We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

Society Pakistan & World Affairs
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After all, that’s why tribals want: withdrawal. Why not give them what they want?

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2007\08\15\story_15-8-2007_pg1_11

Tribesmen mark Aug 14 as ‘black day’

  • Demand army pull out of tribal areas
  • No Independence Day ceremonies in Swat due to security fears

By Akhtar Amin

PESHAWAR: Many people in the tribal areas marked August 14 as a “black day”, in protest at the stepped up military presence in the region near the Pak-Afghan border.

Many tribesmen in Khyber Agency and 25 disputed villages adjacent to Mohmand Agency observed the 60th Independence Day by hoisting black flags on their homes. Similarly, tribesmen in South Waziristan, North Waziristan and Bajuar agencies did not observe Independence Day due to the military’s operations in the tribal areas, though the political administrations in all seven tribal agencies hoisted the national flag during ceremonies amid tight security.

“For the first time in the country’s history, numerous tribesmen did not celebrate Independence Day. There were no selling and buying of national flags and other relevant things in North Waziristan,” Haji Gul Noor from Miranshah told Daily Times. “This could be a reaction to military operations and the Taliban may have forbidden tribesmen to celebrate the day,” he added.

In Khyber Agency, thousands of armed activists of the Lashkar-e-Islami (LI), a militant organisation, staged a rally demanding that the government release their leader Mufti Munir Shakir and withdraw the army from the tribal areas.

On the LI’s call, residents of Bara tehsil in Khyber Agency hoisted black flags on their houses as a mark of protest on Independence Day. Similarly, on the call of the Mohmand Resistance Movement (MRM), residents of 25 disputed villages adjacent to Mohmand Agency also observed August 14 as a black day.

The MRM’s Prof Ayaz said villagers were observing the black day because the government separated the 25 villages from Mohmand Agency and included them in settled areas some eights years ago, “against the villagers’ will”. He demanded the government re-include the villages in Mohmand Agency and withdraw troops from all tribal agencies.

In Swat, Independence Day celebrations were non-existent due to security concerns. Swat District Coordination Officer (DCO) Mohammad Javed told Daily Times that the Swat administration avoided arranging any Independence Day ceremonies for security reasons.

The FATA Grand Alliance staged a ‘peace march’ from Khyber House to the Peshawar Press Club. Led by its convener, Abdul Karim Mehsud, tribesmen from all seven agencies carried banners and placards demanding the withdrawal of the army from the tribal agencies, as well as restoration of peace.

The Peshawar district government observed an Independence Day ceremony at police lines. Due to recent suicide attacks and bomb blasts, most people in NWFP remained indoors, rather than come out onto the streets to celebrate.

“How can we celebrate Independence Day when the government has not made appropriate arrangements towards this end?” said Salim Khan at Saddar.

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

Honestly, while I understand their frustrations, I find it hard to sympathize with barbaric tribal and feudal culture. I honestly see very little in common between me, my people and most of the people of Balochistan, NWFP and FATA.

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2007\08\15\story_15-8-2007_pg7_6

Quetta rally marks ‘black day’ on Aug 14

By Malik Siraj Akbar

QUETTA: Hundreds of Baloch women and children marched in the streets of Quetta on Tuesday to mark Independence Day as a “black day” and protested against the increasing number of alleged disappearances and the military operation in the province.

Baloch women and children carried out a protest rally in the provincial capital on the eve of Independence Day. Among the protestors were housewives, social workers, lawyers, and human rights activists. A large number of school-going children and Baloch Students’ Organisation (BSO) activists also joined them.

Organised by the Baloch Women Panel (BWP), the protest rally started from Zarghoon Road amid a heavy presence of law enforcement agencies’ personnel. The rally traversed Shahra-e-Iqbal and ended at Mizan Chowk.

The protestors chanted slogans against the government, military operations in the province and the alleged disappearances of around 4,000 Baloch people. They also shouted slogans in favor of the Balochistan Liberation Army (BLA) and termed it as their “sole helper”.

Carrying the photographs of missing Baloch people, the protestors chanted anti-Pakistan slogans and demanded “freedom”. They complained that they didn’t have any right to celebrate August 14, as “ the federation was mistreating them”.

“It’s the biggest rally ever by Baloch women in the province’s history since 1974,” Dr Hakeem Lehri, a veteran Baloch nationalist leader and the president of the Balochistan National Congress, told Daily Times. With veiled faces and sporting black ribbons on their arms, some of the young activists tried to burn the national flag. However, they were prevented from doing so by their senior leaders, who called it “an indecent way of protest”. A woman participant told Daily Times that Baloch people were subjected to a military regime. Therefore, it was mandatory for women to get out of their homes and support Baloch fighters in the mountains, she added.

“We can’t celebrate August 14 when thousands of Baloch are missing,” she said, alleging that law enforcement agencies carried out an operation in the Mand area and killed a young Baloch doctor, Khalid Baloch, and three others. Such measures would add to the Baloch hatred against the country, she observed.

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

^^ So, how did your independence day go?

Did you wave the MQM flag or the pakistani flag or both? :faizy:

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

This time both but back in 1998 they forced the people not to hoist Pak flag on Independence day.

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

Israeli flag obviously. As a fellow Mossad agent, why do you even have to ask? :faizy:

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

When did raising israeli flags became responsibility of Mossad? :faizy:

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

With regard to Balochistan, the restraint ordered by the protest's leader with regard to not burning symbols of Pakistan (the flag) must be lauded.

As for FATA... I reiterate my belief that the FATA should granted full independence (in which case Afghanistan would probably move to annex it) or ceded outright to Kabul as a symbol of friendship in exchange for a formal recognition of the border.

The end result would be that Kabul's puppetmasters would be unleashed on those in the FATA who would seek to use violence.

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

Who else? ISI?

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

Bad idea, down the road Kabul will ask for more... Leave FARTA as it is, it won't make any difference if its with us or Kabul because the border is non existant anyway.

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

No giving away territory. They should bomb FATA into the stone age. Nerve gas, WP, UD shells the works. Let them crawl and see how insignificant they are.

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

^^ I agree. INVADE the scums.

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

You cannot invade your own nation. But Gvt of P. must crush these SoB's! Women and children too if thats whats required. No holding back. It it well known that Pak had chemical and biological weapons before signing the CBW/CCW and could quickly and easily muster up some cool stuff for these clowns.

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

Wow! Are you in a hurry to call Condi your queen and W your master?Last time mustard gas was used by a country on its own people, the dictator was deposed by Condi Bush.Can't believe how cavalier people talk about FATA, Baloochi people. Disgusting that that you can even joke about killing children you perverts!

Telephone
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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

Force is not the answer beside these tribal folks are know to fight back, just look at their history... Before it was Brits and Soviets with a far bigger force and now Amreekans who have survived so far because of split between pashtoons and Northern drug pushers. I doubt anything will change anytime soon the more things change the more they stay the same, in a nutshell that is Afganistan and FARTA.

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

a serious effort for peace should be made, the first option is offer them the same deal as offered in 2001 to stop harbouring international terrorists. i dont see anything wrong with this deal should it be accepted. the problem is it wont be accepted by the amerians or taliban. americans are themselves in no rush to find peaceful solutions. the fact that non of their initial objectives have been attained leaves the mission open to conspiracy theories. 6 years on it is now time to talk

if the afghan situation is resolved then the pakistani taliban will also follow the peace accord

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

^Honestly, sick of this tribal myth... The Soviets only lost becuse the tribals got support from the Americans... Prior to the Americans supporting them with American training, and the stinger missles in particular, the Mujahideen werent doing to well... The Americans wiped the Taliban of the face of Afghanistan in a week, and the only reason they havent finished these idiots off is because they are able to hide in Pakistan, and because Bush was stupid enough to focus everything on a country that had nothing to do with the problem and hence gave the Tribal Taliban goons the recpite they needed...
These Tribals are a war like people, but they are far from invincible...

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

These tribals are not tht war-loving as it may seems to be, if any one can give them other "hobbies" they will be more than happy to accept them. but being and backward area with no proper education system and lacking business opportuniy, open borders with a war-torn country has driven them at this level.

Govt. of Pakistan has to seal the border with Afhganistan, so problem maker won't be able to come here easily. and then solve the issue with the locals, i am sure majority of the tribal leaders don't want niether they promote violence, it is minority ( like in Karachi, a viloence in beause of MQM) which is calling themselves taliban and creating the chaos as MQM did in late 80s and early 90s.

We need to deal with these violant people in same maner we dealt with the terrorists of MQM.

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

^i agree. terrorists cannot be given havens. i also suspect not all taliban are terrorists, if the influential people agree to deals then the henchmen will obey. the problem is seperating the kayda people from the taliban, who we all know are a different kettle of fish and can only be killed for peace

i think this was a reply to abdali, but let me put my point across about the extermination of pashtoons. if the desired fight against taliban is to go on an all out killing spree then that can be done. taliban have very little in terms of defence.
should an approach be taken up then that leaves the pashtoons with very little to live for. the result of which is an all out terror campaign by them in afghanistan and pakistan. more beheadings, more suicide bombs etc. till their extermination they will go on fighting. the chances of other communities joining in also increases. the precedent set will be mirrored across the world, say goodbye to palestinians, iraqis and iranians for sure!

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

This is a stupid article which is short on actual details and facts, and large on generalisations, which is quite deliberately aimed at painting all the Pashtun people of FATA as traitors. The FATA territories consist of 7 tribal agencies, and over 3.5 million people, yet this article is referring only to a few places and instances, from which it then goes onto make sweeping statements against “many people in the tribal areas”. What a load of BS.

Yeh, some people in the areas adjoining Afghanistan maybe pretty angry with the govt, but then they are also angry at the Afghans, and their own tribal elders as well, for the situation in which they are in the middle of. Historically it was the Pashtun tribals of FATA which were the most ardent pro-Pakistani’s and liberated Azad Kashmir, as well fighting alongside the Pak Army in the 65 and 71 wars, and I am pretty sure most of them still are, even if they are angry at the present govt or whatever. I don’t see these people waving Afghan flags or swearing allegiance to Kabul or whatever, so we should quit making such angry statements of kicking them out of Pakistan, invading them or leaving them to the mercy of the American’s and such nonsense. Instead we should just merge FATA with NWFP, then have new provincial elections, and from there I am sure any “mscreants” in the area will be finally taken care of.

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Re: We should take down Pak flags and withdraw from FATA

^^
I really think that its now 60 years and fate of FATA is hanging on ‘not-so-committed Pakistan territory’ where Pakistan laws does not exists and they are treated as part Pakistani and part independent. It is ridiculous situation that has to end. Because of FATA, border of Pakistan with Afghanistan is also unmanageable and unsecured as people cross the border at will.

Obviously one cannot force anyone to be with Pakistan or not with Pakistan. It is claimed that these people were also given a promise by Quaid-e-Azam that they would be treated as half Pakistani, where they are independent as well as part of Pakistan.

Hence for the best of Pakistan as well as for these people, there should be a referendum in those parts (individual agencies separately) asking them to be part of Pakistan or be part of Afghanistan. It should be their choice and this should not become a problem of national honour (just like India is making in Kashmir).

If these people vote to be part of Pakistan, they should get annexed with province ‘Sarhad’ or should be given a provincial status of their own (actually other provinces should be divided into several provinces too, maybe Pakistan should have 12 to 15 provinces). After that, all laws of Pakistan should be imposed there with vigour and make FATA comply with Pakistani laws (whatever that may be). After that, Pakistan should move Pakistan army in FATA and crush any resistance forcefully, extending control to the border and make sure no unlawful border crossing happens.

[We should realise that as part of a nation, one sometime have to accept things one may not like or may not want, and that is true for all the people in the country. For instance, I would like to keep a machine gun with me all the time but law of the country does not allow that, so being citizen of the country, I have to give it up else I would go into prison],

If they vote to be part of Afghanistan, Pakistan should withdraw Pakistan army from there and hand over that territory to Afghanistan. After that, it would be duty and responsibility of Afghanistan government to defend that territory, look after the well being of that area and deal with them. Pakistan after that can have complete control over the border with Afghanistan (FATA being part of Afghanistan) and could make crossing the border unlawful and difficult (with heavy punishment).

I think this has to happen one day as status of FATA cannot be left in limbo. FATA has special status where the territory cannot be considered as completely Pakistan territory, as writ of Pakistan government is not followed there neither Pakistan judiciary has any jurisdiction there. This situation has to stop as it can only destabilise Pakistan, destabilise Afghanistan and also would stop any development of FATA and people living there. If such referendum would happen and action would be taken according to referendum, it would be good for Pakistan, Afghanistan, as well as people of FATA.