So now you are saying that somehow Kashmir is related to Gujarat riots 
As soon as Pakistan vacates the areas occupied by it … as required by United Nations resolution … Till then Kashmir will be Pakistan’s “pipe” dream 
Re: What Indian Muslim said to Musharraf
[note] Mind the language [/note]
Re: What Indian Muslim said to Musharraf
Maulana Madani’s (the Indian Muslim who gave a fitting reply to Musharraf) credentials speak for themself -
Maulana Mahmood Madani comes from a family of Islamic scholars. In his final year at Darul Uloom Deoband in 1992, the demolition of the Babri Mosque at Ayodhya affected him very deeply. Mahmood came out to aid the victims of the communal riots that followed. With supporters he surrounded the local police and administration offices, demanding immediate justice. After graduation from Darul Uloom Deoband, he took to business but still devoted time to social and political activities. His political career started with the Samajwadi Party and he became its National Secretary and central Council member. Subsequently, he joined the Congress. In 2004, he joined the RLD and is now a member of the Rajya Sabha from UP.
During the Gujarat earthquake, his relief and rehabilitation work brought him national recognition and he was elected as General Secretary of Jamiat Ulama-i-Hind from 2001 to 2008. He is now an executive member and regarded as its leader. His far-reaching recent achievement is in launching the countrywide anti-terrorist campaign and in getting the Deoband Clergy to pass a fatwa against terrorists. He organised 40 anti-terrorism conferences all over the country. The massive public gatherings in May 2008 at the Ramlila Grounds of Delhi and in November 2008 in Hyderabad have helped in mobilising the Muslim masses and Ulema against terrorism.
Pakistanis love talk about Gujarat, but why do you forget that Gujarat riots started because of Godhra ?.
Actullay i dont want to go off topic but this sentence forced me to remind you that Godhra was an accident, it was Gujrat govt who took advantage of the situation to kill muslims and thus blamed it on innocent people. I dont want to go in depth of it since it is world affairs not Indian affairs that too pakistani forum.
Re: What Indian Muslim said to Musharraf
Thanks Shaz for posting the videos.
Musharraf was bold and as honest as anyone can be, in this video. Not everything could be known by him. Kudos to him.
Indian audience in this video were completely out of line and did not deserve such open forum.
Even at two ocassions, the moderator was out of line.
One: When he sarcastically said something its a good news that ISI or army was for the peace.
Two: When he called Musharraf "General!"
Moral: Pakistani officials should avoid these kind of meetings in future.
Re: What Indian Muslim said to Musharraf
One question to the Mush fans
Why did not any terrorist organisation be born when your own citizens were treated as second rate citizens in Bangladesh. To refresh your knowledge thousands of Pakistani citizens were stranded in BD after liberation. These Pakistanis were not given rights of citizenship in the new country and were treated as dirt.
Mush is talking about the plight of muslims in India. Why cant he talk about the plight of hindus in Pakistan. Since hindus are being ill-treated in Pakistan should Indian hindus form suicide squads and head to Pakistan.
That maulana was an id*ot....
Great reply by mush... "Musharraf retorted with a hint of sarcasm, “If you are happy in your present condition, I am most happy...I take back my words.” "....
Should be enough for that maulana, who prolly got paid for barking like this.....That's how indian muslims welcome their guests pathetic....
If this is how Mush behaves, then the kind of reply that he got was warranted. Being a guest does not mean that you can talk crap. Mush is ready to take back the words, but is he ready to stop the jehadi activities in Pakistan aiming at disrupting normal life in India. Unfortunately he cannot even if he wanted to since nobody has any control over these organisations whose sole aim is to export terrot. (Now not just export cause terror would be better)
O bhai jaan,
Just because I am saying that Maulana was saying something that may be right or wrong, do I become an Indian?? :)
No one is greater Pakistani than I!!!
See the whole picture, yes Muslims of India are not in good condition, in fact according to a survey, they are in the worst condition economically. Many factors account for that, just as many factors account for poverty in our own country. We have discrimination based on other factors due to lack of justice, and rule of law.
In India, Muslims may be discriminated based on being Muslim and in Pakistan discrimination due to lack of justice.
Indian Muslims have long (in my opinion) looked up to Pakistan for being their moral support. Things have changed. We can't even support our own people and the traitors and generals we have, have actually ruined Pakistan. They can't provide justice and establish Islamic system of social justice in the "Islamic Republic" of Pakistan which was supposed to a model Islamic country.
When you see all that, should someone from our country be going and giving lectures on such things, that too in India????
Do you think Indians are nuts? They are not, they called Musharraf to make a fool of us. And that traitor Musharraf is still believing as if he is some sort of scholar who knows how to fix things. He should be fixing Pakistan's problems first and the mess he has created.
When we Pakistanis talk about Indian Muslims the way we do, we end up creating more problems for them. To be honest we get carried away with our Pakistaniat and do not realize that they have to walk a fine line keeping in view how stupid our leaders have been.
If we really want to be helpful, lets just put our own house in order. Lecturing to Indian Muslims would only make us look more stupid because we have lost our moral standing! and We all know that!
And yes when we establish Islamic justice and equality in our own country and when we do not have to run to Australia and the United States for living a good life, we won't even need to say what others need to do. They will emulate us and ask us what need to be done.
Good for you if you are Pakistani.
All you need to understand is that Maulana Madni was NOT talking to a failed leader or a dictator, he was talking to a person representing PAKISTAN.
maybe i was too harsh when i said i hate them but i certainly do NOT like them. I know enough Indian muslim families and have spent enough time to say something like this.
To give you one example of mentality of Indian muslims, I saw them burning Pakistani flags at a rally against Israeli attacks on Palestine(tell me how it makes any sense at all???).
There was a TV show in which Indian muslims were invited to discuss their problems, a lot of them were crying that muslims in India are treated like terrorists, if one muslim was involved in terrorism, it doesn't mean that all of us are terrorists.
I won't even go into other of their problems as i don't care but when they were asked a question about Mumbai attacks, their tones changed. Each one of them wanted pakistan to be declared a terrorist state, Pakistanis should be taught a lesson, Zardari should wear bangles, one even said that " 25 crore Musalmano k 25 crore Jootay Pakistan ko parengay"
Now do you see the hypocricy???? Not all Indian muslims are terrorists but all Pakistanis are. terrorists don't represent Indian muslims but it's a different case for Pakistanis.
As for your other argument about Musharaff, only time will tell if he is really as big an evil as some people think. He is still a much better leader than Zardari, Sharif, etc.He made some mistakes but always acts in pakistan's interest unlike ganja and Ghaddari.
Calling Mush was a bad choice on the part of the magazine. He has been proven to be a liar on multiple ocassions. That apart, as a guest of the country there is a decorum which needs to be maintained. Mush crossed that line and got what he deserved from a fellow Muslim whose cause he was claiming to champion :p
Why do you Pakistanis keep harping about the Gujarat riots ? Why dont you talk about Godhra which led to this riot ?
Why do people keep talking about Gujrat?
Why do people keep talking about Samjhota Express?
Why do people keep talking about Babri mosque?
Why do people keep talking about "RAW" activities in Pakistan?
Let's keep talking about Mumbai attacks, parliament attack, most popular ISI attacks, etc etc and we are all happy :)
Actullay i dont want to go off topic but this sentence forced me to remind you that Godhra was an accident, it was Gujrat govt who took advantage of the situation to kill muslims and thus blamed it on innocent people. I dont want to go in depth of it since it is world affairs not Indian affairs that too pakistani forum.
Bannerjee committee (2002) which called this incident an accident was a political committee set up by the Congress govt. Their report was stayed by the Gujarat High Court and its circulation stopped by the Supreme Court of India.
The Nanavati commission (2008) declared that this event was a pre-planned attack by Muslims on Hindus.
Pls check your facts and dont just quote what is convenient to your line of thinking.
Now lets get back to the topic.
Why do people keep talking about Gujrat? Why do people keep talking about Samjhota Express? Why do people keep talking about Babri mosque? Why do people keep talking about "RAW" activities in Pakistan?
Let's keep talking about Mumbai attacks, parliament attack, most popular ISI attacks, etc etc and we are all happy :)
Your arguement does not make any sense. Talk about Gujarat riots by all means, but also talk about Godhra in the same breath since both of them are inter-related.
What are you on about? What maulana said was pathetic and the reply that Mush gave was more than enough to shut his mouth…
There is reason why the thread opener olny posted half the video 
^ this is how you respect your Muslims bros or you are also paid for barking just to insult Indian Muslims?
What muslims bros are you talking about? Peole like this maulana?
Agreed. He definately was honest and the reply he gave was more than enough to shut their crap up
Bannerjee committee (2002) which called this incident an accident was a political committee set up by the Congress govt. Their report was stayed by the Gujarat High Court and its circulation stopped by the Supreme Court of India.
The Nanavati commission (2008) declared that this event was a pre-planned attack by Muslims on Hindus.
Pls check your facts and dont just quote what is convenient to your line of thinking.
Now lets get back to the topic.
And Nanavati committee was comissioned by Modi the mass murderer. The perpetrator himself appointing the inquiry no wonder what it said.
Re: What Indian Muslim said to Musharraf
i wonder what Indian muslims hve to say about this?
Indian muslims have evolved into a hybrid..-** A Mixture of Hinduism and Islam.... **
Raj Kumar Aslam, Daleep Rafique would be their names........who cares what they think of Pakistan and Islam. Let them dance and sing with the Hindus.
Thaiyya Thaiyya Thaiyya...Nachak Thannay Thannay..>Sare gama pada Nese.....Be happy!
Bannerjee committee (2002) which called this incident an accident was a political committee set up by the Congress govt. Their report was stayed by the Gujarat High Court and its circulation stopped by the Supreme Court of India.
The Nanavati commission (2008) declared that this event was a pre-planned attack by Muslims on Hindus.
Pls check your facts and dont just quote what is convenient to your line of thinking.
Now lets get back to the topic.
Well, so giving names of two commissions doesn't conclude that we can choose any one from them. we need to search for facts before giving bias conclusions. I wont start my post by supporting Bannerjee report but first i would like to punch holes in nanavathi reports.
Firstly Nanavathi commison was appointed by Gujrat govt so without an iota of doubt even a kid can say how biased nanavati commission reports must be. After investigation of nearly six years it gives only first part of report, legally it is tangible that the investigation report can be submitted in parts, so the logic behind this is not very clear.
This conspiracy theory has serious holes in it. The train is carrying the returning Kar Sevaks was not a public knowledge, not even the state officials knew about it. The only people who knew that the Ram sevaks were returning by that train were the VHP-BJP combine. The train was late by five hours and this totally debunks the theory of conspiracy by Muslim community. If they did not know that train is carrying Ram Sevaks how could they conspire and how could they implement the same if train was late? If conspiracy is at all to be believed the finger of suspicion should be in some other direction!
Then, if the commission says the vestibule was cut open, why such valuable evidence was permitted to be sold in the scrap? The depositions show that the first train stoppage at Godhra station was due to the Ram Sevaks pulling the chain as some of them were left out on the platform and the second one was due to technical fault. For conspiracy by them they should have stopped the train, which is not the case. This again goes against the conspiracy by rational people's theory.
While trying to come to this theory first nanavathi operated on the line that the burning rags and some chemicals were thrown from the windows but soon it shifted to the theory that vestibule was cut. The earlier thesis that petrol was poured from outside was not tenable as Forensic laboratory, FSL, had strongly maintained that petrol cannot be poured from outside due to the height of the rail track and the height of the train.
Then comes the vestibule theory. One imagines for cutting the vestibule the train has to be stopped by the conspirators, but second time the train stopped due to technical snag and not due to pulling.
Some NGO in Ahmedabad released their own report according to which the first chargesheet filed by the police said that it all started with karsevaks having a heated argument with Muslim tea vendors. Whereas, the Nanavati Commission says that there was nothing imprompt about the conspiracy that was hatched a day before.
The activists also say the Godhra DSP testified that but for the passengers, he saw no other crowd at the spot and Nanavati panel says that over 1,000 local Muslims were gathered with lethal weapons.
As per the activists, the compartment was set on fire from outside while the Nanavati Commission says the mob entered the bogie and set it on fire.
The forensic report confirms there is no evidence that petrol was used to set the coach on fire, say the activists. But, the Nanavati report says that 140 litres of petrol was used.
The activists have also talked about two people who were arrested told court that they were tortured to 'confess.' According to Nanavati, both men arrested and booked under POTO, then POTA, had confessed.
Activists say the DSP and the survivors testified before the commission that injured passengers got off as the left side of the coach was open but the Nanavati panel says the mob set the bogie on fire, ensuring that the passengers had no way to escape.
Above all, just for conclusion purpouse i would say that when Mr.Modi can replace judges thrice to give bail to vampires like Babu Banjrangi, what can't he do to save himself or to give new directions to nanavathi report since it was formed by his own govt.
Re: What Indian Muslim said to Musharraf
^ It is ridiculous to doubt the credentials of Justice Nanavati. Just because it was appointed by the Gujarat govt does not make the Nanavati commission biased. One must remember that it is the same justice Nanavati who inquired into the anti- Sikh violence following the assassination of Mrs Indira Gandhi in 1984. On the basis of the Nanavati report, two Congress leaders, Sajjan Kumar and Jagadish Tytler were put in the dock. Tytler was even forced to resign from the Union Government.
Mods, if you feel that this discussion is useful pls split the thread. I do not want to hijack the original thread through this tangential discussion.