When I see at myself and people like me who are struggling for a good life in the west, I see that I am a person who is looking for the better life. I am a person who has left his country and his family for more money and for a convenient life. I see people struggling for money. I see we don’t even go for the Jumm’a prayer for money. I see people calling themselves Muslim and selling alcohol for money. I am a person with weak Iman. When I see all these thing that how me and people like me are striving for a better life, the respect for Usama Ben Laden goes up in my eyes. Usama Ben Laden, A true mujahid of the century. He gave up his luxury life for the sake of Islam. He gave up his palace type bungalows for the sake of Islam, He gave up his luxury Porsche type cars for the sake of Islam, He gave up his a millionaire type of life style for the sake of Islam. In my eyes, he was a True Mujahid and He IS a true Mujahid. I would not care what the western Media and “Western Slaves” say about him. These “Western Slaves” would say any thing against Muslims and Muslim legends to make their masters Happy. These “Western Slaves” have been trying to make their masters happy for centuries and they would keep trying to make their masters happy for the centuries in the future too. I would not care if a person badmouths about the Legend of the Islam, “Usama Ben Laden” just to keep his/her masters happy or make his/her inside happy. He was a Legend and He IS a legend. He was a Mujahid and He is a Mujahid.
I live my life, I care my own, I speak my mind, I make minds. (“Copy and Paste commands have created a group of people who think that they are intellectual. Congratulations to these “copy and paste” scholars”, Well… thanks to Bill Gates.) I live my life, I care my own, I speak my mind, I make minds.
You are right of course. If following the guidelines of Qur'an and Sunnah makes someone a bad muslim, then we are living in strange times indeed. Osama Bin Laden is a Mujahid who fought to liberate Afghanistan, and in doing so put his safety and wealth at risk. It is interesting to observe the nature of those who jump to criticise him. There have been many allegations that he is an agent of the west but no proof has been forthcoming, so it is all just evil speculation which we should shun.
Great Mujahid indeed!!!Who wants to kill innocent people in the world. what a wonderful example of jihad has he given us by killings hundreds of innocent people in kenya.What a protection of islam.
Usama bin WhO??? Oh, the guy who is opening schools for little girls in Afghanistan, and building hospitals to treat sick. Indeed, he is a mujahid. Every muslim should be like him. In fact many are.
Great. A person who has given up the life of a millionaire to put his life on the line for fellow muslims who are not even of the same race as him, and you have seen fit to pour scorn on him. Compare his lack of racism with your own. In one of the other forums you recommended that a muslim girl should marry a kafir on the basis both were from Punjab, despite the fact that it is expressly forbidden in the Qur'an. So what if they are both from Punjab? In Punjab you can find decent men and women and you can also find pimps and prostitutes.
Perhaps you don't agree with the Qur'anic injunction against this type of "marriage"? Do you recommend inter-faith between Ahmedi women and Christian men for example? Is it recommended in Mirzai teachings? Does this mean that they and their offspring could sit down and enjoy a "christian" meal of pork chops, for example?
Please do enlighten. I am most interested in learning if Mirzais are as relaxed in their attitude to this question with regards to Mirzayanis as they are to orthox muslims.
Usamah bin Ladin! Mujahid. Bayshaq! May Allah give us all strength of imaan like he has. Leaving a billiona dollars wealth to live in the mountains and face Soviet tanks, bombs, gas etc. for his religion. Subhan Allah.
It doesn't surprise me that the qadiyani kaafirs dont like him: they will support their fellow Western kaafirs and their kaafir media. Remember Huzoor Pur Noor sal Allahu alayhi wa sallam said that kufr is one system. So the qadiyaanis being themselves KAAFIRS Will obviously sport other kaafirs.
Mujahid Usamah DENIES the attack on the embassies in Kenya and no evidence has been shown otherwise. QED.
Usama Ben Laden, a true Legend and a true Mujahid.
MY
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I am A Muslim and it is my choice to choose my hero.
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Usama Ben Laden has not claimed any killing in any where in the World.
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I would believe in a Mujahid zillion times more than in non-Muslim people's wrong statements.
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Allegations against this legend have been spread by the Western Media. "Western Slaves" picked up bits and pieces against this legend from that western media. Western media could be a true source of information for these "Western Slave" but to me, the good source of information is my MIND because I have one
I live my life, I care my own, I speak my mind, I make minds. ("Copy and Paste commands have created a group of people who think that they are intellectual. Congratulations to these "copy and paste" scholars", Well… thanks to Bill Gates.) I live my life, I care my own, I speak my mind, I make minds.
[This message has been edited by msaqibj (edited April 21, 1999).]
You picked that news again from the Western Media, did not you?
I live my life, I care my own, I speak my mind, I make minds. ("Copy and Paste commands have created a group of people who think that they are intellectual. Congratulations to these "copy and paste" scholars", Well… thanks to Bill Gates.) I live my life, I care my own, I speak my mind, I make minds.
Wao man. You are really mixing a lot of issues here. The moderator lets you do that? What did you send him? Sweets? I will try to response to issues you raised, even though some of those issue belong in separate discussions.
You called my views about Bin Laden "racist".
Do I hate Bin Laden because he is of a different race than I am? No.
Do I hate him because I think that he is a terrorist? Yes.
Do you still think that my views are racist? Your call.
Then you go on to discuss my views about inter-racial inter-faith marriages (a separate issue altogether). Since you asked, I will tell you what I feel. I support such marriages, how can you call me a 'racist' then? It is beyond me. You are full of contradictions. It is not me whose views should be labeled 'racist, it should be the teachings that forbid inter-racial marriages. Hey, Jinnah (Quid-e-Azam) was married to someone outside of his faith. Does that make him a bad person? You also mention pimps and prostitute (irrelevant issue again). I have nothing against "pimps' and "prostitutes', they are people just like you and I. The only thing about prostitution that bothers me is that a sexually frustrated MAN can go to a woman to satisfy his sexual needs. Women don't have the same luxury. Too sad. There should be equal opportunities for both.
You want to know about "Mirzayanis " marrying non-Ahmadi men. Hopefully some practicing Ahmadi will talk in detail about that issue. I can give you my views (which are totally mine and are no reflection of Ahmadiya views). You are being very presumptuous again. What gives a MAN a right to tell a WOMEN whom she can marry. Simply because a man is born with an extra piece of meat between his legs, does not entitle him to make decisions for women. As far as my views are concerned Mirzayanis can marry any Man they choose. Ahmadi men can marry any women (of any faith) they want, as long as a man is not marrying an underage girl. Then it becomes child molestation issue.
You also mentioned about pork chops (yum, delicious). There are no such meals as Christian or Muslim. I do like my occasional Ham sandwich (I prefer Canadian over Swiss), just like Jinnah did. Hey, eat what tastes good.
No i do not have any more questions for you, your answers are just fine. I am certainly interested in what your Mirzai friends will have to say on your views though. Please feel free to ignore my posts in the future.
"Usama Ben Laden, A True Legen, A True Mujahid"
This is the topic of this thread?
If some one thinks that he is not a Legend, then should I care?
My answer is BIG NO
Brother, why r you wasting your time debating with these mirzai infidels? They are biggest kaafirs in the world and will definitely burn in the Hellfire. Why do you get surprised at their kufr answer--what do you expect from kaafirs?
Asslam-u-Alaikum My dear Brother Asif:
Dear Brother, I take your kind advice and here I say that I am not into any religious debate with any one and I would not be.
thanks for your kindness.
May Allah give all of us the true understanding of Islam.
I live my life, I care my own, I speak my mind, I make minds. ("Copy and Paste commands have created a group of people who think that they are intellectual. Congratulations to these "copy and paste" scholars", Well… thanks to Bill Gates.) I live my life, I care my own, I speak my mind, I make minds.
NY Ahmadi: Do you always have to bring Jinnah into your arguments. Do you think that bringing Jinnah into your arguments will strengthen them? Just because Jinnah, according to some historians, did certain things, does not make them acceptable. He was not a God. Pakistani's may sympathize with him, but most realize that he did make mistakes, his actions will be judged by God, as will ours.
I consider myself a pretty liberal person. But after reading your posts I realize how I may not be ** so ** liberal. Your liberal values seem to be more akin to those of Howard Stern or Marylin Manson's. You have no problems with prostitution, other than the fact that women cannot access the services of prostitutes (which they actually can if they wish). I think prostitution is something, which should worry us all. When our children or our neighbors children are forced to sell their flesh to survive we should be concerned. When they are taken advantage of by their pimps, when they are raped, when their innocence is taken away from them, we should be concerned. Prostitution is a form of abuse. Prostitutes don't willingly choose their profession, they do so to survive.
Why is child molestation an issue for you? Prostitution doesn't seem to pose a problem. The fact that prostitutes are under-age seems to have escaped your thought process.
You write, "...pork chops (yum, delicious). There are no such meals as Christian or Muslim." Actually there are such meals. Next time you go to the supermarket look for Kosher meat - its prepared by a Jew, look for Halal meat - its prepared by a Muslim. If your flying on a plane ask kindly for a Jewish or Muslim meal, or Hindu meal even, you'll be provided with one. For Christian food, there may not be anything available in the supermarket. Because capitalism is the religion of the West. Beakless chickens, steroid pumped cows, stunned with a shot gun and sliced and diced with machine blades is what you'll find. No respect for the sanctity of life there.
Osama Bin Laden is definitely a charismatic figure today; but, under his leadership - scores & hundreds of innocent people have died. Osama Bin Laden reminds me of the blind cleric: Sheikh Abdur Rehman, who was arrested in New York for bombings & other terrorists acts.
Where the hell did you appear from? You are very quick to response to me or others like me who "bust" chops of people like "Mr. Xtreme". My response was for Mr. Xtreme, because that's what he wanted to hear. Can you see (you can't!!!) how he addressed me "Dear Porky", but that flew right by your "pea sized brains" and you took my response and started to analyze it from your "fanatic" perspective. That's OK. It was expected.
You say: "Do you always have to bring Jinnah into your arguments"
When was the last time I mentioned Jinnah in my arguments? I think Jinnah was a fine man and a brilliant lawyer. His eating pork has nothing to do with his ability to be a leader. He was a great leader.
My views about prostitution, if you like we can discuss that in a separate thread. You are right to say that it does cause a problem in society. In my opinion, it only becomes a problem when it is not legalized. Abuse and rapes of women is not just an issue confronted by prostitutes, but women all over the world.
You say: ", his (Jinnah) actions will be judged by God, as will ours."
I can never agree more with anyone!!
My story about pork was a response to Mr. Xtreme. I stand by my arguments about it. Pork is forbidden in all western religions, not just Islam.
I would appreciate your thoughts about the kind of stuff Mr. Xtreme has been sharing with us here.
I hope that you are enjoying your time away from Guppshup. I am off for two weeks to Venezuela for business. I will look forward to your response here. While you do that , lets hear your views about Bin Laden (isn't that what this post all about?)
Ok a few different topics of discussion here, none of which are relevant to the topic, we can start separate threads in appropriate forums if you wish.
1) Actually I did see how Mr. Xtreme addressed you as "Mr. Porky". What do you want me to say? Chastise him for his behavior. Learn to defend yourself. If your going to offend others, be prepared to be offended in return. Mr. Xtreme did not say anything in this post, which I found needed a response from me. From what I've read of Mr. Xtreme so far, I think his posts are a valuable contribution to this forum.
2) I never said Jinnah was not a great leader, I merely questioned your use of Jinnah in your post. You obviously use your historical caricature of Jinnah to support your idiocy. Knowing full well that Pakistanis admire Jinnah you use him to justify actions which are unjustified by Islamic standards. If you wish to say Jinnah did not practice Islam in certain aspects of his life that's fine. But you want others to believe that since Jinnah did not gravitate to certain Islamic ideals, its ok to stray, your wrong. And nobody is buying your argument.
3) Legalizing prostitution is a topic, which deserves a thread of its own. Legalizing prostitution maybe a debatable solution for Western societies. But for those living in regions with strong cultural and religious beliefs, in particular in relation to the role which women play in society, legalizing prostitution will not be the panacea to a much more complex problem.
4) Bin Laden: I really don't know enough about the man to comment. Weather he is guilty or not of the bombings on the embassies in Africa has not been decided by any court of law. He has been presumed guilty by many - a direct violation of his rights by American standards. He is a freedom fighter, a label given to men like him by the US government during their campaign to rid Afghanistan of Russia. Bin Laden was a mujahideen - mujahideen's according the US government at the time, were not Islamic fighters, but freedom fighters. His goal is to rid the Muslim world of foreign influence. Its a goal I don't support. I think it is an impossible task and furthermore, a policy of isolation in the global context of the world will hurt more than benefit. I am not a fan of imperialism and in this respect I share his contentions regarding the effects of imperialists in the developing world.
Have fun in Venezuela. I'm back at GupShup for a few weeks (using my brothers internet account), than I'm off as well.
I took the news from western media, but if you take the news from afghani or mualvi media then of course you will have these believes. How about killing americans in Saudia Arabia by a bomb, a few years ago. Beleive me I have no sympathy or favor for Americans but I do have sympathy for innocent people. No body should be killes an american or pakistani ot others.