Uncivilized ---- ?

Terry Jones
Saturday March 31, 2007

Guardian

I share the outrage expressed in the British press over the treatment of our Naval personnel accused by Iran of illegally entering their waters. It is a disgrace. We would never dream of treating captives like this - allowing them to smoke cigarettes, for example, even though it has been proven that smoking kills. And as for compelling poor servicewoman Faye Turney to wear a
black headscarf, and then allowing the picture to be posted around the world - have the Iranians no concept of civilised behaviour? For God’s sake, what’s wrong with putting a bag over her head? That’s what we do with the Muslims we capture: we put bags over their heads, so it’s hard to breathe.
Then it’s perfectly acceptable to take photographs of them and circulate them to the press because the captives can’t be recognised and humiliated in the way these unfortunate British service people are.

It is also unacceptable that these British captives should be made to talk on television and say things that they may regret later. If the Iranians put duct tape over their mouths, like we do to our captives, they wouldn’t be able to talk at all. Of course they’d probably find it even harder to breathe - especially with a bag over their head - but at least they wouldn’t be humiliated.

And what’s all this about allowing the captives to write letters home saying they are all right? It’s time the Iranians fell into line with the rest of the civilised world: they should allow their captives the privacy of solitary confinement. That’s one of the many privileges the US grants to its captives in Guantánamo Bay.

The true mark of a civilised country is that it doesn’t rush into charging people whom it has arbitrarily arrested in places it’s just invaded. The inmates of Guantánamo, for example, have been enjoying all the privacy they want for almost five years, and the first inmate has only just been charged. What a contrast to the disgraceful Iranian rush to parade their captives before the cameras!

What’s more, it is clear that the Iranians are not giving their British
prisoners any decent physical exercise. The US military make sure that their Iraqi captives enjoy PT. This takes the form of exciting “stress positions”, which the captives are expected to hold for hours on end so as to improve their stomach and calf muscles. A common exercise is where they are made to
stand on the balls of their feet and then squat so that their thighs are parallel to the ground. This creates intense pain and, finally, muscle failure. It’s all good healthy fun and has the bonus that the captives will confess to anything to get out of it.

And this brings me to my final point. It is clear from her TV appearance that servicewoman Turney has been put under pressure. The newspapers have persuaded behavioural psychologists to examine the footage and they all conclude that she is “unhappy and stressed”.

What is so appalling is the underhand way in which the Iranians have got her “unhappy and stressed”. She shows no signs of electrocution or burn marks and there are no signs of beating on her face. This is unacceptable. If captives are to be put under duress, such as by forcing them into compromising sexual positions, or having electric shocks to their genitals,
they should be photographed, as they were in Abu Ghraib. The photographs should then be circulated around the civilised world so that everyone can see exactly what has been going on.

As Stephen Glover pointed out in the Daily Mail, perhaps it would not be right to bomb Iran in retaliation for the humiliation of our servicemen, but clearly the Iranian people must be made to suffer - whether by beefing up sanctions, as the Mail suggests, or simply by getting President Bush to hurry up and invade, as he intends to anyway, and bring democracy and western values to the country, as he has in Iraq.

Re: Uncivilized ---- ?

wow… a western newspaper actually published this :eek:

well at least somone has the balls to speak the truth.

Re: Uncivilized ---- ?

the article cheetah wrote all very sarcastic !

Re: Uncivilized ---- ?

I never write article... i just mention a different point of view which is prevalent in the world especially in europe and states...

I believe that we should have a patience to hear other's different/opposite point of view and should be able to takes the good out of these point of views without feeling any shame...

Lastly i don't believe argumentation is ever going to change anyone's opinion.. thats why i try not to get into it and waste my time... i do try to take the good where i find it no matter who says it.

No offense to anyone.

Re: Uncivilized ---- ?

The whole thing was a show and you guys are actually eating it up. Do you think Iran allowed Iraqi POW's to play ping-pong during the Iran-Iraq war in the 80's?

Thank allah Iran had photographers there to take photos of the British playing games and laughing or else the world would never know how kind and gentle Iran is, but clearly this is proof positive of that. Maybe Iran should open up a resort for soldiers seeing their hospitality is so grand. Hunt down some political prisoners Iran is holding and I'm sure they can verify that this is all typical protocol and such treatment is quite normal and any claim that these images were taken for propaganda purposes is pure hogwash.

Re: Uncivilized ---- ?

you know if you guys started letting people be confined in rooms instead of chicken coops and allowed them to keep their dignity, even if for show, people might actually give you credit for that too.

Re: Uncivilized ---- ?

^
I'm all for that my friend, U.S. treatment of some enemy combatants should be criticize. But let's realize that the Iranian treatment of the 15 Brit's was a pure show and nothing more. I mean ping-pong, come on, a bit over the top wouldn't you say?

Re: Uncivilized ---- ?

i figure they were kept better than Iraqi POWs would've been kept, although Im not sure if the motivation is show as much as it might've been minimizing fallout and dodging accusations of mistreatment. though image management is definitely an aim, but why is that bad?

Re: Uncivilized ---- ?

It's like the U.S. rolling out video showing Iraqi POW dinning on a 7 course meal, it really wouldn't mean anything because everyone would know it's for show yet we have writers writing articles based on this footage provided by Iran and using as if it's real and it seems that they have successfully found an audience willing to fall for it.

Instead of basing an article of the footage Iran has shown why not use the images of what the captives claim was done to them, that being that "they were blindfolded, kept in isolation and lined up against a wall while guards cocked guns behind their heads, making the prisoners think they were about to be shot". I guess if the writer uses the real images instead of the scripted ones created by Iran then he loses his political point and an easy article just got a lot harder to write.

Re: Uncivilized ---- ?

yeah the author is contrasting the best treatment with the worst reported treatment from iran and US, however even if you contrast the worst with the worst there isnt any comparison, and the author would still have his political point.

blindcuffing, isolation and this very mild psychological manipulation is very different in culpability from "torture-lite".