Women - brainless and impious ?

[diwana]

Re: Women - brainless and impious ?

Articles and FAQs about Islam, Muslims, Allah, Muhammad (pbuh), Quran, Hadith, Woman, Fiqh and Fatwa.

This article shows some psychiatric basis of the statement in Quran.

[PyariCgudia]

@psyah

Peace PyariCgudia

I but only agree with you in principle, but we cannot state this hadith is weak in the sense of non-authentic. We can say that it might be incomplete, but I have provided the complete context here already, this was not from me but taken from the exegesis of scholars who have analysed this narration with respect to other hadith. There is another hadith same time on Eid in the masjid and RasoolAllah (SAW) is addressing the women in ‘jest’ behind the arm of Bilal (RA) and he says things to them so that they start giving from their jewelry.

Authenticity is determined by the strict criteria of transmission … it is multiple and supported by other hadith, however what we can say is that WE may not have understood it.

In the case where other hadith are presented and using the other concepts here one is not being apologetic about the hadith rather simply explaining the correct way it should be understood.

Some hadith although sahih are actually called gharib which means that it is difficult to gauge the meaning from them without consulting other hadith around the same issue, it does not make them less authentic. So the problem is not with the early narrators, rather it is with how we understand those sayings in today’s removed mindsets.

You contradict yourself here so much. The hadith is in total opposition to the principles the Quran puts forth. God did not create women to have them belittled. That would be ridiculous. Therefore, the interpretation as has been stated about these hadith is totally inaccurate. These hadith should have been tossed day one.

[nasirahmed]

Re: Women - brainless and impious ?

i think this hadith has not been translated properly.arabic is a complex language and while translating it the choice of words can change the meaning.
if this hadith is in bukhari shareef then it has to be authentic.psyah pls quote the reference if u can.

[nasirahmed]

Re: Women - brainless and impious ?

waisay larkio mai psychiatric problems bohot hoti hain.its a medical fact.mood swing.isi liay contract likh lena chaiay kio kay jo kaam woh pehlay kerna chaati hai woo mood swing ki waja say baad mai inkar bhi ker saktin hai.

[AllahkaBanda]

@PyariCgudia

People will make all kinds of excuses to make something implausible appear plausible, instead of admitting it might have been a weak hadith to begin with, or misinterpreted by the narrarator, or certain comments by the Prophet may have been left out or forgotten by those who heard the original statement which clouds the current interpretation of the hadith.

and the heretics will do everything to pretend as Muslims.

The burden is on your shoulder to prove that the hadith is in fact weak instead of just throwing random handicapped arguments. Mere statements do not prove anything.

@PyariCgudia

But then that would be admitting that the Hadith are a collection of knoweldge tainted with human-human transmission as oppose to Glorious direct revelation from God via an angel.

well, too bad for you because he wasn’t an angel who came to your home and said: “gudi, here is a copy of the Qur’an” rather the Qur’an has been narrated to us by same men who narrated these ahadith. The reason why you reject one but find no problem with other seems be nothing but “why is Islam not in accordance with my desires and what my west master is pleased with”. And thank you for accepting that you reject the Qur’an.

good day

@pysch

as-salamu alaykum

with all due respect brother, this was uncalled for, specially when you put forward your own interpretation while you are not qualified for it.

[Das_Reich]

Re: Women - brainless and impious ?

asalam alaikum

is this hadith explained further by ibn hajar in Fath ul Bari ?

[AllahkaBanda]

as-salamu alaykum

akh Das, I haven’t come across Imam ibn Hajr’s (rahimahullah) sharh on this hadith; however, here is the best explanation I have read:

The best way to understand this hadeeth is through understanding what the word “Naqesatu” actually means. This can only be done through understanding its opposite meaning. So, here is some notes about this Hadeeth:

• Naqs (imperfect, deficiency, incomplete) is the opposite of Kamal (perfection)

• Perfection is used when a matter is not fully completed or fulfilled. So, Naqs means here that there is part of something is not being fulfilled.

• The two areas which Naqs applies to, as specified in the hadeeth, are : A’ql and religion ( I kept the word A’ql as it is in Arabic because the translation is wrong)

• Naqs in this hadeeth does not refer to the A’ql itself as an entity but rather refers to the acts of A’ql. So, the meaning of this that is, women do not fully fulfill all acts of A’ql ( witnessing) and all acts of deen (praying and fasting in menses). This is supported by the words of Allah’s Messenger who explained Naqs by mentioning the acts that women are not allowed to fulfill in each area (A’ql and deen).

• The offered used translation of “A’ql” is inaccurate because intelligence indicates a level of smartness which is not what was meant with (A’ql) in this Hadeeth.

• The Naqs of A’ql means in this hadeeth: "The inability to perform all acts of A’ql " This inability is due to the nature of women who are distinguished with special criterion as an emotional creature who can be affected by emotions. keep in mind, emotions are not limited to love only because its meaning is wider. there is fear, anger, hate, love and so forth.

• The statement of Allah’s Messenger applies on every woman. although, it might happen that you find women who are more reasoning and self-controlled when it comes to her emotions than men. Yet, this does not change that such the nature of women in general and does not change the ruling.

Summing it up:

This hadeeth does not mean in anyhow belittlement of women because this hadeeth is not documenting ranking of men and women but rather explaining acts that cannot be fulfilled by women. Furthermore, the label of “naqs” is addressing the acts that are related to A’ql and religion not the A’ql and religion as entities. Besides the fact that A’ql, as a word comes in different meaning and in this particular hadeeth it does not refer to a level of smartness but rather to not fulfilling all its acts. that’s why discounting women’s witness from being a full witness describes her inability to fulfill all acts of A’ql because witnessing is part of acts of A’ql since it requires making a reasoning judgment.

The nature of women is obviously differ from the nature of men. Each have been distinguished with a special criterion i.e. women are known to be soft, emotional, physically weaker than men and more sympathetic. while men are known to be firm in decessions, less emotional, sensitive, physically stronger than women, and less sympathetic. These criterion indicates the level of external factor one both sides as women are easier to be affected by external factors when she is about to make a judgment on the contrary of men. However, it can happen that some men are soft and easily affected by their emotions while women are firm and strong but that does not make it general but rather exceptional and the ruling was made based on the normal general standard. therefore it applies on everyone just like any other law!

~Source](http://www.ahlalhdeeth.com/vbe/showpost.php?p=16629&postcount=17)~

for further replies by same ustad, please read following posts: 30](http://www.ahlalhdeeth.com/vbe/showpost.php?p=20146&postcount=30), 32](http://www.ahlalhdeeth.com/vbe/showpost.php?p=20245&postcount=32)

and Allah knows best

[psyah]

@AllahkaBanda

@pysch

as-salamu alaykum

with all due respect brother, this was uncalled for, specially when you put forward your own interpretation while you are not qualified for it.

Wa 'alaikkumaSalam

No, it was called for. In another thread this topic was kicked up, instead of derailing that I started a new thread. Islam is not something that we should be embarrassed about, but I agree we should not go around talking about things that the lay or uninitiated might be distracted by.

I also did not forward my interpretation rather presented an interpretation in the way I understood it. The interpretation was not mine to give, but it is mine to understand or grapple with.

Also, you have presented an interpretation with which the one I have presented also agrees.

• They both defend the authenticity of the hadith
• They both caution the way the words are to be understood rather than the words that were uttered

[NomiCA]

Re: Women - brainless and impious ?

Sorry to be digging up an old topic…but…

The discussion doesn’t seem to have been concluded…i would like a fresh perspective on this topic…since it seems the posters in the thread no longer visit and many have been banned…

[psyah]

Re: Women - brainless and impious ?

Women's Intelligence Hadith Again

End of discussion