Is it the Army leadership and ISI or is it our democratically elected leaders?
They are both looting Pakistan and its assets.
They are both selling Pakistan and allowing it to be routinely violated.
They both eat up a large chunk of the money unnecessarily.
But the Army/ISI appears to be doing one thing which is very dangerous. It is risking Pakistan’s very future by allegedly supporting militants in Afghanistan. Pakistan’s reputation has been tarnished very badly over the last year.
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
Simple
Who ruled more and who are more powerful .
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
Both civilians and military have played their role to bring Pakistan to the position it is in now:
Civilians have proven themselves to be selfish, corrupt, and incompetent.
On the other hand military utilizes a big chunk of our budget, their conduct in the war on terror, Bangladesh, balochistan, grip over foreign affairs etc. the way the intelligence agency is treating its own people.
Considering all these and that military has been in power for almost 30 years, we can safely say that the military has on the whole damaged Pakistan more. Even currently the war on terror and balochistan issue is firmly in control of them.
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
Civilians have proven themselves to be selfish, corrupt, and incompetent. .
Either you don't know or you don't have courage to say .
Others are more than the bloody civilians .
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
Does the military have a lot of influence over the media? I read an online leaflet which compared how prices were under Military and now under Democracy. Also there appears to be a campagn by the military to malign the Americans in the eyes of the Pakistani public yet they are in bed with them. It is like they want the benefits for themselves. The elite group of generals want all the dollars.
A lot of people criticise Zardari for being a US stooge and there is that Go Zardari campaign but should it not be Go Kayani? Zardari does go out and meet the officials but does he actually the decisions? That is why the army like Zardari - he has no spine. I am no fan of Benazir but she could stand up to them and was some sort of a check and balance.
I thought Balochistan would improve under PPP but it has not. In what way has the army more influence over the policy there? Most Balochies are anti-Pakistan and many consider them traitors. Why are they traitors? Would any one here just live on bread crumbs? They are at a point of no return to be honest. Many Baloch have gone missing.
The War on Terror and Pakistan's support for extremisat elements has sent the Pushtoon areas of Pakistan back by 200 years. If the Taliban regain power in Afghanistan I believe they will take over Pakistan too. Not only that it has destroyed the progressive element of Islam in those regions.
Kashmir policy has been a disaster too. Pakistan is stuck on step 1 yet India has moved on. Pakistan needs to devise a new policy for Kashmir and Afganistan. It should not be devised by our army or intelligence services as they exploit both policies so they can retain a lavish life style.
Our greedy greedy Generals live far to a comfortable life to dare go out and fight for Kashmir like men. I went to see a friend of mine who is a Major based in Bahawalpur. He had the A/C on in March? I was disgusted and made a joke to get the message across but it would not sink in or must feel he has earned that right. If it was May June upto October I would not have said anything but it was not that hot.
Then when they retire they walk into jobs that they are no good at and also get a mighty pension plan with land and houses too! That land and those houses should be given to those that really sacrifice something for the country - the poor!
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
The Army and ISI are quick to exploit patriotism of Pakistanis to solidify their grip on the nation. The ISI and Army are seen as "good" forces and if any one questions that they are "anti-Pakistani". Also they try to score points with the whole NATO killing Pakistani soldiers issue - they use these actions to legitimise themselves well in reality they are the cause of it.
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
Either you don't know or you don't have courage to say . Others are more than the bloody civilians .
Do you want to say that the politicians haven't plundered the country? Its difficult for me to judge who has damaged Pakistan more economically (military or politicians).
As far as the blunders in foreign policy (especially Afghanistan issue), internal security (War on terror/Balochstan), the way ISI has treated its own people and utilization of maximum part of our budget is concerned the army wins hands down.
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
From other threads, the consensus answer appears to be Veena Malik
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
Btw, you do have to realize that western mags have an agenda (not very unbiased) as far as ISI / army goes with afghanistan in the background. There is some awe and contempt that supposedly ISI and army has checkmated the US / NATO in the afghanistan quagmire single handedly!
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
From other threads, the consensus answer appears to be Veena Malik
she is bold and honest ,she is better than the lot of generals( jarnails) politicians and pathetic mullas.
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
Uncle ur so funny
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
Do you want to say that the politicians haven't plundered the country? Its difficult for me to judge who has damaged Pakistan more economically (military or politicians).
As far as the blunders in foreign policy (especially Afghanistan issue), internal security (War on terror/Balochstan), the way ISI has treated its own people and utilization of maximum part of our budget is concerned the army wins hands down.
The people who have the most power will have contributed to the destruction the most. If our bold and mighty Army Generals cant stand up to outsiders giving orders, then whoi can?
If our "warriors" are so cowardly what hope have we?
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
the culprits who destroying pakistan the most is combination of the corrupt politicians like nawaz sharif and zardari groups and also America.
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
Do you want to say that the politicians haven't plundered the country? Its difficult for me to judge who has damaged Pakistan more economically (military or politicians). .
Role of politician is very small.
Others are doing much more .
Looking for any General Zulfqar Mirza
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
Politicians have had a role in the destruction of Pakistan, but the biggest role is played by the Army.
In all Pakistan's history, they have had direct and indirect power.
They never let their own budgest be audited, and use their guns to hold themselves above the law. They have manipulated and killed popular leaders who would have built Pakistan.
Pakistan is cursed to have such a corrupt and unprofessional Army.
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
And target of their guns ?
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
And target of their guns ?
The people of Pakistan.
This is the fact we see in our history.
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
Politicians have had a role in the destruction of Pakistan, but the biggest role is played by the Army.
Not that i disagree what you have said above but aren't we forgetting something or someone who might have done more damage then Army and Politicians? I am talking about the civil bureaucracy.. the culture of corrupting among the politicians or the army is preached by them... now the major culprit to me is the civil bureaucracy, if they do their job on its merit, no one including an army would dare to break a traffic signal let alone the constitution...
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
I think the majority of Pakistan are destroying the country by not speaking up against the wrongs, by not being active in protecting the country, by not taking the criminals to task, by sitting idle and waiting for a miracle.
Re: Who is destroying Pakistan more?
Not that i disagree what you have said above but aren't we forgetting something or someone who might have done more damage then Army and Politicians? I am talking about the civil bureaucracy.. the culture of corrupting among the politicians or the army is preached by them... now the major culprit to me is the civil bureaucracy, if they do their job on its merit, no one including an army would dare to break a traffic signal let alone the constitution...
I understand your point, but everybody in Pakistan takes orders from those pointing guns at them, the Army.
Any popular politician, bureaucrat,civilian who can challenge this will be overthrown, or killed.