Under Musharraf:
What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass then?
I am here to learn.
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
You are comparing 1,2 yrs of limited power as PM compared with 8 yrs of unlimited rule?
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
^ very right by Real Deal ...the democratic governments were never allowed to fuction freely... i do not say they are vey good as in words of Mr.Fraudia ..both are haramkhors...but atleast have elections every after 5 years so that Filtration of black sheeps ultimately take place within 20 or 30 years....
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
BB and Nawaz were in power for 10 years between them. From what I hear, during that time they made plenty of money for themselves including appointing their brothers, mother, and husband into high ranking positions. Apparently Abba Ji didn't too badly either.
Poor Pakistanis were left with just $500m dollars at the end of that 10 years rule.
In those 10 years no good laws proposed or passed for minorities and women.
Please correct me if I am wrong. I am here to learn.
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
Contrary to what people assume, BB and NS wielded very little power for their respective first terms (for more read up on the mehran bank scandal and operation midnight jackal) and in BB's case she was in a coalition government for both terms and lacked a majority in the senate. Still it's a poor excuse for not making the effort. Nawaz Sharif's first and second terms were marked by many laws which are responsible for the present day economic liberalistaion.
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
You are comparing 1,2 yrs of limited power as PM compared with 8 yrs of unlimited rule?
Then lets hear about the initiatives.
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
^ :)
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
silence??
expected...
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
Yup the responses speaks loads about it ....
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
all i know about BB is tht she, like aalsi said, made money for her self and put some of her family in high places 
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
You are comparing 1,2 yrs of limited power as PM compared with 8 yrs of unlimited rule?
Not really. I'd say Nawaz was as powerful Prime Minister as you can get. He fired his President (Laghari), COAS(Waheed Kakar) and CJ (Sajjad Ali).....You got to have power to do that. He was in rule for 3 years with that power.
BB also made a deal with Army to get into power (to start with). She should have resigned if she had no power.
baad main tu sub hee kehtey hain k power nahi thee, it takes guts to resign from govt if you dont have powers.
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
^I'll agree with DC on this one. Nawaz indeed was quite a powerful prime minister. One reason was that during those 10 or so years generally army wanted to keep itself to barracks. He knew what power he really had once he was ousted.
Now look at thread starter he says Under Musharraf , so and so good laws have been passed. Well if President takes the credit for passing good laws by assembly (of which he is not the part, then he shud also take responsibility of things that have not happened).
Now regarding "good laws" passed by present assembly under this President.
Which of it has really helped people.
- women's protection bill have been passed
Has it made any difference to women? ave they become safer now?
moves made to protect minorities from blasphemy law abuses
plz elaborate, which ones?
separate electorate for non-Muslims has been ended
Good for them, they demanded it for quite some time and got it.
** anti-hate laws passed**
Plz elaborate which laws?
** large number of reserved seats for women**
**Again i haven't found if these women have made any difference
Good business and investment laws passed as well
Again plz elaborate which laws?
**
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
anyways returning to the question that was asked.
I am gathering that people are not really able to find much on any initiatives taken by nawaz or BB.
thus the need for tangents?..
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
Well, what I know, numerous major things this government did during last 8 years. Surprisingly, most impressive ones were done before 2002 election, during first 3 years of President Musharraf rule. That is different matter that during next five years, when Pakistan had assemblies and politicians around, some of those good works were watered down, though got approval from parliament, however grudgingly and unwillingly (probably sirf danday kay zour per).
Apart of laws and reforms, lot of impressive development works were also done during last 8 years, that in Pakistan under all past corrupt governments (including civilians and military), was never possible.
Few of those reforms that impressed me most are:
Creation of NRB was one big thing that happened after Musharraf took over power. NRB has proposed and many things got implemented in Pakistan, almost in commando style urgency. Creation of NAB was also a big and impressive step taken by Musharraf, and whatever these corrupt politicians say about NAB (and I know many corrupt politicians and bureaucrats), it is first time in history of Pakistan that an institution (NAB) has really created havoc amongst corrupts in Pakistan.
Police act given by President Musharraf. Just imagine that Pakistan (as well as India) police was run under the legacy of British police act framed dated 1861. British made police laws in such a way that it was more a tool to control the people and rule subcontinent (as subcontinent was colony) rather then to serve the people.
All rulers in India and Pakistan used that act left by British to control the people of their respective country and rule the country. This act needed replacement immediately after independence and all rulers had chance to do that. Even now, Indian police and BD police are working under same act left by British. Forget dictatorship, even democracy in India, Bangladesh or any type of rule in Pakistan (before Musharraf), none bothered to change British police act.
If anyone talk about democracy did not had chance, they are B* S*ting. Actually, after 2002, when politicians came in, most tried to water down the new Pakistan police act (and it has got watered down a bit), as new Musharraf police acts had made politicians toothless, as in effect new police act almost took control of police away from politicians or people in power. Police themselves were against (and even now they are against) new police act as their own power got affected (reduced) a lot after this act, whereas accountability got increased.
Under new police act, investigation and persecution got separated. Plus, a new body was formed within police, that was again independent of other two bodies (investigation and persecution), and was there to investigate police.
*.
Second most impressive thing that President Musharraf did was to free the media. No corrupt person could ever do that and all corrupt governments fear from free and independent media.
I could have never imagined that in any country, media could freely abuse people in power (on lies) and government does not act on that, something that is happening routinely in Pakistan. It seems that government has freed media but unfortunately has not brought any laws that can protect government or people from lies of media (that was necessary with free media). Well, I hope that with time, this would come.
Third most impressive thing that President Musharraf did was bringing Local government in Pakistan. The affect of local government can be seen everywhere in Pakistan. Anyone that lives in Pakistan can tell about their effects over the life of people.
Fourth most impressive reform that affected life of every family was ease of utility bill payment in Pakistan, as before Musharraf government, most had to que in front of particular bank (note: particular bank designated for the purpose) to pay their bill. Now, they can pay in many ways and at many different places, without much que.
Amongst some other reforms that are impressive (similar to them are numerous others):
Empowering women and giving them huge representation in all public offices. Result is that, today there are number of women MNAs, MPs, councillors, etc. They have taken many key positions in government departments and today Pakistan governor of state bank is a woman.
Education reform is impressive too, as today Pakistan education budget is many fold more then before and Pakistan that was producing handful of PhDs is now producing PhDs in thousands.
Well, the most important reform is financial sector reform where government has imposed on itself the limit that they can borrow. No corrupt political government could have done that.
Independence of State bank of Pakistan and banking system is another big reform that no corrupt government could ever do.
Now, government wants to make statistical bureau of Pakistan an independent body, something corrupt government would feel very disturb to do.
Well, government has already made judiciary an independent body. Today, even when there is corruption charges against CJP, government does nothing but sends that reference to SJC for investigation, that’s all.
[In Past, judiciary was subordinate of rulers and they used to use judiciary to legalise all their corruptions. Hence there was no accountability for people in judiciary. Today, when government is not bothered to use judiciary for their illegal purposes, they are trying to make judiciary accountable too. Thus, this is the first time in the history of Pakistan, that name of a judge is sent to SJC, as before accountability of judges were unheard of in Pakistan.]
Government is thinking to make CBR an independent body. If CBR would become an independent body then politicians in government would lose their biggest tool they use for corruption.
Using open bidding for privatisation and also for all licences and tenders is another reform that is commendable.
Apart of reforms, lot of work was done in the country at a great pace and within budget that was almost impossible before president Musharraf came to power. In the past, money in budget use to get into corrupts bank account but today, we see works done.
[Note: What I mentioned above is by no mean, end of the list of good works that happened during last 8 years of President Musharraf rule]
**
BB and NS:**
As for work done by BaiNazeer Bhutto and Nawaz Shareef: What I can say is that, most of their work was done keeping in mind, what they can gain financially from those work, and how they can become richer still, not in rupees but in dollars.
BaiNazeer was one of the most corrupt person ever came to power anywhere in the world. It was misfortune of Pakistan that someone like her came to power. Just imagine that echo of her story of corruption could be heard even in American senate to change their banking law.
[American senators changed American banking laws, after taking notice of BB, and her husband A A Zardari (Nusrat Bhutto name was also there) corruption stories and their using American bank to transfer illegally gained money to their Swiss account. e.g. doing money laundry using American Bank]
Further, British television made documentary on the corruption of both NS and BB many times and British newspaper wrote features on their corruption, numbers of time. It was an embarrassing situation for Pakistani community, to see their Prime Ministers occupying media coverage, not for anything good but corruption.
At my Job in UK, once my colleague told me that he could not understand how it is possible that Pakistanis could be so corrupt or idiots to choose such corrupts like BB and NS as Prime Minister? I told him jokingly that it is British legacy that they left Pakistanis as they are, corrupt and idiots (though one can imagine how I must be feeling at that time).*
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
^I'll agree with DC on this one. Nawaz indeed was quite a powerful prime minister.
:D :D We have a leagui here! lol leugie ki loo tikka kar!
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass then?
I am here to learn.
**YES lots of Goods and Funds were passed to their In Laws.......:D **
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
dawa_i_dil and realdeal, no farts from u guys ... comon guys, why so tongue tight
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
:D :D We have a leagui here! lol leugie ki loo tikka kar!
I am not a leagui, never voted for NS and never defened him. The point i made was that Nawaz was a powerful PM in second term and could have made new laws if he wanted to.
Now, do you want me to resort to type of language u are using, beleive me i will not disappoint you.
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
i guess ppl are busy on google to try and figure out what all did BB or NS did as leaders.
PS: I meant good stuff..not the reports of corruption which can be easily found in us senate remarks, british papers and swiss papers.
Re: What good laws did BB and Nawaz pass?
i guess ppl are busy on google to try and figure out what all did BB or NS did as leaders.
PS: I meant good stuff..not the reports of corruption which can be easily found in us senate remarks, british papers and swiss papers.
:D