Wrong slogans are now hurting Pakistan

[hanibal]

I see what you are saying. That the ideas and ambitions embedded in the slogans are good. The implementation of those ideas and ambitions is bad (obviously due to bad leadership).

Correct?

There are few problems that are evident in your theory.

FYI. Islam DOES NOT need a country to be proved or disproved for its divinity or other characteristics.

Remember that when Islam was accepted as a divine religion, there was no Muslim state for 1000 miles in any direction of Makkah.

So anyone who tries to say that Islam needs a country to be proven right, is mis-informed at best.

Countries are not laboratories to test a religion and prove anything about any religion.

Countries are there for the people to have peace and prosperity. If you can provide these two things using something as trivial a religion as perhaps called "Dirt-ism", who gives a hoot?

How many Pakistanis and other immigrants drown in the ugly waters around Europe, just to smuggle in at any cost.

Are they going to Europe for some laboratory action to prove one thing or the other?

No! These people do not care if there is Islam, Christianity, Buddhism, Jainism, etc. etc. People look for peace and prosperity.

That's all.

That's why my friend our slogan for Pakistan ka matlad kiya is flawed too.

Again no one cares about the literal meanings.

The point is to look at the impact of this dimwit slogan on Pakistani peace and prosperity.

If Nukie bum is helping, then keep the slogan. If on the other hand it results in more chaos and less prosperity, then dump it.

And be careful about using the words like "Determination". Every bank robber has determination to rob and thus follows his slogan or motto of robbery.

Presence of determination is not a proof, the end result is a proof. And pakistanis ended up "literally" eating grass and dirt due to the fallout of nukie bum.

And if you don't know about the economic fallout immediately following the bums, then perhaps you need to read a bit more.

You need to re-check you knowledge on Islamic history...

Yes you can say that Islam never advocates for a country neither does it have any kind of influence on any human being.... and accordingly you can also say that Hitler is still Alive and Jakson was an Alien etc etc.. ofcourse none of them is true...

Just for your information, the Islamic State of Madina was established in the life time of Prophet Mohammad (SAW), The same state did signed treaty with Meccans, the same state took over Khyber from Jews and the same state did attacked and took over Makkah, when Meccans violate the terms of the treaty.

So your saying that Islam does not require a state is just your ignorance to Islam and its teaching, who knows tomorrow you comeup with some kind of theory that Islam is not a religion by itself it is only a belief... I am not here to lecture you on Islam, if you are Muslim, then it is your duty to go through Quran and Hadees to understand the true essence of Islam. Period

Yes, you can say that, you may live in a place where prostitution is legal, where interest/usury have dominated each and every part of the life, yes then self-respect become a synoym of self-interest, yes in that society/mentality the slogan of eating grass but not bowing seems ridiculous... so i can understand that why it seems to be ridiculous to you... I don't think i need to say anything more on this...

[FairyTale]

Re: Wrong slogans are now hurting Pakistan

I wonder if slogans are wrong or ppl mentality??? In my opinion its the latter one. Change that first.

[koozager]

@FairyTale

I wonder if slogans are wrong or ppl mentality??? In my opinion its the latter one. Change that first.

Thats what I understand to be Burqas intention or the eventuality of what he/she wants.

How else do you propose to change peoples minds ?

I mean just a slogan is too simplistic to do much but its a start.

[FairyTale]

Re: Wrong slogans are now hurting Pakistan

Education system needs to be changed. Our text books are not in line with our social and political and even religious requirements.

[Captain_FT]

Re: Wrong slogans are now hurting Pakistan

^Yes FT ur right most of the things are wrong everywhere

:)

[Captain_FT]

@FairyTale

I wonder if slogans are wrong or ppl mentality??? In my opinion its the latter one. Change that first.

Infact these are the saazish and evil plans to detrack the nation towards the enemy thoughts

[Entisar]

I see where you are coming from.

and I can understand from where you are comming ??
and which socities and backgrounds you have grown in ?

[burqaposhx]

@hanibal

...... Just for your information, the Islamic State of Madina was established in the life time of Prophet Mohammad (SAW), The same state did signed treaty with Meccans, the same state took over Khyber from Jews and the same state did attacked and took over Makkah, when Meccans violate the terms of the treaty. ........

Hanibal bro, do you read at least once before you post?

Are you in some Grade -1 kids' discussion that you forget in few moments what you posted earlier? And then pick up kiddy book of Islamic history and start discussing some of the selective stuff?

It was you bro who said

---

The purpose of the [Pakistani] state was to show/prove to the rest of the world that Islam is true divine religion .

This is utterly false and pakka Maulana talk from a dark medieval hojra.

Remember Islam's divinity and truthfulness CAME FIRST and was fully ACCEPTED,

BEFORE

Any Islamic state was formed be it in Madina or elsewhere.

It is sad that many of the examples from the early Islamic history are parroted over and over without an iota of their context or siaqo sabaak.

FYI. Early Islamic history was focused on civilizing buddoos and desert nomads who didn't have any idea of how to behave in an urban setting.

Fast forward 1400+ years and many parts of Pakistan are no long buddoos, instead they live in cities that are much much advanced compared to the tent-dwelling lifestyles.

People who shout Islamism at the top of their lungs fail to understand that Islam's basic tenants are not head chopping or kora-bazi or even invading other countries, instead the the earliest Islam (as practiced by Mohammad pbuh and his companions rah) was based on some very simple rules.

1. Speak truth - such bolo
2. Be honest and trustworthy - amanat main khianat na karo
3. Be tolerant and humble - doosron say acha salook karo, or unki ghalti muaf karo
4. USE YOUR HEAD - apni aqal istimaal karo.

Sadly the Islamists do away with these 4 BASIC BASIC BASIC BASIC tenets, and instead try to erect the false and Ibleesi rules for the exploitation and murdering of innocent Pakistanis.

And if anyone of you is in doubt about the hijacking of Islam by Maudoodi and other Maulanas, just read what happened in the riots of 1950s all the way to the what Talibleesis have been doing to Pakistanis masses after raping and plundering Afghani masses.

[hanibal]

@""burqaposhx""

Hanibal bro, do you read at least once before you post?

Are you in some Grade -1 kids’ discussion that you forget in few moments what you posted earlier? And then pick up kiddy book of Islamic history and start discussing some of the selective stuff?

It was you bro who said

---

The purpose of the [Pakistani] state was to show/prove to the rest of the world that Islam is true divine religion .

This is utterly false and pakka Maulana talk from a dark medieval hojra.

Remember Islam’s divinity and truthfulness CAME FIRST and was fully ACCEPTED,

BEFORE

Any Islamic state was formed be it in Madina or elsewhere.

It is sad that many of the examples from the early Islamic history are parroted over and over without an iota of their context or siaqo sabaak.

FYI. Early Islamic history was focused on civilizing buddoos and desert nomads who didn’t have any idea of how to behave in an urban setting.

what a guy you are, accusing me for the stuff you have done.. you are the one who said
.

Remember that when Islam was accepted as a divine religion, there was no Muslim state for 1000 miles in any direction of Makkah.

but i guess with the twisted mentality you have, you sometimes forget that what you have posted, above was answer for the statement of yours which clearly says that it is coming for the somebody who want to kill or at least try to limit Islam..

@""burqaposhx""

Fast forward 1400+ years and many parts of Pakistan are no long buddoos, instead they live in cities that are much much advanced compared to the tent-dwelling lifestyles.

Have you even bothered to read what i wrote!!! or it is just your to make comments without reading them… I said, and it is the same posts which you red, i’ll make it more simple for you, The State of Islam was established in the same principal under which the state of Madina ( the first state of Islam) was established, a Muslim State, for the believers where they can practice their religion without any fear, where the complete code of Islam will be the answer for problem man-kind have created due to the things which has been prohibted by Islam… usury, adultery etc comes to mind…

Now tell me, is it not possible to live without interest or Aduletry, is this the reason people like you oppose the very idea of Pakistan… the so-called intellects who have accepted the dominance of the false idealogy, culture and religion will definetly bring these and other prohibted issues in the line of personal affairs..

One more thing, are you telling me the 1400+ year old religion is no longer valid and it should be limited to certain aspects if not nullified, i believe you and the people of you mind-set do believe the same idealogy… and yes in result we get talibans… you are no better than them…

@""burqaposhx""

People who shout Islamism at the top of their lungs fail to understand that Islam’s basic tenants are not head chopping or kora-bazi or even invading other countries, instead the the earliest Islam (as practiced by Mohammad pbuh and his companions rah) was based on some very simple rules.

1. Speak truth - such bolo
2. Be honest and trustworthy - amanat main khianat na karo
3. Be tolerant and humble - doosron say acha salook karo, or unki ghalti muaf karo
4. USE YOUR HEAD - apni aqal istimaal karo.

Sadly the Islamists do away with these 4 BASIC BASIC BASIC BASIC tenets, and instead try to erect the false and Ibleesi rules for the exploitation and murdering of innocent Pakistanis.

And if anyone of you is in doubt about the hijacking of Islam by Maudoodi and other Maulanas, just read what happened in the riots of 1950s all the way to the what Talibleesis have been doing to Pakistanis masses after raping and plundering Afghani masses

Islamists or should i say, so-called islamists which are the one who have no understanding of religion or who drive the relgious interpretation as per their interests do what were you are saying.. and i do not call them Islamists as i do not want to have them in line of the true Islamists, who lead their life as per Sunnah of the prophet, again these are not the one who pose themselves as Islamists as Islam is very much against the Show-off kind of stuff…

Another Problem is their which is often exploited by the enemies of our religion is drived from following the tradition and considering their called leaders either the best being or the worst being..

none of them represent the essence of Islam, which gives every one their right of speech, ofcourse with the limitation of Quran and Hadees, nor does any one tolerate each other and the result is in front of us…

again i think you represent the extermist of other side, you are a taliban of otherside who equally respobsible for the chaos in Pakistan.. and is using other extremist to propogate their own mind-set…

Now do answer the question… i have raised above and answer will end the discussion.

[Entisar]

@FairyTale

I wonder if slogans are wrong or ppl mentality??? In my opinion its the latter one. Change that first.

You are right , Slogans are Never Wronge as they Emerge from the Hearts of the Nations with true spirits.

But later on Traitors and Clever leaders/Rulers Starts the Masses Exploitation in the Name of these Slogans.

The Thread initiator appears to be suffering from some Pschylogical Depression and Extreme SENSE of Deprivation.

[Entisar]

@burqaposhx

Hanibal bro, do you read at least once before you post?

Are you in some Grade -1 kids' discussion that you forget in few moments what you posted earlier? And then pick up kiddy book of Islamic history and start discussing some of the selective stuff?

It was you bro who said

---

The purpose of the [Pakistani] state was to show/prove to the rest of the world that Islam is true divine religion .

This is utterly false and pakka Maulana talk from a dark medieval hojra.

Remember Islam's divinity and truthfulness CAME FIRST and was fully ACCEPTED,

BEFORE

Any Islamic state was formed be it in Madina or elsewhere.

It is sad that many of the examples from the early Islamic history are parroted over and over without an iota of their context or siaqo sabaak.

FYI. Early Islamic history was focused on civilizing buddoos and desert nomads who didn't have any idea of how to behave in an urban setting.

Fast forward 1400+ years and many parts of Pakistan are no long buddoos, instead they live in cities that are much much advanced compared to the tent-dwelling lifestyles.

People who shout Islamism at the top of their lungs fail to understand that Islam's basic tenants are not head chopping or kora-bazi or even invading other countries, instead the the earliest Islam (as practiced by Mohammad pbuh and his companions rah) was based on some very simple rules.

1. Speak truth - such bolo
2. Be honest and trustworthy - amanat main khianat na karo
3. Be tolerant and humble - doosron say acha salook karo, or unki ghalti muaf karo
4. USE YOUR HEAD - apni aqal istimaal karo.

Sadly the Islamists do away with these 4 BASIC BASIC BASIC BASIC tenets, and instead try to erect the false and Ibleesi rules for the exploitation and murdering of innocent Pakistanis.

And if anyone of you is in doubt about the hijacking of Islam by Maudoodi and other Maulanas, just read what happened in the riots of 1950s all the way to the what Talibleesis have been doing to Pakistanis masses after raping and plundering Afghani masses.

Go and Consult with some Pchycological Doctor , your sayings appears BERY BERY ODD among the Members of GS Forums.

[burqaposhx]

@hanibal

........

Now tell me, is it not possible to live without interest or Aduletry, is this the reason people like you oppose the very idea of Pakistan........

Let me clarify something specific to Pak history.

People who were Mullahs and talked about Islamic state,

WERE

AGAINST the very idea of Pakistan.

So do not try to rewrite the history of Pak.

It was the secular nationalists like Jinnah who led the Pak movement. No big name Mullah like Maudoodi or Azad ever ever supported Pak.

Now coming back to your question.

You say if "you can live without adultery and usuary". Well that is your choice, why are you asking this question to begin with?

Do not go after women and you can certainly live without adultery. Can't you?
Pakistan is a country of 170 million people with roughly 85 million females and 85 million men.

It is next to impossible to have web cam in every house and every bedroom and every shop to see if one in 85 million woman is not committing adultery with one in 85 million man.

even if it was possible that's not your business. You want to live without adultery, then do not cross the line (if you know what I mean).

then you say if you can (or cannot live) with usury. Again it is your choice. Do not take interest even if it is offered to you. And you are safe.

But you cannot and shouldn't set up web cams in every house and every shop and every street to see that one in 170 million population is not taking usury. That's their aaamal and they will be answerable on the day of judgement.

even if it was possible to monitor every man in 170 million population, that's not your business to see if he is taking usury. You want to live without usury, then do not cross the line (if you know what I mean).

[hanibal]

Re: Wrong slogans are now hurting Pakistan

^^ U r good in looking here and there, not talking on the issue but every other crap... do you have a university degree on this or it is god-gifted skill.

My Question was,

[QUOTE]

One more thing, are you telling me the 1400+ year old religion is no longer valid and it should be limited to certain aspects if not nullified

[/QUOTE]

Have you missed it, which i believe you have as you select half statements to right replies of your desire... this strategy is used all the people who propogate false ideology or believes.. so please answer the question i have raised, your answer will help alot to end the discussion

[Khehkeshan]

@hanibal

^^ U r good in looking here and there, not talking on the issue but every other crap... do you have a university degree on this or it is god-gifted skill.

My Question was,

Have you missed it, which i believe you have as you select half statements to right replies of your desire... this strategy is used all the people who propogate false ideology or believes.. so please answer the question i have raised, your answer will help alot to end the discussion

The ideology of mixing religion with politics has failed in pakistan. Terrorism is a direct result of this.

[hanibal]

Re: Wrong slogans are now hurting Pakistan

^^^The Ideology was never ever implemented, yes the ideology of mixing ethinc differences have failed for sure and the result is terrorism in Karachi!!!!

[Panthr3ss]

i agree with burqaposhx.changing the slogan to something more loving n positive will definitely make us more accepting n positive n we'll start accepting people from other ethnicities n religions n stop killing or terrorizing them or forcefully convert them
btw having a secular point of view doesnt mean u cant pray so
Pakistan ka matlab kiya, piyar mohabbat or dua is beautiful

[burqaposhx]

@hanibal

My Question was,

One more thing, are you telling me the 1400+ year old religion is no longer valid and it should be limited to certain aspects if not nullified ...

I suggest numbering or bolding your questions that you need a comment on. Otherwise any statement with question mark could be mistaken as the real question.

Similar to your other questions, this question too, should be asked and answered by your ownself first.

Look around and no "Islamic" state in the world comes even close to providing justice, tolerance, peace, prosperity, and scientific and educational development.

The rot has been ever present for the last 500+ years, if not longer.

And the center of Islam aka the region of Saudi Arabia has not produced a single notable scientific or innovative work for at least 1000+ years (if not more).

The center of Shia Islam is equally corrupt and only good at terrorizing Iranians and others.

With a couple of exception like Dubai and Malaysia, the rest are the wretched places even when some of them are blessed with natural or human resources.

Mind you! Duabi and Malaysia cannot pass your gold standard test of "Adultery and Usury".

And still you are making statements and putting wild questions?

**
Have you not seen, heard, and felt this world yet?

Go forth and use your imagination. It is not a to use ones God given senses to figure out what are the wrongs and the rights with so called Islamic world.

**

And when you do start your long awaited search for the truth, here is a hint.

You cannot fit a square peg in the round hole. And if you try too hard, then you will destroy the peg or the hole or both.

Similarly molding and stretching religions to fit the politics destroys either the religion, or the politics, or both.

[hanibal]

@burqaposhx

I suggest numbering or bolding your questions that you need a comment on. Otherwise any statement with question mark could be mistaken as the real question.

Similar to your other questions, this question too, should be asked and answered by your ownself first.

Look around and no "Islamic" state in the world comes even close to providing justice, tolerance, peace, prosperity, and scientific and educational development.

The rot has been ever present for the last 500+ years, if not longer.

And the center of Islam aka the region of Saudi Arabia has not produced a single notable scientific or innovative work for at least 1000+ years (if not more).

The center of Shia Islam is equally corrupt and only good at terrorizing Iranians and others.

With a couple of exception like Dubai and Malaysia, the rest are the wretched places even when some of them are blessed with natural or human resources.

Mind you! Duabi and Malaysia cannot pass your gold standard test of "Adultery and Usury".

And still you are making statements and putting wild questions?

Have you not seen, heard, and felt this world yet?

Go forth and use your imagination. It is not a to use ones God given senses to figure out what are the wrongs and the rights with so called Islamic world.

And when you do start your long awaited search for the truth, here is a hint.

You cannot fit a square peg in the round hole. And if you try too hard, then you will destroy the peg or the hole or both.

Similarly molding and stretching religions to fit the politics destroys either the religion, or the politics, or both.

I asked a simple question, a simple sentence sayin yes or no will do, please save urself some energy and try to answer in simple terms... i am not asking about Dubai or Malaysia or any of the states of country, i am asking about u.. so ur straight answer will do, failing to comply may suggest that you are not serious in the discussion and are a vicitm of propoganda and saying things which you have no knowledge of... for ur ref. iam pasting the question again

[QUOTE]

One more thing, are you telling me the 1400+ year old religion is no longer valid and it should be limited to certain aspects if not nullified

[/QUOTE]

[afishcurry]

Re: Wrong slogans are now hurting Pakistan

Slogans are powerless... Stop treating other provinces as some kind of colony and you will be fine.

Even in India north-east states are neglected and that's the reason we have problmes there.

[burqaposhx]

@Panthr3ss

i agree with burqaposhx.changing the slogan to something more loving n positive will definitely make us more accepting n positive n we'll start accepting people from other ethnicities n religions n stop killing or terrorizing them or forcefully convert them btw having a secular point of view doesnt mean u cant pray so Pakistan ka matlab kiya, piyar mohabbat or dua is beautiful

Thank you.

You have correctly suggested that by "changing the slogan to something more loving n positive will definitely make us more accepting n positive n we'll start accepting people from other ethnicities n religions n stop killing or terrorizing them or forcefully convert them"

It is so true that if you have "a secular point of view doesnt mean u cant pray", or you can't be a God fearing person.

**
Pakistan ka matlab kiya, piyar mohabbat or dua

**