We are covering a long journey during rapidly moving our days and nights. We always get ready to start our new day without knowing that where are we going actually? Are we going to office, school, college or out to meet someone in the city? No but we are going towards the point from where we had come in this world. But most of us don’t know this fact or they don’t want to realize this fact I think.fficeffice. When will we start to think over it my dears? Everything that we have continued in this world, has to stop one day and then there will be no life no chance to do anything and there will be not a single moment to build our life after death. Bad deeds of some Ulama and day by day increasing corruption of our society would not become the reason of not obeying the instructions of Allah Subhana hu wa taala. Just think for a while that we are dead now and there are so many people around us crying on us and going to drop us in a very short and dark hole type room. After that our closed eyes would surely open and would see each and everything which have been told to us by our Holy Prophet PBUH.<O:p
Come back towards Allah and plan to obey his orders in our daily life and think about the maximum limit and optimum point of our modernization and development.<O:p
Re: Where are we going actually?
We cant!. The entire 21st century belongs to saitan. We are not muslims. only by name. 90% of us are muslims by birth, but did we acctually try our selfs to find out what really does a muslim mean and explore the real truth , that is, Quran.?
No. Because we are all selfish and greety and inpatient. Performing good deeds for your self is not enought people. I think we have gone waaaaaaaay beyond repair, we never had the brains really, we droped common sence a few decades back , so the difference between moral and immoral is no more. The bad becomes good in our eyes.
We all know what to do, to turn to the path to Allah(SWT). However, before we do that we must through ourselfs from our current path, which saitan has made us to belive us to be right one. Admit your mistakes. Admit you are the fault. Believe you are the solution, not someone else. Belive in Allah(SWT) and reflect and return to him.
[quote]
Everything that we have continued in this world, has to stop one day and then there will be no life no chance to do anything and there will be not a single moment to build our life after death. Bad deeds of some Ulama and day by day increasing corruption of our society would not become the reason of not obeying the instructions of Allah Subhana hu wa taala. Just think for a while that we are dead now and there are so many people around us crying on us and going to drop us in a very short and dark hole type room.
[/quote]
That's the typically muslim way to convince people of God, based on threat and fear of God.
People are portrayed as sinners and God as someone who will punish you with no limits for such a small things like not saying a prayer.
How could you be sure of the existence of a God, at first place.
How could you be sure of the existence of a God, at first place.
How can you be so sure of the NON existence of a god? Science has its limits, the greatest of all scientists were philosophers and they believed in a single creator.
It only takes a single failed test to disaprove a tried and tested theory. The 'GOD' element cannot be tested because we can only test from what our limmited knowledge permits us within the confined aparatus, which is the world. GOD, is beyond that, therefore no test can prove it.
However if you are basing your conclusions based on the theory of evolution, then my friend I would advise you to search more into the subject. Evolution has been proven wrong time after time, not by religious scholors, but by scientists.
[quote]
greatest of all scientists were philosophers and they believed in a single creator.
[/quote]
Who told you this my friend, By the way who do you use this word "philosopher" for because you put me in serious doubt that you might using it for prophets.
[quote]
The 'GOD' element cannot be tested because we can only test from what our limmited knowledge permits us within the confined aparatus, which is the world. GOD, is beyond that, therefore no test can prove it.
[/quote]
If God element cannot be tested, then you don't have any knowledge to claim its existence.
What you(or others with similar thoughts) are not considering in your opinion is that, you are defining the word "God" in a specific way and you are assuming that, the way you defined it, is how the reality is. But problem is that how do you know that there is such a God, and by defining it beyond testing domain, you are excluding it from the realm of reality and still assuming that God is reality.
Further it also seems that you are assuming that, once we find a flaw in evolution or other theories then this means there is a God, which isn't right you have to prove/dis-prove it for its own sake. There is no black and White thing with theory of evolution and God, there can be other explanation which we might not know yet, Further i'm not suggesting that there is scientific flaw in theory of evolution, I just carried on with it to show you the flaw in your logic. I'm here to explain if you want me to do more.
Please don't take my words personally, just an academic discussion is all what i intend for.
[FONT=Times New Roman]There is no cure for secularism unless God decides to give anyone Hidayat. I suggest you to never support such views and perceptions in your life, please.
<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />[FONT=Times New Roman] [FONT=Times New Roman]God bless you [FONT=Times New Roman]
[FONT=Times New Roman]There is no cure for secularism unless God decides to give anyone Hidayat. I suggest you to never support such views and perceptions in your life, please.
ffice:office" />
Why don't you consider your thoughts, either they are right/ wrong, and to know right/ wrong, you got to have arguments/ evidence.
You can't have an opinion and think that its right, and further expect that people will agree with you on that, without providing the reasons to accept you right.
Who told you this my friend, By the way who do you use this word "philosopher" for because you put me in serious doubt that you might using it for prophets.
Excuse me? You want an academic discussion then I would advise you to set your facts straight. All sciences stem from philosophy. If you disagree then I cannot reason with you because clearly, you cant think outside the boundries created by our own dillusioned mind. Go and read greek history and you'll know what "philoshopy and science is".
If God element cannot be tested, then you don't have any knowledge to claim its existence.
Just because you cant see anything does not mean it does not exist. You are still unable to answer my question as to how can to prove God does NOT exist? Do you have any proof? any evience? Infact I seriously doubt you even have any idea what the concept of GOD is. Read on budhism and Islami Sufism to "open your heart and soul". I wouldnt say your mind because your mind has suken deep into the world.
What you(or others with similar thoughts) are not considering in your opinion is that, you are defining the word "God" in a specific way and you are assuming that, the way you defined it, is how the reality is. But problem is that how do you know that there is such a God, and by defining it beyond testing domain, you are excluding it from the realm of reality and still assuming that God is reality.
How the heck do you know this is the ultimate reality? Can you prove it. Again, just because your 5 sences preceive it does not mean this reality? You can have another reality if you hack into your sences to give a completly different picture. Can you define reality then? Same concept, dreams. How do you know this is the real world and dreams are not? Maby you are living a dream only to wake up to death?. I can already hear you laughing at my comments but truely if you know anything about philosophy, you would get it. But clearly you dont as you dont know jack about it.
Further it also seems that you are assuming that, once we find a flaw in evolution or other theories then this means there is a God, which isn't right you have to prove/dis-prove it for its own sake. There is no black and White thing with theory of evolution and God, there can be other explanation which we might not know yet, Further i'm not suggesting that there is scientific flaw in theory of evolution, I just carried on with it to show you the flaw in your logic. I'm here to explain if you want me to do more.
Please don't take my words personally, just an academic discussion is all what i intend for.
No! It is your arogant prception that believes that God will be proven once we find a flow on evolution. Well to that I answer you dont even know what evolution is. Go and read about it. Its a THEORY. Just like any other. It was an idea, a couple of hundred years ago, and became popular because it offered a simple answer to the most complex problem. However scitensts have found flawed in the theory.
The only flaw is in your logic. You cant reason with anything that is outside the realms of science and your so called reality. As I say, before you engage in ANY debate on the matter of GOD, you need to understand philosophy first. I dont expect any logical answer from you because clearly you have demonstrated your inability to comphrend anything that you do not preceve to be the truth.
Why don't you consider your thoughts, either they are right/ wrong, and to know right/ wrong, you got to have arguments/ evidence.
You can't have an opinion and think that its right, and further expect that people will agree with you on that, without providing the reasons to accept you right.
You say that yet you go on about asking people to prove for existance of God? Where is YOUR evidence/argument on your idea on the non existance of God?
Re: Where are we going actually?
By the way, newton and einstine, both belived in God and both were philosophers.
Excuse me? You want an academic discussion then I would advise you to set your facts straight. All sciences stem from philosophy. If you disagree then I cannot reason with you because clearly, you cant think outside the boundries created by our own dillusioned mind. Go and read greek history and you'll know what "philoshopy and science is".
My response was on your following statement, i.e.
"greatest of all scientists were philosophers and they believed in a single creator. "
I don't disagree with the point that Science is a historic phenomena, And scientific method, science was an outcome of any competing philosophies about what is the knowledge?
I used word prophet, because you said that philosophers believed in a single creator. The way i got you is like this "greatest of all scientists are philosophers and they believed in single creator", i.e. The Philosophers believed in single creator, actually there were very few, which isn't right since you had used word 'were' where i was taking are, so its a mistake. But still its not important what scientist believes, the important thing is what he proves.
Just because you cant see anything does not mean it does not exist.
From where you are saying this, does science prove things only by seeing them. Both deductive and inductive means are used, where are your arguments ?
You are still unable to answer my question as to how can to prove God does NOT exist? Do you have any proof? any evience? Infact I seriously doubt you even have any idea what the concept of GOD is. Read on budhism and Islami Sufism to "open your heart and soul".
Mr balckmagic, here's what i wrote you earlier on your this point
"What you(or others with similar thoughts) are not considering in your opinion is that, you are defining the word "God" in a specific way and you are assuming that, the way you defined it, is how the reality is. "
But some how, what i wrote created more doubts in your mind, Anyways allow me elaborate and address your point directly.
What i was trying to say earlier is that "God" is just a word and you are attaching some attributes to it. Now problem is that using the word "God" and defining it in a specific way doesn't show that it exists with the attributes you had assigned to it.
From these lines what i was implicitly implying that, since you didn't proved there isn't any "God" so you can't claim that it exists, Actually this automatically removes any possibility of you raising a negative question and ask for proofs from me.
*Problem is that, since you are asserting the existence of "God", so if you can prove it then we can consider it a valid assertion. What you are assuming is that your claim of God is automatically valid, till someone dis-proves it.
*
Now what if i say there are millions of small Gods with alot of powers and those powers are beyond the realm of science and data from your senses can't disprove it, since it is out side your realm of experience.
Now from your point of view, you have to disprove me on this, Otherwise its right because you have not disproved me. And imagine if i make a computer program who will create such assertions, it will create millions for you in matter of hours, so according to your logic they are all correct till someone disproves them.
But that's not the way logical reasoning goes on, the burdon of proof lies on the one who asserts, why? simply because someone who is asserting something got have the reasons for that assertion, now the validity of assertions dependent on the validity of reasons.
I wouldnt say your mind because your mind has suken deep into the world.
My friend you are becoming very much judgmental about me, what do you know about my mind, you just have read a single post, Dont reply me with the claims that you got some secret powers :D
How the heck do you know this is the ultimate reality? Can you prove it. Again, just because your 5 sences preceive it does not mean this reality? You can have another reality if you hack into your sences to give a completly different picture. Can you define reality then? Same concept, dreams. How do you know this is the real world and dreams are not? Maby you are living a dream only to wake up to death?. I can already hear you laughing at my comments but truely if you know anything about philosophy, you would get it. But clearly you dont as you dont know jack about it.
Frankly, I'm not Laughing at your comments, your getting over-judgmental here.
Now here what you are challenging is the concept of objectivity, i.e.
Is there any objective reality out there for us? but as a consequence you are also challenging the foudations of science. Science is based on Testability, Falsifiability and the ability of human being to know the reality and there are all kind of methods for, But before going into any detail on this i'll need to have your opinion on this are you aware about these consequences and do you want to put Foundations of Science in doubt?
No! It is your arogant prception that believes that God will be proven once we find a flow on evolution. Well to that I answer you dont even know what evolution is. Go and read about it. Its a THEORY. Just like any other. It was an idea, a couple of hundred years ago, and became popular because it offered a simple answer to the most complex problem. However scitensts have found flawed in the theory.
Again i'll start my response with the statement that, don't be over judgmental about me.
Let me tell you that theory of evolution was not what i was discussing, I was responding to your following lines.
if you are basing your conclusions based on the theory of evolution, then my friend I would advise you to search more into the subject. Evolution has been proven wrong time after time, not by religious scholors, but by scientists.
since you didn't proved your assertion about God, and told me that evolution is wrong, so i told you about your logical error, that if theory of evolution is wrong, still you have to prove your assertion seperately and i guess i had explained my opinion on supporting your assertion with arguments alot now(earlier in the post).
The only flaw is in your logic. You cant reason with anything that is outside the realms of science and your so called reality. As I say, before you engage in ANY debate on the matter of GOD, you need to understand philosophy first. I dont expect any logical answer from you because clearly you have demonstrated your inability to comphrend anything that you do not preceve to be the truth.
By the way which philosophy you talk about when you use word "philosophy", becuase your opinion about reality seems to me of one of those idealists, recently Harun Yahya has also encorporated the same material in his videos and books, trying to create doubts about the objectivity of things, And raising questions like How much value we can give to the data that we get from our senses, after all our senses can be wrong at times?
But what they ignore that they don't consider the epistemology factor, like What will you call knowledge? Recent science had incorporated the views of both empiricism (physics, chemistry etc) and rationalism (mathematics) in labelling something as knowledge. Now for science both your deductive/inductive arguments are the foundation of your knowledge. What idealists do they create doubts, but what they do wrong is that they claim something certain as well, i.e. After denying the foundations of knowledge they are also claiming the knowledge and they don't have any sources to identify or justify, So why should not we discard there calims of knowldege?
You say that yet you go on about asking people to prove for existance of God? Where is YOUR evidence/argument on your idea on the non existance of God?
This point had already been addressed in detail.
By the way, newton and einstine, both belived in God and both were philosophers.
One can debate the legetimacy of this claim, specifically Einstine, but scientists are important only for those things what they provide proofs for. So if Einstine or Newton had given an argument for the existence of God, so we can discuss it.
Deen or faith, be it a way of life, or a spirtual connection with the Almighty cannot be trivialized. no one is perfect. people are able to redeem themselves, but where i draw the line is that delibrately do not deny self improvement.
sometimes, when fait & its teachings are harped on, by fear element, we may not get it right unless we feel that we should bring a change in our lives ourselves, out of our own accord.
Almighty is every one's & with everyone, even if someone not blessed by Almighty's guidance, (which I do believe we all can harness, if our intentions to change for good are pure & Almighty wills to see them as such), most people may not know that there has to be a purpose behind their lives, there is in fact a purpose behind every one's life. we need to see it, before it is late due to our own lazyness.
It can get scary, as many things we do not know, about our existence.
the inspiration can come from the rest of the creation of the Almighty.