The part of video starting from 3:10 is pretty good
Re: Why Hijab
The short-haired (not so fashionable) girl probably spends less time getting ready in the morning than the hijabi version.
Women fighting for the right to wear hijab doesn’t prove much. It only shows a strong inculcation in the minds of women who think that head scarf is a religious ordinance.
Inculcation can go to the point that Chadian women living in Western countries get female circumcision out of peer pressure from Chadian women (Bissoondath - Selling Illusions).
Please refer to this article on hijab:
Opinion
Re: Why Hijab
would love to comment but i cant view the video....... can any of u summaries for me plz
Re: Why Hijab
While there are differences of opinions on Hijab type, not the COVERING of hair and Bossoms (which is fard). This video explains quite alot.
Oh please! are u kidding me? what world do you live in. DO you have ANY idea what those Chadian women go through? Female circumcision to PLEASE others? Theyre merely 6-7 yr old girls.. who go thru it because its a norm in their culture. Its not something Islam permits, its definitely not something that is practised commonly in regions.. so what makes you say this? Do you have ANY idea how much pain is inflicted on those little girls? Im pretty sure if they had a choice they wouldnt do it.. but they dont have a choice - Tyra banks did a show on this maybe look it up and see what these girls go thru when theyre told that theyre going to a party, and when they get there their hands and feet are tied up and thyre not even given anesthesia to bear the pain. try going through that! One of my friends is from Somalia.. and she went thru this. so please think about wht you say!
Secondly, Hijaab is an ORDER. If you think someone does it to show off then May Allah seriously help you! I certainly dont do it to show off, I do it because I fear Allah!
“And tell the believing women to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts, etc.) and not to show off their adornment except only that which is apparent, and to draw their veils all over Juyubihinna (i.e. their bodies, faces, necks and bosoms, etc.) and not to reveal their adornment except to their husbands, their fathers, their husband’s fathers, their sons, their husband’s sons, their brothers or their brother’s sons, or their sister’s sons, or their (Muslim) women (i.e. their sisters in Islam), or the (female) slaves whom their right hands possess, or old male servants who lack vigour, or small children who have no sense of the shame of sex. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And all of you beg Allah to forgive you all, O believers, that you may be successful.” Surat Nur:31
Men are attracted to hair, to faces, to the way your bodies curve and that is what covering adornments means.
" And let them draw their head-coverings over their bosoms" (Surah AlAhzaab)..
^The above Ayat is evident enough. Its telling you to cover your chest with the cloth that covers your HEAD!
I came across this statement a Brother made on a forum for Almaghrib.com! I cant find it now but if I do ill post it. He said “If women knew what goes through a mans’ mind when they look at them, even non-muslims would wear a hijaab”.
You have your beliefs and May Allah swt guide you! because I really do pity people like you who thnk that just because someone wears hijaab theyre oppressed! I am Alhumdulillah ecstatic that I wear a hijaab and Alhumdulillah with that excitement Allah gave me the courage to actually stand up and defend myself and millions of other women against people like you who think we do this to please those tht live around us - analyse yourself before telling me that im out there to show off!
God Bless!
Oh please! are u kidding me? what world do you live in. DO you have ANY idea what those Chadian women go through? Female circumcision to PLEASE others? Theyre merely 6-7 yr old girls.. who go thru it because its a norm in their culture. Its not something Islam permits, its definitely not something that is practised commonly in regions.. so what makes you say this? Do you have ANY idea how much pain is inflicted on those little girls? Im pretty sure if they had a choice they wouldnt do it.. but they dont have a choice - Tyra banks did a show on this maybe look it up and see what these girls go thru when theyre told that theyre going to a party, and when they get there their hands and feet are tied up and thyre not even given anesthesia to bear the pain. try going through that! One of my friends is from Somalia.. and she went thru this. so please think about wht you say!
Secondly, Hijaab is an ORDER. If you think someone does it to show off then May Allah seriously help you! I certainly dont do it to show off, I do it because I fear Allah!
"And tell the believing women to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts, etc.) and not to show off their adornment except only that which is apparent, and to draw their veils all over *Juyubihinna* (i.e. their bodies, faces, necks and bosoms, etc.) and not to reveal their adornment except to their husbands, their fathers, their husband's fathers, their sons, their husband's sons, their brothers or their brother's sons, or their sister's sons, or their (Muslim) women (i.e. their sisters in Islam), or the (female) slaves whom their right hands possess, or old male servants who lack vigour, or small children who have no sense of the shame of sex. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And all of you beg Allah to forgive you all, O believers, that you may be successful." Surat Nur:31
Men are attracted to hair, to faces, to the way your bodies curve and that is what covering adornments means.
" And let them draw their head-coverings over their bosoms" (Surah AlAhzaab).. ^The above Ayat is evident enough. Its telling you to cover your chest with the cloth that covers your HEAD! I came across this statement a Brother made on a forum for Almaghrib.com! I cant find it now but if I do ill post it. He said "If women knew what goes through a mans' mind when they look at them, even non-muslims would wear a hijaab".
You have your beliefs and May Allah swt guide you! because I really do pity people like you who thnk that just because someone wears hijaab theyre oppressed! I am Alhumdulillah ecstatic that I wear a hijaab and Alhumdulillah with that excitement Allah gave me the courage to actually stand up and defend myself and millions of other women against people like you who think we do this to please those tht live around us - analyse yourself before telling me that im out there to show off!
God Bless!
I am sorry that you completely missed both my points:
1) Inculcation can lead to unquestioned adherence to peer-pressure. In his book Selling Illussion, Bissoondath talks about two girls in Canada of Chadian background who asked their mother to do the circumcisition because otherwise they wouldn't be accepted in the Chadian society (they would be the odd one's out). Same can be said about fashion, piercings.
2) The article I pointed out tells that there is only one translation that defines Juyubihinna as the head or the entire body. Please read that article before chastise me.
Indeed the Ayah is telling you to draw the khimur (a headscarf which men also wore at the time as they wear in some form of it now in many Arab countries) onto your bossoms but it is not ordaining you to cover your head. Head covering is a pre-Islamic tradition in Arabia that may have become symbolic of Muslims over the years. Islam never gives it that status (perhaps, in the sunnah of Prophet SAW's wives and daughters or in hadith but not in the Koran-- not to my knowledge at least). Please look at various translations rather than sticking to one.
You are putting words in my mouth. I never said that people who wear Hijab are oppressed or that they wear it to show off. I gave the example of the Chadian women to exemplify a type of inculcation, not to make any point about oppression.
Re: Why Hijab
Also, I thought the idea of Hijab completely ironic when I got a short hair-cut but I stand corrected by this video.
Re: Why Hijab
Verse 24:31
Ahmed Raza Khan: Mohammed Aqib Qadri:
And command the Muslim women to keep their gaze low and to protect their chastity, and not to reveal their adornment except what is apparent, and to keep the cover wrapped over their bosoms; and not to reveal their adornment except to their own husbands or fathers or husbands’ fathers, or their sons or their husbands’ sons, or their brothers or their brothers’ sons or sisters’ sons, or women of their religion, or the bondwomen they possess, or male servants provided they do not have manliness, or such children who do not know of women’s nakedness, and not to stamp their feet on the ground in order that their hidden adornment be known; and O Muslims, all of you turn in repentance together towards Allah, in the hope of attaining success. (It is incumbent upon women to cover themselves properly.)
Yusuf Ali:
And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husband’s fathers, their sons, their husbands’ sons, their brothers or their brothers’ sons, or their sisters’ sons, or their women, or the slaves whom their right hands possess, or male servants free of physical needs, or small children who have no sense of the shame of sex; and that they should not strike their feet in order to draw attention to their hidden ornaments. And O ye Believers! turn ye all together towards Allah, that ye may attain Bliss.
Pickthal:
And tell the believing women to lower their gaze and be modest, and to display of their adornment only that which is apparent, and to draw their veils over their bosoms, and not to reveal their adornment save to their own husbands or fathers or husbands’ fathers, or their sons or their husbands’ sons, or their brothers or their brothers’ sons or sisters’ sons, or their women, or their slaves, or male attendants who lack vigour, or children who know naught of women’s nakedness. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And turn unto Allah together, O believers, in order that ye may succeed.
Yusuf Ali mentions beauty in general but the the common factor among these translations is adornment or ornament. Hair is not an ornament. You cannot reveal any body adornment (such as a belly adorment which was probably worn at the time) other than what is apparent such as ear-rings, etc.
I don’t agree with everything this scholar says but still worth having a look at:
Re: Why Hijab
wow tum to peeche hi parr gaii..
Your first post was pretty evident.. and no I dont think I took it wrong.. I took it exactly the way it was posted. & if 2 chadian women out of a million willingly wanted to get circumsized to fit in thats their prerogrative.. im defending those other 999,998 women who probably dont have that RIGHT!
& about covering your head
have you ever attended ANY lectures LIVE? have you ever asked an Imam what they think about hijaab? The one thing almost every imaam, sheikh, islamic teacher tells us is to cover your head - they stress on HIJAAB, how to improve your dressing in accordance with Islam etc etc. Mostly all my friends who have converted say the Shahaadah and even before they say that.. theyre already covering their head. So i dont think they do that to please others around them.
Also, we tend to mould the meaning of the Quran into what we want it to be, its the unfortunate norm of our society. So if they agree with you, thats fine.. maybe they need to read up on a tafseer or 2 themselves :D So yes, scholars might have a take on it.. but maybe you should read up on a tafseer from someone reputed like Farhat hashmi or Malik Ghulam Murtaza or Israr Ahmed and NOT JUST a translation; to really understand the meaning behind an Ayat
Hair is an adornment.. it is what makes your appearance more attractive.. if you dont think so thats fine - ignorance is a bliss!
I have nothing more to say.
Re: Why Hijab
Since you show such zeal for respectfully listening to other people's opinions, I have nothing to say to you.
Re: Why Hijab
^your writing not listening .. perception is not the same - so keep that in mind :)
& like i said, Ignorance is a bliss.. :)
Peace!
Re: Why Hijab
figure of speech. Way to side track by picking on language. Anyways, I don't want to create any more bitterness here.
Allah will judge us all and decide who guards his/ her modesty best. Peace.
Re: Why Hijab
maaf karo yaar! its a forum for goodness sake. If you cant handle others opinions about what you say/explain then maybe this isnt the right place for you. & no there is no bitterness its just the certain topic your discussing.. its sensitive and you certainly have your own opinion and likewise i have my own!! just because I dont agree with you doesnt mean im BITTER? :o
i think we're both writing in ENGLISH! so its not the language.. by perception I mean the way you read it.. its effected by the mood your in!
khair. Allah will judge us and thats something I do agree with.. so take a chill pill yaar! everyone on the website in not going to agree with you.. get used to tht!! :D
Re: Why Hijab
Absolutely, and I have had more polite debates on this forum. No one tells me "tum to piche hi par gayi ho" or "maaf karo yaar." That's simply condescending and intimidating for no good reason. This is not a light-hearted gupshup topic where you can use such language (diction) and the way it came out, I don't think it was meant to be light-hearted.
Re: Why Hijab
really? i dnt find it condescending or intimidating.. its not like im standing here with a gandaasa!! khair if i made you feel that way then i apologize!! because im not a mean person and i certainly dont have anything personal against you or your opinion for that matter!
take care
wow tum to peeche hi parr gaii.. Your first post was pretty evident.. and no I dont think I took it wrong.. I took it exactly the way it was posted. & if 2 chadian women out of a million willingly wanted to get circumsized to fit in thats their prerogrative.. im defending those other 999,998 women who probably dont have that RIGHT! & about covering your head have you ever attended ANY lectures LIVE? have you ever asked an Imam what they think about hijaab? The one thing almost every imaam, sheikh, islamic teacher tells us is to cover your head - they stress on HIJAAB, how to improve your dressing in accordance with Islam etc etc. Mostly all my friends who have converted say the Shahaadah and even before they say that.. theyre already covering their head. So i dont think they do that to please others around them.
Also, we tend to mould the meaning of the Quran into what we want it to be, its the unfortunate norm of our society. So if they agree with you, thats fine.. maybe they need to read up on a tafseer or 2 themselves :D So yes, scholars might have a take on it.. but maybe you should read up on a tafseer from someone reputed like Farhat hashmi or Malik Ghulam Murtaza or Israr Ahmed and NOT JUST a translation; to really understand the meaning behind an Ayat
Hair is an adornment.. it is what makes your appearance more attractive.. if you dont think so thats fine - ignorance is a bliss! I have nothing more to say.
So if a woman shaves of her hair, then Hijaab is not farz on her?
The arguments in the video are obviously not a panacea; but I would be interested in knowing what aspect of the argument you identified as logical fallacies or entailed through inculcation.
Regarding the position on hijab & its specific manifestations in the form of covering the head or covering th face.., I am not as learned to make any specific comment as to what constitutes the righteous position on this subject from a doctrinal or theological perspective , but from what I know regarding this subject; it is discussed in Hadith & the specific commandments/obligations on this topic follow from there, therefore only the Munkareen-e-Hadith challenge the obligatory status of Hijab , & all conventional theological schools within the ummah accept Hijab to be a religious obligation.
There are a lot of arguments in the video that I do not agree with. I am not an Islamic scholar myself but from looking at Koran, which is the highest source of Allah's will, it seems that women are not supposed to deny themselves self-adornment but only not to show any that are usually not apparent.
The argument I was taking issue with earlier is the one that some Muslim women happen to fight for their right to keep the heaf-scarf. It does not prove anything (at least it wouldn't to a skeptic non-believer) because there are instances in which women have upheld practices that are self-harming to say the least.
As for materialism, excess of everything is bad. But I do not see the poor girl with that boyish-hair cut and plain clothes a real target of the man-made fashion world.
The tone of the hijabi version's argumentation is a little domineering, I find.
So if a woman shaves of her hair, then Hijaab is not farz on her?
the punishment for a woman who doesnt do hijaab is to shave their head!
but thats to teach them a lesson - not to make it farz or not farz
Also, can you please highlight the Hadith and commandments in question.