
  7. The future government must be a democracy of political multiplicity and the 1950 Constitution should be in effect during the interim period until a new parliament is elected and a new constitution is agreed upon.
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Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

Brother ijaz.

This is not correct.barelvi scholars including Moulana anoorani considered afghan jihad including taliban one as jihad and supported it.

Deobandis openly support wahabis and other jihadi outfits in afghanistan/syria/palestian etc.

Wahabi supported taliban although they are pro deobandis hanafi muqallids.

i dont want to go into details ... thora ko zida janain. :)

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Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

when you approved the post(in PA about Maulana muudoodi and JI) of psyah that JI people are thugs then you forget that Deobandis of pakistan pray for the success for Maulana fazal ur rehman?

I agree , thora ko zida janain, and you know that i am not in habbit of Mullah bashing...
i dont want to go into details either, otherwise it would damage our cause...

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Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

Brother i may have overlooked that part of the post, can you pin point me the post? secondly i am not denying the differences but it is not that all are like this. Why not look at the bright side while being aware of our short comings. May be we both are on same page on this. :)

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Re: Your views on terrorism and jihad

It is technically an organization, but is now so disrupted by anti-terrorist activity across the world that it is not really capable of operating.

What's more dangerous is that it is also a brand - groups can take advantage of the brand to position themselves as part of a global "resistance" movement.

For example, the various groups in North Africa, Syria, and Iraq that have pledged their allegiance to Al Qaeda. These groups don't take operational instructions from Al Qaeda - in fact, several news stories have come out where it had emerged that Al-Qaeda's leader Ayman Al-Zwahiri keeps writing frustrated letters to them complaining that they are not doing the things he wants to.

However, these groups are able to tap into the Al-Qaeda brand name to help draw recruits and funding. In return, Al-Qaeda gains from them by being able to claim their results as its own, despite its own inability to run terrorist activity anymore, and thus still appear relevant and active.