Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
Debater nay farmaya
*So, if the hair, the lips and the chest are beauty then they should be covered. Or not? *
okay, so is niqab a requirment? or is it a requirment only for good looking women, and ugly ones can just cover their hair?
is the command to cover the bosom, cover the hair and the bosom, cover al that and the face?
what is it? refer back to my point that it is not really very clear, and there are also conflicting hadeeth on this topic.
Though there is a relaxation that in terms of *except what appears thereof *which might be the shape of her body, WAllahu A'lam.
(this forum is bakwas as we don't have size options for text)
maybe designers knew that ppl would make obscenely large text to make their point rather than just make their point solely on the strength of the point itself :)
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
If many people call a lady ugly, Allah doesn't call her ugly, and I believe there must be at least one person in the world who wouldn't call an ugly looking lady ugly but the person might call her beautiful, the person might be her mother or father of husband or any Fraudia one (lol).
Then some ladies have beautiful figures, some don't.
So those who don't have beautiful figures are allowed to walk naked in the streets?
Because they have an excuse to have an ugly figure?
This is Allah who decides what is the beauty of a woman, not the woman herself.
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
wasim thank you for your graciousness, the goal is not to score points, but to have a discussion and share. from what i know the verses do not talk about covering te hair. further more they dont really talk about covering the face..which is done by a lot of people believing that is the directive.
I am in 100% support that modesty is key to men and women both, and that there is guidance, but specifics are really not stated in the quran, and just the hadeeth, and the possibility exists that hadeeth can be wrong, conflicting, fabricated, added on to, edited etc etc. Unless we feel that mulsim and bokhari etc were above making errors, had all the info available to them to make a call, and that no errors could have slipped in. With much due respect to these two gentlemen, I would argue that they were not divinely guided to be 100 accurate. While they did us all a favour by tossing out many many many fabricated or modified hadeeth, they could not have been 100% accurate.
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
your attemot at using my nick Fraudia is really not doing much. if the intent is to try and flame me because you dont have answers then thats one thing
so yet again…does islam require covering the face? or does it not require covering the face?
are we clear on that or no? is it just the hair, or is it the face also? where does it say that. are all the women in hijab wrng because they dont cover their faces..or the people who make covering the face a requirement wrong because they are adding something to religion that is not there.
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
Islam which we know today has reached us from generation to generation through reports and verbal transmission. Agree?
If you accept a hadith from Bukhari then you be accepting one witness, if the same hadith or similar hadiths are presented by other compilers of hadith then you have more witnesses. Or not?
To reject Bukhari and all other books of hadith you should have a parrallel and opposing reporting system. Do you have one?
Why would we accept the witness of a Kafir and Zindeeq Rashad Khalifah compared to a great number of witnesses which go against your views?
Then how can you decide that so and so hadith is fake or fabricated?
Do you have any scientific way of investigation to scrutinize hadith work?
Without scrutiny, you can't make any claims which you are not able to prove.
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
I am having fun with your nick.
Is it allowed?
[quote]
so yet again...does islam require covering the face? or does it not require covering the face?
are we clear on that or no? is it just the hair, or is it the face also? where does it say that. are all the women in hijab wrng because they dont cover their faces..or the people who make covering the face a requirement wrong because they are adding something to religion that is not there.
answers please..
[/quote]
Yes, here is your answer; If something is not explained in Quran al Karim then it means that Allah made somethings for the Prophet to explain.
This is where you have to accept the importance of hadith and sunnah.
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
Debater :k:
Haha, I knew straightaway that our resident mod muslims wouldn’t let this go without a fight.
By the way, there was another bikao scholar on sky news the other night, a spoksemen for islamic council of UK or something, and he was very insistent that the authorities should “conduct special searches and screening of individuals who look like me” at the airport.
If only they spent such monumental efforts to please God instead of the West…too bad for some it’s the same thing.
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
Debater nay question dodge kiya aur farmaya
*Islam which we know today has reached us from generation to generation through reports and verbal transmission. Agree? *
indeed..
*If you accept a hadith from Bukhari then you be accepting one witness, if the same hadith or similar hadiths are presented by other compilers of hadith then you have more witnesses. Or not? *
1- it does not solve the problem of conflicting hadeeth
2- you dont really know if the arratiosn thru diff witnesses is accurate still
3- you can not still guarantee that all witnesses thru this chain did not make any changes intentionally or unintentionally
4- Allah has not said he would protect the hadeeth, just Quran.
*To reject Bukhari and all other books of hadith you should have a parrallel and opposing reporting system. Do you have one? *
what d you do when bokhari itself labels hadeeth as weak? or there ae conflicting hadeeth. i dont have a parallel reporting system..I like other muslims follow the same guidance, however I do feel we should not take hadeeth as word of god, becausr its not, and for all we know it may not even be the word of the prophet.
Why would we accept the witness of a Kafir and Zindeeq Rashad Khalifah compared to a great number of witnesses which go against your views?
I am not accepting the word of rashad khalifah, nor do I know who this person is/was and what his deal is, so he is inconsequential to this discussion. As far as my views go, i dont have any..all i am saying is that there are conflicting viewpoints out there, show me which is the right one, which you have not done yet.
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
Debater nay farmaya
*I am having fun with your nick.
Is it allowed? *
yeah until it is taken as a personal attack and then gets your ass banned :) may wanna be careful
Yes, here is your answer; If something is not explained in Quran al Karim then it means that Allah made somethings for the Prophet to explain.
This is where you have to accept the importance of hadith and sunnah.
who says i doubt the importance of hadeeth and sunnah. I 100% believe that hadeetha nd sunnah is critical, however, it is not 100% accurate and error proof...is it?
that is why there are different schools of thought and different intepretations, not by myself, but by scholars, not now but for ages, on very diverse topics.
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
Hadith is a science, it has methods to deal with conflicting reports. Not a big deal.
I agree, you can't believe in a hadith with close eyes, even scholars of hadith dont' say so, some hadiths are reliable in the eyes of some scholars but the same hadith is not reliable to others. BUT
there are indeed hadiths on which all scholars or whole Ummah are / is united.
Which means all people accept them.
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
its not a question of I would, I do. I had stated earlier that this is not about personal beliefs but an academic curiosity. the more I know the more I can share wit others..
but
coflicting hadeeth are still an issue for me
and
the probability that some hadeeth is erroneous still exists..now we can do our best in trying to make sense, do what we think is right and take the safe path and leave it to Allah to forgive us if we have made a mistake, but it should not stop us from asking questions, learning or investigating.
and really bhai. i need to sleep..ja so ja. kal khelein gaye..
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
kabhi hadees kay mauzoo per, zindagi rahi, to baat kareingay, chalo jao so jao, kya yaad karo gay kis ghareeb say paala para tha jo na khud sota hai na sonay deta hai
kahoon kis say main kay kya hai
gup shup buri bala hai
mujhay kya bura tha sona
agar aik bar hota
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
This is still inconclusive, though I would admit I am leaning towards Fraudz's point of view. Can anyone pls post some Ahadith which require women to cover their head since Qur'an does not require it as such? I think that would be more helpful instead of indulging in personal insults.
Re: Wearing Of Hijab Not Required By Quran: Egyptian Scholar
I am not against, your point of view, but i appreciate, if you could explain to me the below ayat of Quran in detail or atleast red colored words.
024.031 And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husband’s fathers, their sons, their husbands’ sons, their brothers or their brothers’ sons, or their sisters’ sons, or their women, or the slaves whom their right hands possess, or male servants free of physical needs, or small children who have no sense of the shame of sex; and that they should not strike their feet in order to draw attention to their hidden ornaments. And O ye Believers! turn ye all together towards Allah, that ye may attain Bliss.
