I dont know if this topic is going to be locked or not, but if it is thats fine, just wanted to post to get some idea.
I was talking to some Christians today online and it was stated that they felt the Prophet(SAW) was a Schizophrenic. I have heard this a few times before, so I inquired as to why they felt this. Their (two peoples) reply was, “He heard voices and called himself a Prophet because of that.” So I was thinking to myself, hmm, according to Christians, Jesus (PBUH) said he was either the Son of God (Anouthbillah) or God himself(Anouthbillah). Now I am thinking that if anything, this would be far worse of a claim, and how is it that they dont consider Jesus a Schizophrenic and yet Muhammad(PBUT) is considered one? I think it would be more comprehendable to me if an athiest said that, but not coming from a Christian atleast. I dont understand the logic here.
I didnt ask them further because I felt it might get into a shouting match so thought I’d ask here. I believe there are civilized ppl here who would be able to answer appropriately. I would most appreciate an answer from a Christian, though others are welcome to comment. I dont plan on replying, will just read what is written. Thanks.
Again, if this is too controversial, feel free to delete.
Simple: If they beleive he:saw: was not whatever they claim, then they will have to accept islam otherwise they must come up with the excuse as they do by simple allegations:), you know
There was a jew in my office, and once during discussion, I asked him what are jews views on Jesus. He said, that jews consider him to be heretic.
That is actually pretty obvious. If they believed that next Prophet, then why would they not believe in his message.. hence for jews, Jesus was heretic.. for christians, Jesus is ok, but Muhammad (SAW) is not ok. Thats their way of saying, we are ok, and you are not, and to give themselves a comfort feeling that they are on the right path, on way to a place in paradise in the after-life.
sort of off topic.... i dont think Jesus ever claimed he was the son of God or that he was God... i think it was people around him that declared that... nahin? thats why we believe he is a prophet..
^That is true, Faisal and hence they continue to live in their bubble of arrogance towards the other monotheistic faiths. Ignorance breeds contempt, as the saying goes.
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*Originally posted by Faisal: *
That is actually pretty obvious. If they believed that next Prophet, then why would they not believe in his message.. hence for jews, Jesus was heretic.. for christians, Jesus is ok, but Muhammad (SAW) is not ok. Thats their way of saying, we are ok, and you are not, and to give themselves a comfort feeling that they are on the right path, on way to a place in paradise in the after-life.
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Using your own anology ,can you accept same thing for Mirza Ghulam Ahmed as next prophet?
Can we understand why for muslims Mohammed is Ok but mirza Ghulam Ahmed is not OK. Does it give them a comfort feeling of being on right path??
And hence also can we say that " they(muslim) continue to live in their bubble of arrogance towards the other monotheistic faiths. Ignorance breeds contempt, as the saying goes.
sadzzz, thats what muslims will say yes, but Christians do believe that, so there is no denying what they state.
analyze it, that is a different scenario because most muslims will say it is clearly written in the Qur'an that Muhammad(SAW) is the last messenger, whereas it does not state (from what little I know) in the Bible that Jesus is the last Messenger, nor does it state it in the Talmud, but thats another story. I dont want the discussion to go this way, so please open another thread on this. I appreciate it. Thanks.
Pleaseeeee stay on topic, cause I know this thread will be closed if not the case.
The comparison here is, one prophet claims to hear things, and so does the other one, and yet only one of them is called a schizophrenic, a real psychological malady. They are not saying he is just "crazy". I can understand an atheist saying, well I believe all people of God are crazy, but not for a Christian to state that one has a real disorder and the other doesnt.
Actually, its interesting you brought that up, as I just finished discussing this thing with someone. I won't go into too much detail as it will derail the discussion, but if you notice, the respect chain only goes to prophets before ours.
Christians give utmost respect to Moses.
Muslims give utmost respect to Jesus and Moses
And the reverse:
Jews don't respect Jesus and Muhammad
Christians don't respect Muhammad
If any of the groups, were to accept a prophet after theirs to be true and appointed by God, then they will have to come up with a pretty convincing argument why they don't accept the teachings he brings with him. Muslims get this comfort feeling, by relying on the text of the Quran, which says that Muhammad is the "seal" of the prophets, (and therefore, there will be no prophets after him). Jews and Christians do it differently, but they all get to the same conclusion, that their Prophet is the last appointed prophet and hence they are on the right path.
In order to not derail the discussion, I suggest we focus on Christians and Muslims, instead of going to all the different religions around. Also, in my view, to insult any prophet who is revered by any set of people is wrong. This is exactly the reason.
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*Originally posted by Faisal: *
Jews and Christians do it differently, but they all get to the same conclusion, that their Prophet is the last appointed prophet and hence they are on the right path.
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i dun wanna derail the thread but for this comment, Jews dun beleive what u said.. they are still waiting for Messiah :-)
^^ Alright, we can take that up in a different thread. Wallah o Aalim. It would have been nice if we had a jewish member to fill us in on some of their beliefs.
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*Originally posted by sweetpie: *
^That is true, Faisal and hence they continue to live in their bubble of arrogance towards the other monotheistic faiths. Ignorance breeds contempt, as the saying goes.
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This from someone who follows a religion that believes polytheism is invalid...Is that arrogance or ignorance...both
Actually, this is a very interesting topic and I am glad it's being brought up. IMO, it is best discussed relating to the blasphemy issues.
No matter how you look at it, or how someone put's it, if a person doesn't believe in what you believe in, then he probably considers your religion not authentic enough/ or from God. Then it comes down to how nicely the other person put's it. They can either call your religion satanic & your prophet an imposter, as you might have heard some Christian evangelists saying on TV or the very Anti-Ahmadiyya threads here on this very board, OR they can say something little milder like Schizophrenic .. OR the mildest "all religions lead to God, no matter which one you choose, so let's not argue" The bottom line is the same.
Quran is the only religious text book that point outs that all nations of the whole world were given prophets who warned them! One of the major beliefs in Islam is the belief in all the prophets & their books, along with angels & the day of judgment. So, one can claim that Islam teaches that the origin of all the different major religions present today (or the ones which vanished along with their followers) were by true prophets of God! Yes, that includes Krishna or Hinduism, Zoroaster, Confucius, Buddha etc. (Now if you are going to point out that they are not mentioned in Quran, then let's start another thread).
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Using your own anology ,can you accept same thing for Mirza Ghulam Ahmed as next prophet?
Can we understand why for muslims Mohammed is Ok but mirza Ghulam Ahmed is not OK. Does it give them a comfort feeling of being on right path??
And hence also can we say that " they(muslim) continue to live in their bubble of arrogance towards the other monotheistic faiths. Ignorance breeds contempt, as the saying goes.
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And how does baha ullah fit in this equation.. just checking :)
<< And how does baha ullah fit in this equation.. just checking >>
I think he claimed that HE IS GOD. He said that with the time Islam and Quran teachings are obsolete know and need changes and he is The god and is here to make those changes.
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*Originally posted by ahmadjee: *
Actually, this is a very interesting topic and I am glad it's being brought up. IMO, it is best discussed relating to the blasphemy issues.
OR the mildest "all religions lead to God, no matter which one you choose, so let's not argue" The bottom line is the same.
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Thanks, I didnt think it would get that many replies actually. smile
So you believe when a person says that all religions lead to God, they are essentially saying they dont believe in your religion but believe in their own?
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*Originally posted by Munni: *
they are essentially saying they dont believe in your religion but believe in their own?
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Ofcourse, they are! Otherwise they will convert to your religion, no? :)
Then again, this is another polite way of saying "jao baba, jaan choro.. tum bhi sahi, hamm bhi sahi"
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*Originally posted by Faisal: *
Ofcourse, they are! Otherwise they will convert to your religion, no? :)
Then again, this is another polite way of saying "jao baba, jaan choro.. tum bhi sahi, hamm bhi sahi"
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I actually had a long discussion over this statement with a non-muslim friend of mine. He told me the same words Ahmedjee said, and I asked him if this is logically possible. So we went into the discussion and in the end he says that Islam leads to the same place that his religion does. So I asked him if it would be alright for him to convert, since it would lead to the same place and everything, and he said no, he is not allowed to convert to another religion. But I also found it interesting that he didnt mind derogatory remarks that friends of his made towards Islam in particular. If you honestly believe that every faith leads to the same place, why have great issue with the fact that I follow Islam for example, and give dawah, etc? Makes no sense to me. I need to be enlightened.
