How things are viewed differently in philosophy then in our daily life?
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
Never ... How can they be?
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
An employee loyal to an organization implies he has insecurities in his mind?
I mean what psychology has to say on this.
why employees are supposed to be loyal to organizations?
what makes an employee loyal?
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
An employee loyal to an organization implies he has insecurities in his mind?
I mean what psychology has to say on this. why employees are supposed to be loyal to organizations? what makes an employee loyal?
Promoting employee loyalty is modern mental slavery. It's only in the employers' best interests most of the time if not always. They will do a thorough job convincing you that the company and everything it has to offer is really, really good for you. But luckily, employee loyalty today is not as prolonged and approx. 5 years is considered pretty loyal in terms of tenure.
Organizational psychology will tell you loyal employees are more productive and contribute significantly more than non-committal employees. Many things make employees loyal: the company's mantra, etc but the most important, I think, is how good of a job they do to make you feel valued. Doesn't matter if they actually do or don't but if they make you feel valued, you're gonna stick around much, much longer and buy in to whatever it is they're selling to you.
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
An employee loyal to an organization implies he has insecurities in his mind?
I mean what psychology has to say on this. why employees are supposed to be loyal to organizations? what makes an employee loyal?
Peace ajazali
I think you mean ethics rather than philosophy ... I think you are looking for the dichotomy if any that exists between the norm in the modern world and the ethics we allege to attach ourselves to ... Please clarify ...
Basically this is a question about Principles vs Practice
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
An employee loyal to an organization implies he has insecurities in his mind?
I mean what psychology has to say on this. why employees are supposed to be loyal to organizations? what makes an employee loyal?
Or on the other side of the coin one could say the employee who is loyal does not want to be Namak Haraam!
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
Or on the other side of the coin one could say the employee who is loyal does not want to be Namak Haraam!
On the other side of coin he is setting a bad example and helping his employer pressurizing other employees to work like him.
So the employees who don’t do flattery, don’t stay in office for late hours, work according to the contract only and are not in habit of "exceeding the expectations" of employer, are Namak Haraam?
Any employee has above said properties (which are fair and just to possess) will not be considered as loyal.
it is either employee's incompetency or employer's "persuasion" that make an employee loyal.
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
Peace ajazali
I think you mean ethics rather than philosophy ... I think you are looking for the dichotomy if any that exists between the norm in the modern world and the ethics we allege to attach ourselves to ... Please clarify ...
You know that originally, philosphical discourses were used to decide on things and basis for making decisions was ethics. But modern day philosophy which i think is pirated form of philosophy by westerners, almost have nothing to do with ethics. On top of it, they have revised the definition of ethic.
[QUOTE]
Basically this is a question about Principles vs Practice
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In a manner of speaking, yes.
then it look like, principles are lost and practices followed from what is popular perception?
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
Philosophy is not monolithic.
Moreover, philosophy is not necessarily separate from our daily life. When we stop and examine what we're looking at, it becomes philosophy.
Ethics is a part of philosophy.
A person is "loyal" to a company because he has entered to a sort of social contract with the company. In exchange for his labor, the company is paying him and providing certain benefits. Now if he can get better pay from somewhere else, that loyalty doesn't really mean much.
Loyalty is the Lakers making Kobe the highest paid player in the league until he retires, despite the fact that he's 35 and coming off 2 injuries now. But the guy can still fill up the arena, so it isn't that bad of a deal and when you look at what he's done for the Lakers in the last 18 years, it's okay to overpay.
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
Loyalty of employees to their employing organisations can come from a number of motivating impetuses.
a) Respect and admiration for employer
b) Fear of losing job
c) Love of the job
d) For the good pay
e) Alignment of job's greater impact on society and their own personal beliefs.
f) Out of a sense of duty to the employment contract (religiously a contract is amanah)
g) To earn respect for some ultimate purpose (i.e. As a stepping stone for another purpose)
h) All of the above
Some people confuse loyalty with blind patriotism ...
Other principles should make a person consider not going with the flow of their employing organisation when:
a) They are asked to do something forbidden
b) They are required to make compromises in things which should take higher priority e.g. Prayer on time.
c) They are only rewarded for effort that surpasses their contractual obligations and not simply for meeting their contractual requirements.
d) Hiding a bad practice.
e) When people ask you to stay quiet because it may harm their position, but it also harms the integrity of the organisation.
and so on ...
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
welcome kaka ji
could you please post one or more excerpts you liked most from this book?
u_ahmad and psyah i shall reply soon.
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
You know that originally, philosphical discourses were used to decide on things and basis for making decisions was ethics. But modern day philosophy which i think is pirated form of philosophy by westerners, almost have nothing to do with ethics. On top of it, they have revised the definition of ethic.
In a manner of speaking, yes. then it look like, principles are lost and practices followed from what is popular perception?
Philosophy defines ethics and not the other way around. Perhaps we are confusing that with morality. Morality plays a role in ethics and our definition of that has changed significantly. When it comes to the workplace, there are ethics involved but being ethical in a company may or may not necessarily mean loyalty. Sometimes it is an obligation by default. So now can you have ethical employees that are disloyal?
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
Hmmm… Difficult at the moment since I do not have the book with me right now.
Anyways, the name of the book is inspiration from Chomsky’s book with the same title. Chomsky talks about how mass media moulds individual’s thinking and particularly political and economic decisions e.g. consumption decisions. Excerpts from Manufacturing Consent, Noam Chomsky interviewed by various interviewers
. This thread is a very good example of Chomsky’s arguments: http://www.paklinks.com/gs/all-views/636333-marius-the-giraffe.html
Michael Burawoy actually spent a year working as labour at a factory and observing behaviors. His conclusions, from what I remember, were that capitalists use behavioral psychology and induce people to work for them or in your words be ‘loyal’ to their company through a system of control/rewards/punishment (need not be monetary) much in the way mass media controls peoples’ thinking. Such behavior may or may not make economic sense.
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
Philosophy defines ethics and not the other way around. Perhaps we are confusing that with morality. Morality plays a role in ethics and our definition of that has changed significantly. When it comes to the workplace, there are ethics involved but being ethical in a company may or may not necessarily mean loyalty. Sometimes it is an obligation by default.** So now can you have ethical employees that are disloyal?**
If philosophy defines ethics and ethics are not standard/default values then that means ethics do not exist at all. And, ethics is what we are told "pervasively". What you say?
I am not confusing ethics with morality. In fact you cannot escape from morality when you talk about "good". Anyway, that is another story.
I got what you mean by ethical employee is loyal that if an employee is ethical he is loyal by default but, I disagree as this is not the criteria for your employer to consider you loyal.
As you said the definition of ethics have changed significantly, it is an ethical obligation of an employee to "understand the criticality" of business situation and fulfill the company's "fair" demands of putting extra efforts in order to save the business?
It is employee always who has to accommodate and compromise in term of putting efforts. And employers compensate employees with money, lolzz.
This how you think an employee is ethical and loyal?
For me, an employee is being ethical If he reuses to accommodate the employer’s request of working extra hours or “exceeding the expectations” as he has the right to accept or reject. But you know what will happen to that employee if he refuses that "request"?
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
Worldly ideas/norms mean kind of materialistic way of looking at things.
and, we are confusing 'not being loyal' with dishonesty or kamchori or disloyality as untrustworthiness.
being loyal to company is a mindset. if you dont posses this mindset and are ok/good to your company in terms of productivity that doesnt mean you are dishonest or untrustworthy.
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
The way I look at it is where there is a contract then having loyalty is required Islamically ... How you define "loyalty" is another matter it should be specific to the contract ... So as azajali is saying if the contractual requirements are being met then that is loyalty ... but if above and beyond that is being required then one ought to have his contract modified or at the very least paid overtime for putting in extra work.
For me it is clear cut ... The bosses can do what they like I will do what I feel is best for my role and provide a suitable level of input - If I feel I am doing more than that then I will ask for more.
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
**The way I look at it is where there is a contract then having loyalty is required Islamically ... **How you define "loyalty" is another matter it should be specific to the contract ... So as azajali is saying if the contractual requirements are being met then that is loyalty ... but if above and beyond that is being required then one ought to have his contract modified or at the very least paid overtime for putting in extra work.
For me it is clear cut ... The bosses can do what they like I will do what I feel is best for my role and provide a suitable level of input - If I feel I am doing more than that then I will ask for more.
Loyality is not required Islamically i think, as it is a kind of mindset you dont have control over. however, honesty with your master is required.
Well that was not the point but if want to discuss then let me know if you remember the rights of a 'servant' Islamically?
are modern business paradigms complying with those guidelines about responsibilities of the 'masters' toward servants?
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
The way I look at it is where there is a contract then having loyalty is required Islamically ... How you define "loyalty" is another matter it should be specific to the contract ... So as azajali is saying if the contractual requirements are being met then that is loyalty ... but if above and beyond that is being required then one ought to have his contract modified or at the very least paid overtime for putting in extra work.
For me it is clear cut ... The bosses can do what they like I will do what I feel is best for my role and provide a suitable level of input - If I feel I am doing more than that then I will ask for more.
bolded is the key.
Considering what your employer thinks loyality is, if your employer 'request' you to work extra hours and you will be paid, do have a choice?
Re: worldly notions/concepts and philosophical viewpoint
bolded is the key. Considering what your employer thinks loyality is, if your employer 'request' you to work extra hours and you will be paid, do have a choice?
Yes ... Because the contract is not binding for overtime ... But I personally don't put my employer in a position to where my targets are not achieved ... If they aren't then I offer to work extra ... Of course if the workload is too high I'll let them know that too.