We are all hindus now: NewsWeek

[diwana]

Would you pls tell me then whats the importance of wearing cross?f it is just a mean of showing respect,then why should millions of Christians wear it on a daily basis and what about nuns and other preachers?I did my schooling from a Christian Convent and till this I did not have this newly `discoverd' knowledge that Cross was st a mean for respect.Hope you are not drifting away from making sensible comments ,my friend.!!!

For muslims, Jews and many chriatians worshiping has very specific meaning and respect alone is not equal to worshiping. They are not going to accept your way of worshiping. They will never accept monkeys, snake, cow or other creations to be their Gods.

Cross is a respectable symbol or a reminder, not God or worthy of 'worship' by itself' by christians. Same is Star of David, Kaaba for muslims.

You did not name ,but you meant.Thanks fo admitting it.

Admitting what? Did I ever deny anything? I said your God and you mentioned his name.

God doesn't hide clothes and look for naked women, in Islam or other related religions. I am only speaking of God here, worthy of worship.

You said abbou killing of Budhists in India and this is a whole new kind of information for all of us.You would have spotted a few instances of religious riots happened in India ,but hope you are also aware of whats happening in Pakistan where minority religious harassment finds no ends.Remember what had happened in the last week of July and that was the third attack against Christians in just two months time!!! Hope you are cleaning your home before peeping over to others.

Please read aout how berhamans made budhism disappear. Now very little if any budhism left in its country of origin. All blame is now being placed on muslims.

Since when we started taking about Pakistan??? Would you please try other so many threads for this discussion? I thought you started this thread.

I am sure you have got just state fed info about Hindusim and thats why you are making statements on Kamsautra and half nudity.Hope we will have some meaningful talks next time. If this is the way you are taking this discussion,I think it's better I should not waste my precuous time debating with you.

I have already mentined this forum is not capable of handling the what hinduism promotes in term of nudity. You on the other hand tried to take advantage and took the meaning of my earlier statement to your benefit. :-)

I cannot post hinduism pictures or description here including those of statues doing the acts carved on temples.

I had a discussion with a christian from India a while ago and this person used the word 'disgusting' for hinduism. Enough said.

From when you did start your affinity for Christians and Jews?I simply fail to understan what has prompted you to make statements about Hindus mingling with Christans and Jews?Are you talking from the code of existence of minorities in Pakistan?Then I am sorry my friend.Minorities in India live happily with Hindus and thanks to your concern for them.But pls ask your government to take care of Hindus,Christians,Ahmedis and other minorities of Pakistan.Hope we will not hear more bad news for them soon.

Affinity? Do you not know Quran talks more abouth them than any other prophets or time period.

You again talk about politics or Pakistan? We are discussing religion and how hinduism is not compatible with christianity, Jews or muslims.

These three may inter-convert or revert. But Hinduism? Your far fetch dream or hope.

My Muslim friend is happy to live in India and he does not share the same view of yours about India and Hindus :) .He lives happily and peacefully in india and he knows the realities or does not want to take in the `state sponsored milk products of his western neighbour'. :) . That state simply can not protect the interests,guarntee the safety and security of it's own majority of people,let alone the minorities.My friend knows this aswell :)

Enough of your friendship with muslim. Great!

Please do not mix politics and your hatred with Pakistan here.

We know how peaceful errrr.........pieceful India is.

By the way, respecting religion does not mean accepting it.

[diwana]

Diwana what is the point of your last few posts in this page. Is it actually to show that Americans are converting to Islam more. I think you are very insecure and lack faith in your religion.

LOL!

Nope. it was to show, hinduism is 'still' not so attractive for majority Americans compared to islam. The claim in this thread has been false from beginning.

[diwana]

Really , so why do u go there. Why do you pray to that side and why you dont even go to toilet facing that direction. I guess you need to look up what the meaning of worship is. If indeed God created everything, then religion is also created by God ( which I dont believe). So I guess all religion should be equal right. So why bother.

Muslims go there as it was told to do. Also, they go there to get connected to past.
They also go there to see there what once was the beginning of the end.

Yes all religions are equal, but not the same nor they are correct.

*1 pound of arsenic is equal to 1 pound of sugar, but they are not the same!
*

[Arleitter]

For muslims, Jews and many chriatians worshiping has very specific meaning and respect alone is not equal to worshiping. They are not going to accept your way of worshiping. They will never accept monkeys, snake, cow or other creations to be their Gods.

Cross is a respectable symbol or a reminder, not God or worthy of 'worship' by itself' by christians. Same is Star of David, Kaaba for muslims.

Admitting what? Did I ever deny anything? I said your God and you mentioned his name.

God doesn't hide clothes and look for naked women, in Islam or other related religions. I am only speaking of God here, worthy of worship.

Please read aout how berhamans made budhism disappear. Now very little if any budhism left in its country of origin. All blame is now being placed on muslims.

Since when we started taking about Pakistan??? Would you please try other so many threads for this discussion? I thought you started this thread.

I have already mentined this forum is not capable of handling the what hinduism promotes in term of nudity. You on the other hand tried to take advantage and took the meaning of my earlier statement to your benefit. :-)

I cannot post hinduism pictures or description here including those of statues doing the acts carved on temples.

I had a discussion with a christian from India a while ago and this person used the word 'disgusting' for hinduism. Enough said.

Affinity? Do you not know Quran talks more abouth them than any other prophets or time period.

You again talk about politics or Pakistan? We are discussing religion and how hinduism is not compatible with christianity, Jews or muslims.

These three may inter-convert or revert. But Hinduism? Your far fetch dream or hope.

Enough of your friendship with muslim. Great!

Please do not mix politics and your hatred with Pakistan here.

We know how peaceful errrr.........pieceful India is.

By the way, respecting religion does not mean accepting it.

Wrong.I have clarified with  a Roman Catholic friend about the importance of cross,and he has clarified saying that cross is above the notion of respect .Your definition is not a factual one.

I said God's name because I know the name.

The particular incident can not be explained in your materialistic term and you can just give here state sponsored narrations,for which I am not interested to have a debate with you.

Again you are using your state sponsored programmes.There may have been instances of Hindus had qurelled with Budhists or viceversa centuries ago but a wide range of progrom has never happened in India,just as it happened with Hindus and Christians in Pakistan.

I am not the thread starter.

Do not again tell us your nudity spotting in Hindusim.Hinduism is an ancient religion and came in to existence much before any other prominent religion was born and it has gone through all kinds of metamorphosis.Many Hindu temples have this carving ,and it is because these carvings were depicting the contemporary life of the people and the Kings.We Hindus Indians and others have no problem in accepting this but if it hurts Pakistanis(I mean radical),we are helpless.

My far fetch dream?For what? I can just laugh at it.

I can see how Christians and Jews are being mistreated at the hands of radical Muslims acorss the world.Now just for the sake of continuing this discussion,pls do not spread reverse infos.Pls ask Jews and Christians ,who are mistreating them.

You said pieceful India and you underlined it.Pls go through the history of Pakistan and also see whats going on there now.I do not want to comment more about it.Again it's your far fetched dream. :) Just remember what was the slogan of Muslim League of Pakistan after partition.But ended up losing half the portion in less than 25 years of time.

Here in India,we live happily with other other communities.We take part in each other's religious festivals and rituals.I am surprised to see the extent of Religious Bigotism in this thread.It's all new for Indians.

Again your speaking about things which are not related to this thread?Hatred for Pakistan?Where did I mention it?Just by mentioning the fact,how it becomes a hatred one?I do not get the logic behind it.

[vineshvk]

Muslims go there as it was told to do. Also, they go there to get connected to past. They also go there to see there what once was the beginning of the end.

Yes all religions are equal, but not the same nor they are correct.

1 pound of arsenic is equal to 1 pound of sugar, but they are not the same!

may be it was the reason previously. But not now. Its a religious travell for holy purposes.

Who said which religion is right and which is wrong. What is the proof that one religion is better than the other.

[afishcurry]

@kakaballi

So... as you move away from religion you become more hindu?

As you move away from the concept of jealous God which accepts recogntion worship only in certain waywhere any other ways of recognition is advocated as path to hell-fire.. The moment mankind releases god from the clutches of jealousy in his trait one automatically becomes someone from sanatan dharma

Hidnu buddhist jain whatever you call it..

[diwana]

Wrong.I have clarified with a Roman Catholic friend about the importance of cross,and he has clarified saying that cross is above the notion of respect .Your definition is not a factual one.

I said God's name because I know the name.

The particular incident can not be explained in your materialistic term and you can just give here state sponsored narrations,for which I am not interested to have a debate with you.

Again you are using your state sponsored programmes.There may have been instances of Hindus had qurelled with Budhists or viceversa centuries ago but a wide range of progrom has never happened in India,just as it happened with Hindus and Christians in Pakistan.

I am not the thread starter.

Do not again tell us your nudity spotting in Hindusim.Hinduism is an ancient religion and came in to existence much before any other prominent religion was born and it has gone through all kinds of metamorphosis.Many Hindu temples have this carving ,and it is because these carvings were depicting the contemporary life of the people and the Kings.We Hindus Indians and others have no problem in accepting this but if it hurts Pakistanis(I mean radical),we are helpless.

My far fetch dream?For what? I can just laugh at it.

I can see how Christians and Jews are being mistreated at the hands of radical Muslims acorss the world.Now just for the sake of continuing this discussion,pls do not spread reverse infos.Pls ask Jews and Christians ,who are mistreating them.

You said pieceful India and you underlined it.Pls go through the history of Pakistan and also see whats going on there now.I do not want to comment more about it.Again it's your far fetched dream. :) Just remember what was the slogan of Muslim League of Pakistan after partition.But ended up losing half the portion in less than 25 years of time.

Here in India,we live happily with other other communities.We take part in each other's religious festivals and rituals.I am surprised to see the extent of Religious Bigotism in this thread.It's all new for Indians.

Again your speaking about things which are not related to this thread?Hatred for Pakistan?Where did I mention it?Just by mentioning the fact,how it becomes a hatred one?I do not get the logic behind it.

What is above the notion of respect? Still worshiping in the sense of assuming it God himself, is not what Christians believe. But as a hinduism believer you seem to see their respect as worship. Its just that simple.

Sorry, I did not check who started thread. Even then politics should not be the part of your discussion either. You keep jumping in to Pakistan India debate here for obviously having no other point to discuss.

Thanks for trying to explain nudity and hinduism deep connection. I dont think even christians or jews would accept the amount of nudity or sexual statues or portraits related to hinduism. The historians or travelleers from west when landed on Indian subcontinent were simply ashamed of the scenes carved on temples. So you can shove the comment of Pakistani so called radiacals commnet where it belongs. You say hindus accept it. Thanks for admitting but I can bet even you would not like to show those acts to someone you might know in life. Who is bigot then?

Materialistic? So watching bunch of nude women, hiding their clothes in the lake is not materialism? That is weirdest kind of spirituality!

Ever heard of killings and harrasing of christians in the hand of hindu terrorists? Just search the info if it s news to you. There are crimes against other minoroties as well you might find in the hands of hindus. Just spend some time there.

Dude! Pieceful was meant to say India loves to and work very hard to make its neighbor divided. Indian evil role in its neighboring countries is not hidden from anyone.

state sponsored again? Anything which tells fact to you is 'state sponsored'?

[psyah]

Re: We are all hindus now: NewsWeek

Peace All

I would actually like to make an important distinction here. After the advent of Islam and some generations later. All areas of the world which perform explicit Shirk died away.

That is, all people say essentially that God is One and including Hindus they say the worship of One God is undertaken in the symbolism of many forms of God. To be led astray in big matters no, but in small matters yes.

In this respect many people including Muslims will associate partnership to Allah (SWT) in one or more of His Attributes. Or consider oneness with an illogical slant. Over reverence and over adoration leading people to plead and ask from those entities is Shirk, but it is not the overt form. Even in Hindu culture the idols themselves are no longer considered gods, but they once were especially in pagan Arabia.

If we look at the impact Islam has had on all cultures even the array of Hindu religions you will see that open shirk is no longer the norm. Outward behaviours are misleading it is what people believe on the inside that counts. It is a world of difference to hear people saying that Ganesh and Hanuman are personnifications of Attributes of God rather than two different gods.

[diwana]

Peace All

I would actually like to make an important distinction here. After the advent of Islam and some generations later. All areas of the world which perform explicit Shirk died away.

That is, all people say essentially that God is One and including Hindus they say the worship of One God is undertaken in the symbolism of many forms of God. To be led astray in big matters no, but in small matters yes.

In this respect many people including Muslims will associate partnership to Allah (SWT) in one or more of His Attributes. Or consider oneness with an illogical slant. Over reverence and over adoration leading people to plead and ask from those entities is Shirk, but it is not the overt form. Even in Hindu culture the idols themselves are no longer considered gods, but they once were especially in pagan Arabia.

If we look at the impact Islam has had on all cultures even the array of Hindu religions you will see that open shirk is no longer the norm. Outward behaviours are misleading it is what people believe on the inside that counts. It is a world of difference to hear people saying that Ganesh and Hanuman are personnifications of Attributes of God rather than two different gods.

Good analogy!

[Punjabee_in_USA]

Even in Hindu culture the idols themselves are no longer considered gods, but they once were especially in pagan Arabia.

Thank you :) I am glad not everyone is ignorant...

The only correction I would like to make is that idols were **never **considered Gods in Hinduism. Some Hindus with peripheral understanding of Hinduism might have incorrectly thought so, but thats not different than a Muslim mis-understanding Islam or a Christian mis-understanding Christianity.

[Obama]

One big ecological advantage USA would get from converting to Hinduism.............

All them Cows will be Holy Now..........:)

McDonalds will be out of business unless they serve vege burgers........:)

No more heart desease.............Jaey Hoa!...............:D

[xephyr]

Thank you :) I am glad not everyone is ignorant...

The only correction I would like to make is that idols were **never **considered Gods in Hinduism. Some Hindus with peripheral understanding of Hinduism might have incorrectly thought so, but thats not different than a Muslim mis-understanding Islam or a Christian mis-understanding Christianity.

Well said.

[afishcurry]

Re: We are all hindus now: NewsWeek

I kept saying as Vivekanad mentioned it's worship through idol nto worship of idol.. he had a very nice analogy that when you teach some students concept of any subject for the first time pictorial representataion helps.. once student si expert at things you can talk wihtou aid of any such symbols and he would still understand.. So in beginning one needs help fo that pictorial presentation in the form of idol later on once you get the gist of things you know idol is just teaching aid it's nto the knowledge per se..
Religions which bar aid of idol for worship are expecting all their belivers tohave doctorate in spiritualism since day one and that is very impractical you can;t have doctorate before learnign basic things and for that you need teaching aids .. .

[Punjabee_in_USA]

@afishcurry

Religions which bar aid of idol for worship are expecting all their belivers tohave doctorate in spiritualism since day one and that is very impractical you can;t have doctorate before learnign basic things and for that you need teaching aids .. .

That is one reason the followers of those religions are not able to think "out side the book", however illogical/ridiculous whats written in the book may be :)

[lakkis25]

One big ecological advantage USA would get from converting to Hinduism.............

All them Cows will be Holy Now..........:)

McDonalds will be out of business unless they serve vege burgers........:)

No more heart desease.............Jaey Hoa!...............:D

we don't have anything called conversion, we say it as practicing , because all humans are hindus by birth, they become muslims and christians by following them as all path leads to same god

[diwana]

@lakkis25

we don't have anything called conversion, we say it as practicing , because all humans are hindus by birth, they become muslims and christians by following them as all path leads to same god

All paths go to same God is very misleading sentence. Its a catchy sentence to show some superficial acceptance of other religions but your first part of the sentence was the give away! You claimed everyone is hindu by birth.

Off course these are very conflicting statements and nullify each other.

What I mean is a muslim, Christian or a jew is not born hindu or a born hindu is then not a hindu at all when grows up to be something else. Perhaps you need to accept or acknowledge that there is something called conversion in this regard.

In essence, you had no idea what you were typing. Someone told you or taught you and you just wrote it.

[afishcurry]

@diwana

All paths go to same God is very misleading sentence. Its a catchy sentence to show some superficial acceptance of other religions but your first part of the sentence was the give away! You claimed everyone is hindu by birth.

Off course these are very conflicting statements and nullify each other.

What I mean is a muslim, Christian or a jew is not born hindu or a born hindu is then not a hindu at all when grows up to be something else. Perhaps you need to accept or acknowledge that there is something called conversion in this regard.

In essence, you had no idea what you were typing. Someone told you or taught you and you just wrote it.

Don't accuse him for your tenuous grasp of hinduism..

Hinduis is simple you don't need to do bow to any deity you don't even need to worship.. Althogh if you want you can do thsoe things but it certainly is not required..
As logn as you follow the basic tenets of humanism which comes from following verses..

Ashtadash puraneshu vyasasya vachan dqyam
Paropakaraya punyaya papap parpidanam..

Welfare of others is sanctioned and hurting others forbidden..

What he meant by birth is that when a kid is born he is not born with any kind of bias you know the kind which professes unless someone worships in her or her way he she is bound to hell..

Kid is pure that's why a hindu.. corrution of mind is fed to him in course of time how if he worships is non-islamic or non-chrstina or non-jew way he is hell bound.. In this sense he meant everyone is born hindu meaning everyone is born without unjustifiable bias..

Then the question arises how then hinduims accepts everythign if it doesn;t accept prejudiced intolerant philopshpy of abrahmic religion which professes only they have rights to salvation.. Am sorry to disappoint that part of their religion is not sanctioned ifhinduims sanctioned that then it would nto remain hinduims it would becoem one of those many exclusivist doctrine..
Sans that exclusivism hinduims has no problem with any religion..

This is why sufis who eases on the exclusivist aspect found so much comon with bhakti movement saints and for some period they were all the same krishan and allah worshipper at the same time because they knew they are all the same and they also didn't belive in only-i-have-right-to-heaven claim..

[Arleitter]

What is above the notion of respect? Still worshiping in the sense of assuming it God himself, is not what Christians believe. But as a hinduism believer you seem to see their respect as worship. Its just that simple.

Sorry, I did not check who started thread. Even then politics should not be the part of your discussion either. You keep jumping in to Pakistan India debate here for obviously having no other point to discuss.

Thanks for trying to explain nudity and hinduism deep connection. I dont think even christians or jews would accept the amount of nudity or sexual statues or portraits related to hinduism. The historians or travelleers from west when landed on Indian subcontinent were simply ashamed of the scenes carved on temples. So you can shove the comment of Pakistani so called radiacals commnet where it belongs. You say hindus accept it. Thanks for admitting but I can bet even you would not like to show those acts to someone you might know in life. Who is bigot then?

Materialistic? So watching bunch of nude women, hiding their clothes in the lake is not materialism? That is weirdest kind of spirituality!

Ever heard of killings and harrasing of christians in the hand of hindu terrorists? Just search the info if it s news to you. There are crimes against other minoroties as well you might find in the hands of hindus. Just spend some time there.

Dude! Pieceful was meant to say India loves to and work very hard to make its neighbor divided. Indian evil role in its neighboring countries is not hidden from anyone.

state sponsored again? Anything which tells fact to you is 'state sponsored'?

I said it is not just repect but above respect means it is a divine one.

You are wrong in your assumption that westerners or historians travelled to Indian were ashamed to see these carvings.Would you pls tell me who?Those do could not understand the majestical beauty of those carvings would have scribbled dow something or some fanatical `organisms' would have said like that but not all and I have personally seen my vendors from Middle East and Europe appreciate these.Moreover,westners are marveled to see these carvings.

My spiritual thoughts are above all those materialistic thoughts and I fully understand the divine meaning in that .

  We have had so many great sages and spiritual and cultural reformers and their visions versions and directions lead us.We can not  accept the theories of Stinger weilding Jihadis and self exploding suicide bombers.

I sadi there were a few instances of riots in India and its quite natural also because it is a multi diversed country.Even Hindus had been subjected to brutal communal violence in India.But I believe all sections of Muslims are safe in India.Ofcourse our western neighbours track record is not good in that,even in safeguarding Muslims.

So what did Pakistan do in Punjab and still doing in Kashmir and other parts of India?When you lost East Pakistan,you wanted to secede Punjab from India and abetted and sponsored terrorism in Pumnjab .Just look at Punjab now.Then ongoing futile attempts in Kashmir.What a pity!!!

State sponsored lies and state sponsored facts ,both are different my friend.

[afishcurry]

Re: We are all hindus now: NewsWeek

Since when nudity of Khajuraho anywhere became hindu scripture.... those were just testimony to the liberal culture nothing more nothing less...

I would worry more about sanction of sex slavery and other aspect of slavery through right-hand-possession.. Somoen painting somethign nude in hindu majority soceity doesn't suddenly make those paiontings part of hindu theology

[diwana]

Since when nudity of Khajuraho anywhere became hindu scripture.... those were just testimony to the liberal culture nothing more nothing less...

Since when? Since the beginning!

Are you pretending to be so naive or really are?

I would worry more about sanction of sex slavery and other aspect of slavery through right-hand-possession.. Somoen painting somethign nude in hindu majority soceity doesn't suddenly make those paiontings part of hindu theology

Again you are trying to divert the question here and pretending to be naive.

I have mentioned at least twice above in this thread that this forum cannot handle the images and pictures on the temples...the religious center of hinduism and details of acts performed in these temples.

Nudity/sex goes hand in hand with hinduism. It was islamic and later christian culture that they started being aware of it and the clothings, mannerism and reactions changed.

One cannot even expect hindu gods or godesses wearing clothes to cover 'private' parts.

One of the hindu writer in India...don't remember the name at this moment openly admitted he had lustful thoughts for one of the nude Godess.

Simply google at your own risk just for the start.

The point here is that hindusm has nothing to do with other three religions to make it palatable or acceptable except few minor or less important matters.