USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

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within a week of the re-election of President Obama 700,000 americans have petitioned the white house for texas to secede from the USA and 20 other states have followed suit ( 700,000 Americans petition the White House to secede from the US — RT ) in 2011 former Soviet Union President Mikhail Gorbachev spoke at Lafayette College and likened the unrest in the US to what he witnessed before the dissolution of the USSR, Gorbachev felt America needed its own *perestroika *( Gorbachev wants perestroika for America — RT )–a drastic change.

Do you think we are on the brink of witnessing the dissolution of the USA? do you the US is headed for the same fate as the former USSR? Is Obama the American Gorbachev ( Is Obama an American Gorbachev? - English pravda.ru )?

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

haathii girte girte bhii waqt letaa hai...shaayad ham meN se koii bhii zinda na rahegaa yeh sab dekhne ke liye. Russia economically kabhii superower nahiiN thaa...don't compare Russia with the US...think about it's collapse? no country will be spared from seeing the doomsday of it's economy. the US has Middle East money that can last a generation! :D arab sheiKh pahle nange hoNge amrika se lol

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

I think you shouldn't make too much of this. Such fallacy ignites stupid hearsay.

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

USSR was a conglomerate of various geographic countries when it came to languages, ethnic groups, religions - shackled together by a communist dictatorship. the US isn't anything of that sort.

as for gorbachev, his successor yeltsin drank a lot of vodka and slept through a few years before handing the country over to soviet spymaster putin who runs it like his personal fiefdom. so much for perstroika and glasnost.

and 700,000? more people voted for a petition to legalize pot, in just colorado.

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

i just created this thread for discussion purposes …yeesh! :cb:

what if it did happen what if the other states seceded …what would the implications be

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

If Texas did secede it would default on its debt payments. Thus, a bankrupt state, would be forced to leave the dollar which would numerous issues in itself.

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

  1. 700,000 is roughly 0.2% of the US. Not gonna happen. The United States were originally supposed to be a confederation, a loose confederation, modeled after the Native Americans. The last two hundred years have been about bringing the States under Federal control.

  2. The USSR was undermined mostly by economics...and stupidity. Due to unbelievable laziness, the Soviets relied on the CIA's numbers about the estimates of their economy. The CIA grossly overestimated the strength of the USSR, and the Soviets believed them. Incredibly stupid. It didn't help that central planning was not viable for an economy at that time. It may be possible today, with computers having advanced so much, but certainly not 20-30 years ago.

  3. People who talk about the US economy like to throw around vague terms but have no real insight on the situation. The American economy is shrinking, as is the world economy, because of the nominal value that finance has created in the past decade. After the return to equilibrium America will still be the largest economy in the world. At worst, they will closely trail, or be tied with, China. Their superpower status may be shrinking, but they will not be docile. I hate to break it to the TTP lovers on these forums but the US will probably be a dominant country 100 years from now. The only way to "get back" at them is through success. But of course, that requires listening to progressives and moderates, people other than molvi saab.

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill by Jang and some Pakistani news papers. Its a non issue here in west and US and will remain a non issue for foreseeable future.

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It was in news here but it's not going to happen. Quebec wanted to be a separate nation for years. That did not happen. This is not going to happen either.

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

I sometimes wonder if wishes were horses. People here are forgetting on how the doom of US would affect their own countries. Pakistan would loose millions/Billions in aid. China would loose its market. The world would loose its power to innovate... etc
I know the last statement would not go down well with so many of the posters here. Just a question. How much of innovation has happened outside of the US in the last 10 years.

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

But I I hv heared that some abt 15 to 25 thousand ppl are needed to file a petition on this issue of a seperate state(pardon me if I'm wrong with the number)and thousands of ppl hv already signed the petition on the day first this issue started....becuz they aren't happy Obama being the president again,and they think that his current policies are continuation of Bush's Govt !

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

it's 700,000 just in texas ....a petition has to have 25,000 signatures within a month before an official response is required from the adminsitration... (a response not necessarily granting of the request :p)

similarly california has been wanting to secede for forever and its not happened yet

like i said before a petition has to have 25,000 signatures within a month before an official response is required from the adminsitration...

but a response doesnt necesarrily mean their request to secede will be granted

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

whether the states are allowed to secede or not ...it is still interesting that 20 out of the 50 states have expressed the desire to secede (thats like 40% of the states :p) even as a symbolic gesture it speaks volumes don't you think

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

Texas and California would go bankrupt in a second if they were to secede. So it's not gonna happen.

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

well don't know about California but according to the article Texas has the ability to break off as its "economy is building up faster than any other states, ...] it's the only one with it's own power grid [and] texas has followed through with its threats to secede twice before [in history]" + it houses a quarter of USA's oil reserves and a third of the national gas reserves...

for me though it's the symbolic gesture of 20 states submitting petitions saying they don't want to be a part of the united states of america anymore that is more interesting...regardless of whether they secede or not

we're really just discussing hypothetical situations so its interesting to think about how it would affect the US if all 20 states that have petitioned ended up seceding (and we assumed that they were self sufficient enough to survive)

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

If you look at it another way, isn't this FANTASTIC that states are allowed to separate in civilized manner. We can not think of this in Pakistan, India or many Eastern countries. Thousands will get killed if it has to come to separation in eastern countries.

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

Time to apply for the Texan citizenship. ;)

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

It’s just that those people, living in the Fox News bubble, were so sure that Romney was gonna win ( they kept saying that with their own analysis that he would by a landslide), that they are shell shocked. It’s pretty much the people that still don’t want a black President who want to secede. Look at the states Romney won in the election. he pretty much won the entire confederate :slight_smile:

Confederate States of America - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They still want their slavery and white supremacy.

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

Regarding innovation, education is a trickle down effect. America's economies might be shrinking but its universities are still amongst the best in the world. Investment is certainly down in America, so the next 20-30 years might tell a different story, but your point is still valid about the last decade.

As for the economy, that's an excellent point. After the East Asian economic crisis in the late 90's, America's consumption made up for the shrinking in the world economy. Now that the American bubble has burst, the whole world is feeling it.

My apologies I didn't see that it was just Texas. To be fair though, that's Fox News country. Even if by some miracle the US government allowed a state to secede, I hope those people remember how America deals with "hostile" countries. Economic sanctions and trade barriers would likely follow to teach the state a lesson.

This actually happened in the 30's as well. Some governor decided to declare sovereignty over his state, until the federal government reminded him how ridiculous it was. Still, I would like to see it happen just to see right wingers get a taste of how their government spread democracy to the world.

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Re: USA headed to the fate of USSR? Obama the American Gorbachev?

i don't think this is true. it is like 24,000 something from texas.