Mirror newspaper, 16 July 2005
EXCLUSIVE: WAS IT SUICIDE?
Why did they buy return train tickets to Luton? Why did they buy pay & display tickets for cars? Why were there no usual shouts of ‘Allah Akhbar’? Why were bombs in bags and not on their bodies?
By Jeff Edwards
Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts…
Well myvoice, in an earlier thread I argued that the bombers were likely to have had no idea what was going to happen, and you argued that theywere likely to have known exactly what was going to happen.
If you have an open mind, let’s agree that the truth probably lies somewhere between our initial positions. Here’s an article stating that the investigation certainly is looking at that middle ground…
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[http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/tm_objectid=15742951%26method=full%26siteid=94762%26headline=exclusive%2d%2d58%2d%2dwas%2dit%2dsuicide%2d-name_page.html](http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/tm_objectid=15742951%26method=full%26siteid=94762%26headline=exclusive%2d%2d58%2d%2dwas%2dit%2dsuicide%2d-name_page.html)
*By Jeff Edwards*
THE London bombers may have been duped into killing themselves so their secrets stayed hidden.
Police and MI5 are probing if the four men were told by their al-Qaeda controller they had time to escape after setting off timers. Instead, the devices exploded immediately.
A security source said: “If the bombers lived and were caught they’d probably have cracked. Would their masters have allowed that to happen? We think not.”
**The evidence is compelling: The terrorists bought return rail tickets, and pay and display car park tickets, before boarding a train at Luton for London. None of the men was heard to cry "Allah Akhbar!" - "God is great" - usually screamed by suicide bombers as they detonate their bomb.**
Their devices were in large rucksacks which could be easily dumped instead of being strapped to their bodies. They carried wallets containing their driving licences, bank cards and other personal items. Suicide bombers normally strip themselves of identifying material.
Similar terror attacks against public transport in Madrid last year were carried out by recruits who had time to escape and planned to strike again.
**Bomber Hasib Hussain detonated his device at the rear of the top deck of a No 30 bus, not in the middle of the bottom deck where most damage would be caused.**
Additionally, two of the bombers had strong personal reasons for staying alive.
Jermaine Lindsay's partner Samantha Lewthwaite, 22, mother of his one-year-old son, is expecting her second baby within days. Mohammed Sidique Khan's wife Hasina, mum of a 14-month-old daughter, is also pregnant.
**Our source disclosed: "The theory that they were not a suicide squad is gathering pace. They were the weakest link.**
“We think it’s possible they were told that when they pressed buttons to set off timers they’d have a short time to abandon the bombs and get away before the blast. Instead, the bombs exploded immediately.”
Another intelligence source added: “Whoever is behind this didn’t want to waste their best operatives on a suicide mission. Instead they used easily recruited low-grade men who may have believed they’d walk away.”
At least 54 people were killed in the 7/7 blasts. Khan, 30, of Dewsbury, Shehzad Tanweer, 22, of Leeds, and Jamaican-born Lindsay, 19, of Aylesbury, Bucks, detonated devices on the Tube at Edgware Road, Aldgate and King’s Cross.
Hussain, 18, of Leeds, blasted the bus at Tavistock Square. The Tube explosions went off almost simultaneously. But the bus went up an hour later.
Yesterday, Hussain’s family told of their horror at the teenager’s involvement in the massacre. They said in a statement: "We are devastated over the events of the past few days. Hasib was a loving and normal young man who gave us no concern and we are having difficulty taking this in.
"Our thoughts are with all the bereaved families. We have to live with the loss of our son in these difficult circumstances.
“We had no knowledge of his activities and, had we done, we would have done everything in our power to stop him. We urge anyone with information to cooperate fully with the authorities.”
Police are urgently investigating the missing 81 minutes between Hussain arriving from Luton in London and the time his bomb went off.
His device may have malfunctioned. He may have lost his nerve. Or he may have panicked when he discovered the Northern Line, on which he is thought to have been due to travel, was suspended.
Officers want to discover if Hussain met anyone else who either strengthened his faltering resolve or reset his flawed bomb.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts...
there is yet another possibility which y'all are ignoring.. these were not suicide detonations.. these were timed explosions of sophisticated military grade (not home-made) explosives as all early reports suggested..
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts...
Findings leads to interseting end. At least this time it is not a design theory. And if true, it seems that the terrorist organizatin behind has pached up its earlier errors.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts...
Maddy:
This theory is one I could go along with. I think the unknowing and unwitting bomber theory is ridiculous. However, the minder telling the bombers that they would have time to escape before the explosion is plausible.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts...
It is possible they were not suicider but were told they would have time to escape....in fact no one who is born in England and had good life to go to univerasity and enjoy all normal things a teenager will have in England is so stupid to blow themselves up like that...they have tasted the good life...it is hard to committ suicide after that.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts...
They were carrying bombs and the intention was to spread terror and kill innocents. They are better off dead.
If things didn't go as planned then I am sure there is confusion among perpetrator's camp as well. I'm sure there are more like minded individuals..somebody may lose confidence, come forward and spill the secrets.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts…
A timer is a timer. It has no “grade”.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts...
^^ h no one is saying they were innocents..they were terrorists and fact that they got duped or their plan did not go as intended serves them right.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts...
the grade is in explosives.. u don't make military grade stuff at home in an apartment.. unless you work for the military..
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts…
You have no idea what you’re talking about, do you?
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts…
No he doesn’t. No one has said they ** made ** military grade explosives in their kitchen. If it was military grade, speculation has been that it was acuired in the Balkans and smuggled into GB.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts…
not that you’d know.. most people post here to contribute something.. why don’t u wait it out till u have something worthwile to add? we’ll call one u when we want to know that a timer is a timer ok?
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts…
Contributing is good, as long as it remains within the realm of reality. Explosives are commonly used by construction crews in large projects and are not some military only thing.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts...
since we're discussing in context of the bombings in London and the news reports that followed, the explosives used were described as "commercial/military" grade.. or simply.. "very powerful" and with that came the early conclusions that they couldn't have been homemade.. i.e. pieced together using ingredients from the neighborhood pharmacy.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts...
Some may accuse me of denial but i have doubts about the "official version" of this story.
Suicide bombers of two types:
One those who have experienced loss of family members,friends like those in Palestine or Tamil Tigers
Second,those who are extensively brainwashed for quite sometime b4 they are ready for such attacks.
These four did not fit into any of the types.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts...
one thing i will say dont defend your self.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts...
Well I'm too lazy to read all the posts in this thread.
I do have my questions.
How many people get on trains carrying backpacks everyday in the U.K.?
Just because a camera captured somewhat eastern looking men carrying backpacks ... how does that prove that those are the men responsible?
How many Brits of Pakistani origin ... have family they go home to visit?
Because the men visited Pakistan..does that prove they are terror-bombers?
If the men suicide bombed the train...what kind of evidence would be left as proof?
Any guppies live in Leeds? If yes. Are you afraid of going to public places? Or taking trains?
If as they say..terrorists intentions are to create fear... we can all fight them by not being afraid.
Just as you'd stand up to a bully.
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts...
[quote]
Well I'm too lazy to read all the posts in this thread..
[/QUOTE]
I do have my questions.
How many people get on trains carrying backpacks everyday in the U.K.?
** -many
- BUT it is very unsual for the 4 buddies leaving together from Leed then go 4 separate ways, and all being found at train/bus in the EYE (nearest to the origin)of the explosion. **
Just because a camera captured somewhat eastern looking men carrying backpacks ... how does that prove that those are the men responsible?
** - what's an "eastern" looking men??? Anyways, one of them was jamaican. **
How many Brits of Pakistani origin ... have family they go home to visit?
** - many **
Because the men visited Pakistan..does that prove they are terror-bombers?
** -NO
- but there is enough news to suggest that most of them had been exposed to exteremist ideology (google it for link, I am too LAZY to do it for you) had been in touch with a "church" bomber in islambad. One of the terrorist's uncle in pakistan also mentioned that he had indicated "extremist" views while staying at their place (today's dailytimes.com.pk has an article, too lazy to post link). **
If the men suicide bombed the train...what kind of evidence would be left as proof?
** - their blown up bodies, you may be able to contact Jannat and check if they are screwing the houries.
- it is quite LIKELY that some of them were DUPPED in believing that they will have enough time to escape after they pull the trigger. I had read an article in an English newspaper that interviewed a surviver of the bus blast. He said that he remembered one of the bomber frantically searching through his back pack before the explosion(may be he accidentlly trigerred it and could not stop it?? Not much time between trigger activation and explotion??). Once again, you may try googling it as I am too LAZY but the article was in 1st 2 days of the explosion. **
Any guppies live in Leeds? If yes. Are you afraid of going to public places? Or taking trains?
** -yes, many guppies live there and some of them are "brain washed".
- yes, they do go to public place and travel by public transport.
- No guppies are not afraid BUT other people are afraid when Guppies go out
**
If as they say..terrorists intentions are to create fear... we can all fight them by not being afraid.
** -Amen **
Just as you'd stand up to a bully
Re: Were they suicide bombers? Investigators having doubts…
^