Ok, found the arabic script on the net, and the word used is "Kuffar". Which means that this thread is then in danger of breaking down into an issue of whether or not the Ahle-Kitaab fall under the classification of Kuffar or not. I'm in favour of this, as I believe that the Quranic Al-Kuffar (derived from the arabic word for "rejection" ) is broken down into the further category of Mushrikeen (Polytheists) and Ahle-Kitaab (People of the Book).
Mad,
are you suggesting "Ahl-e-Kitab" are a 'subset' of Kuffar??
Do "Ahl-e-Kitab" automatically eventually mean 'unbelievers' then??
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Madhanee: *
So Mad Scientist, you are suggesting that a place where Islam originated knows less about Islam than a place where it was spread by invasion and plunder? And how do you explain about killing of non-believes in Quran? Do you think, it is still valid?
And how do you explain it to 90% of muslims what is in the quaran, who can’t even read or write their own name? Now don’t tell me that they don’t learn it from a Molvi.
[/QUOTE]
a molvi in this case shouldnt be preaching Islam to someone who cant read... he should teach them how to raed before anything...
just becase Islam is being preached in the wrong way.. doesnt mean it is a backward religion.... just because the wrogn meaning is being taught, it doesnt mean the message is incorrect or absurd...
its like.. if u've written a story or a poem... but the people reading it get multiple messages from the same poem... can u say that the poem is wrong... or the interpretation is somewhat confused.... ? who knows..
is ur beef only with pakistanis? there are many liberal pakistanis out there/here who do not hold such backward and narrow minded views about Islam... they practise but with the intention of learning more about their religion and others... i guess u just havent met those kind...
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Madhanee: *
Marriage is about caring and loving someone, and not about religion.
[/QUOTE]
Marriage in islam, apart from making life more comfortable for both partners, is an institution in which husband and wife help improve each other spiritually for success in the hereafter. If both hold opposing and significantly different views of truth and reality, how can they make the marriage work?, each would consider the other misguided..
Also under the shariah a non-muslim(jew,christian) and muslim wife have rights, muslim husband is bound by shariah to fulfill his dtuies,
but not a non-muslim husband. If a non-muslim husband is not fulfilling his duties he is not bound by shariah and cant be taken to the shariah court. In this the muslim wife has no protection.
i have also heard that guys r allowed to marry ahlay kitab but not the other way around
ahlay kitab i beliee means its the religions that allah sent a book down to for example jewdaism and christianity
might be rong though
how come muslim men have the right to have sex with even married
women if they are captives?
PICKTHAL: And all married women (are forbidden unto you) save those (captives) whom your right hands possess. It is a decree of Allah for you. Lawful unto you are all beyond those mentioned, so that ye seek them with your wealth in honest wedlock, not debauchery. And those of whom ye seek content (by marrying them), give unto them their portions as a duty. And there is no sin for you in what ye do by mutual agreement after the duty (hath been done). Lo! Allah is ever Knower, Wise.
also who is the" slave women who believes" ?
YUSUFALI: Do not marry unbelieving women (idolaters), until they believe: A slave woman who believes is better than an unbelieving woman, even though she allures you. Nor marry (your girls) to unbelievers until they believe: A man slave who believes is better than an unbeliever, even though he allures you. Unbelievers do (but) beckon you to the Fire. But Allah beckons by His Grace to the Garden (of bliss) and forgiveness, and makes His Signs clear to mankind: That they may celebrate His praise
Re: Why can’t muslim women marry a non-Muslim man
i agreed :k:
more muslims live in non-muslim countries than the other way around
so it is muslims who have to live with common civil law relating to marriage ,divorce and alimony in the countries where they live.
Even though all Islamic school of jurisprudence agree on this issue that only a Muslim man is allowed to marry from Christians or the Jews, their ruling depends on interpretation.
It's a matter of Fiqh, which ideally evolves with the world. How Quran was understood a few centuries ago by some of the great scholars is well in context & respect but if taken for absolute final interpretation will mean a death to freedom & universality of Islam.
Anyway, following are two more verses regarding this issue that were not mentioned in this thread:
*002.221 *
YUSUFALI: Do not marry unbelieving women (idolaters), until they believe: A slave woman who believes is better than an unbelieving woman, even though she allures you. Nor marry (your girls) to unbelievers until they believe: A man slave who believes is better than an unbeliever, even though he allures you. Unbelievers do (but) beckon you to the Fire. But Allah beckons by His Grace to the Garden (of bliss) and forgiveness, and makes His Signs clear to mankind: That they may celebrate His praise.
PICKTHAL: Wed not idolatresses till they believe; for lo! a believing bondwoman is better than an idolatress though she please you; and give not your daughters in marriage to idolaters till they believe, for lo! a believing slave is better than an idolater though he please you. These invite unto the Fire, and Allah inviteth unto the Garden, and unto forgiveness by His grace, and expoundeth His revelations to mankind that haply they may remember.
SHAKIR: And do not marry the idolatresses until they believe, and certainly a believing maid is better than an idolatress woman, even though she should please you; and do not give (believing women) in marriage to idolaters until they believe, and certainly a believing servant is better than an idolater, even though he should please you; these invite to the fire, and Allah invites to the garden and to forgiveness by His will, and makes clear His communications to men, that they may be mindful.
*005.005 *
YUSUFALI: This day are (all) things good and pure made lawful unto you. The food of the People of the Book is lawful unto you and yours is lawful unto them. (Lawful unto you in marriage) are (not only) chaste women who are believers, but chaste women among the People of the Book, revealed before your time,- when ye give them their due dowers, and desire chastity, not lewdness, nor secret intrigues if any one rejects faith, fruitless is his work, and in the Hereafter he will be in the ranks of those who have lost (all spiritual good).
PICKTHAL: This day are (all) good things made lawful for you. The food of those who have received the Scripture is lawful for you, and your food is lawful for them. And so are the virtuous women of the believers and the virtuous women of those who received the Scripture before you (lawful for you) when ye give them their marriage portions and live with them in honour, not in fornication, nor taking them as secret concubines. Whoso denieth the faith, his work is vain and he will be among the losers in the Hereafter.
SHAKIR: This day (all) the good things are allowed to you; and the food of those who have been given the Book is lawful for you and your food is lawful for them; and the chaste from among the believing women and the chaste from among those who have been given the Book before you (are lawful for you); when you have given them their dowries, taking (them) in marriage, not fornicating nor taking them for paramours in secret; and whoever denies faith, his work indeed is of no account, and in the hereafter he shall be one of the losers.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by ahmadjee: *
Even though all Islamic school of jurisprudence agree on this issue that only a Muslim man is allowed to marry from Christians or the Jews, their ruling depends on interpretation.
It's a matter of Fiqh, which ideally evolves with the world. How Quran was understood a few centuries ago by some of the great scholars is well in context & respect but if taken for absolute final interpretation will mean a death to freedom & universality of Islam.
Anyway, following are two more verses regarding this issue that were not mentioned in this thread:
*002.221 *
YUSUFALI: Do not marry unbelieving women (idolaters), until they believe: A slave woman who believes is better than an unbelieving woman, even though she allures you. Nor marry (your girls) to unbelievers until they believe: A man slave who believes is better than an unbeliever, even though he allures you. Unbelievers do (but) beckon you to the Fire. But Allah beckons by His Grace to the Garden (of bliss) and forgiveness, and makes His Signs clear to mankind: That they may celebrate His praise.
PICKTHAL: Wed not idolatresses till they believe; for lo! a believing bondwoman is better than an idolatress though she please you; and give not your daughters in marriage to idolaters till they believe, for lo! a believing slave is better than an idolater though he please you. These invite unto the Fire, and Allah inviteth unto the Garden, and unto forgiveness by His grace, and expoundeth His revelations to mankind that haply they may remember.
SHAKIR: And do not marry the idolatresses until they believe, and certainly a believing maid is better than an idolatress woman, even though she should please you; and do not give (believing women) in marriage to idolaters until they believe, and certainly a believing servant is better than an idolater, even though he should please you; these invite to the fire, and Allah invites to the garden and to forgiveness by His will, and makes clear His communications to men, that they may be mindful.
*005.005 *
YUSUFALI: This day are (all) things good and pure made lawful unto you. The food of the People of the Book is lawful unto you and yours is lawful unto them. (Lawful unto you in marriage) are (not only) chaste women who are believers, but chaste women among the People of the Book, revealed before your time,- when ye give them their due dowers, and desire chastity, not lewdness, nor secret intrigues if any one rejects faith, fruitless is his work, and in the Hereafter he will be in the ranks of those who have lost (all spiritual good).
PICKTHAL: This day are (all) good things made lawful for you. The food of those who have received the Scripture is lawful for you, and your food is lawful for them. And so are the virtuous women of the believers and the virtuous women of those who received the Scripture before you (lawful for you) when ye give them their marriage portions and live with them in honour, not in fornication, nor taking them as secret concubines. Whoso denieth the faith, his work is vain and he will be among the losers in the Hereafter.
SHAKIR: This day (all) the good things are allowed to you; and the food of those who have been given the Book is lawful for you and your food is lawful for them; and the chaste from among the believing women and the chaste from among those who have been given the Book before you (are lawful for you); when you have given them their dowries, taking (them) in marriage, not fornicating nor taking them for paramours in secret; and whoever denies faith, his work indeed is of no account, and in the hereafter he shall be one of the losers.
[/QUOTE]
basically it does not accpet degnity of all women regardless of race
religen. eeven within the religen it devides women as believing slave
and believing women. may be it is in the context of 7th century.
wht it means right hand posseses?